This is getting a little ridiculous.

[Portugal]

Pride flags should only be flown by the individual or organization. Not by a government entity.

That was exactly what I was trying to say only way easier to understand, and much shorter. If only I could write properly.

Anyways, I fail to understand why vacationers would refuse to go to some town because they didn't put up a gay pride flag.

 

[Brighteye]

And this is a classic case of mistaking culture for history. There are gay people in Truro, that is a fact, and they are valuable members of the community, just like all the other segments of society that make up the town. There is ample opportunity all throughout the year to celebrate the old heritage and history of Truro, but it doesn't get diminished one iota if you also celebrate people that are living, working and improving Truro right at this very moment.

But why not fly flags to show our diversity within our unity? Truth be told, Truro can be a bit of a difficult place for a gay person to live.
Flying a flag to show respect for a part of the community like that shows that the town IS united behind all of the members of its community.

There is ample opportunity all through the year to respect gays, since as you said, gay Truronians will still be around. It doesn't get diminished by using the flagpole to help build pride in something of which everyone can be proud.

Every time the council flies a flag that doesn't cover everyone, it's marginalising someone. I think it quite symbolic that they fly the national flag (or perhaps a regional one, if there is one). It's not drawing distinctions: it's pledging themselves to one concern, and that concern is all of us.

 

[Atlas14]

Just how much do you think it costs to buy and raise a nylon flag? I think the city of truro can afford the $6.99 or get the pride society to donate one. And it doesn't really take that much time or resources to put one up every week (even if truro were actually big enough to be that diverse). Still don't get the big deal....

The precedent the gay flag flying sets is not a $6.99 set amount...mullet pride, hunter's pride, left-handed pride, its all just nonsense. The government doesn't need to be appealing to special interest groups lin this manner, there are bigger issues.

All you have to do to be italian, lebanese or chinese is be born, yet we see flags for them flown on special occasions. What's the difference exactly? There's a community in Truro that would like to be recognized one week a year, so why not? They are a part of the community like anyone else, the only difference being is that they are singled out for having certain sexual preferences. In a town like Truro with a very traditional and christian background, where you're more like to get nasty looks for holding hands with someone of the same sex, wouldn't it be nice to go downtown once a year and see that the city council supports your right to live there?

They can realize the city council supports their right to live there by flying a gay pride flag on their own house, and realizing that it is not going to be taken down any time soon. Acceptance doesn't come from the flying of flags, it comes from speech, actions, and intentions.

Good to know gay rights don't mean more that a few dollars to you....!

Huh? If I wanted people to accept my German heritage and share in my pride, why on earth would I fly a German-American looking flag on town council's door?

The idea of flying a gay pride flag by the order of the town council is laughable. It is unecessary, and in my opinion shows favoritism.

 

[Che Guava]

Looks like at least someone is flying the pride flag in Truro. THank you county mayor Mike Smith (link)

Anyways, I fail to understand why vacationers would refuse to go to some town because they didn't put up a gay pride flag.

More liekly because of the motives around it. The Mayor had stated that he didn't want to Truro to "endorse gay pride" and quoted Bible verse for his justification. Guess it turned a few people off...

 

[Goonie]

Oh no! These hordes of flags will devour us all!!!

I still don't get what is the big deal! Fly a different flag every day of the year: it doesn't cost much, doesn't hurt anyone, and it demonstrates a city's appreciation of its diversity...

What happens when all the days of the year are filled and you have causes competing for a spot on the flag pole?

Government should provide all citizens with the same treatment. Gays have all the rights and services that are offered by the government in Canada and Nova Scotia. Gays, nor any other group of citizens, should expect extraordinary treatment of any kind unless it is vital to that group's preservation, culture, or lifestyle. A flag hardly fits that description.

 

[Che Guava]

There is ample opportunity all through the year to respect gays, since as you said, gay Truronians will still be around. It doesn't get diminished by using the flagpole to help build pride in something of which everyone can be proud.

I guess I think of tolerance towards gays as something that a community could take pride in, but I uderstand thats probably more of a personal beleif. Again, if Truro had a festival to celebrate its scottish heritage and flew the Saint Andrew's Cross for a week, wouldn't that be excluding a lot of people as well? Bet folks wouldn't get as upset though....

Every time the council flies a flag that doesn't cover everyone, it's marginalising someone. I think it quite symbolic that they fly the national flag (or perhaps a regional one, if there is one). It's not drawing distinctions: it's pledging themselves to one concern, and that concern is all of us.

I guess I come from the viewpoint that gays and lesbians are marginalized on a daily basis in Truro. If flying a flag for one week a year helps break that down a bit, I say go for it...

The precedent the gay flag flying sets is not a $6.99 set amount...mullet pride, hunter's pride, left-handed pride, its all just nonsense. The government doesn't need to be appealing to special interest groups lin this manner, there are bigger issues.

Putting gay pride in the same catagory as mullets, hunters and lefties is a bit of a stretch, IMHO, but I'll take it as dramatic hyperbole. Integrating gays into a community where life can be difficult for them is a big issue, and one that Truro should be thinking more about.

They can realize the city council supports their right to live there by flying a gay pride flag on their own house, and realizing that it is not going to be taken down any time soon. Acceptance doesn't come from the flying of flags, it comes from speech, actions, and intentions.

Then why bother flying the Canadian flag, if it's speech, actions, and intentionsthat count? Being able to fly at flag at your own house is the most minimal right a person can have when it comes to expression. If Truro wants to be serious about actions and intentions when it comes to gay pride, then it can show that it is not afraid to support the gay community by flying thier flag.

Huh? If I wanted people to accept my German heritage and share in my pride, why on earth would I fly a German-American looking flag on town council's door?

Why not? It would raise awareness of your heritage, get people talking, and maybe get them thinking about thier own heritage. And it is that much more meaningful if it is flown by town council, instead of a single person's home.

The idea of flying a gay pride flag by the order of the town council is laughable. It is unecessary, and in my opinion shows favoritism.

The idea of a mayor justifying it by quoting the bible is pretty laughable to me, and shows some favouratism towards Truro's religious majority, but as long as minorities don't get special treatment....

Gays, nor any other group of citizens, should expect extraordinary treatment of any kind unless it is vital to that group's preservation, culture, or lifestyle. A flag hardly fits that description.

I guess that is where our opinions differ: flying a flag to me is a strong show of support for the rights and lives of the people it represents. In a town that has problems with homophobia, it can do a lot for teh preservation of that community, even if it just encourages queer folk to stay.

 

[Brighteye]

I guess I think of tolerance towards gays as something that a community could take pride in, but I uderstand thats probably more of a personal beleif. Again, if Truro had a festival to celebrate its scottish heritage and flew the Saint Andrew's Cross for a week, wouldn't that be excluding a lot of people as well? Bet folks wouldn't get as upset though....

If flying the gay flag should give everyone pride because it shows that everyone is tolerant of gays, why not just fly the national flag, because it's something that gays can have pride in too?
Why have a special gay pride flag when gays can be proud of being Canadian too? Surely a Canadian flag is also a gay pride flag, and a straight pride flag, and, in fact, a Canadian pride flag?
Personally I would find it a bit odd if my local council started flying German or Italian flags. I'm not mentioning the Scottish one, because I would fly it on St. Andrew's day, what with Scotland being part of the Union and all...
Of course, Oxford City Council doesn't have a flagpole, since it's trapped behind BHS and over the top of Jessops.

 

[bathsheba666]

They can realize the city council supports their right to live there by flying a gay pride flag on their own house, and realizing that it is not going to be taken down any time soon. Acceptance doesn't come from the flying of flags, it comes from speech, actions, and intentions.

Sad to say; in the bastion of democracy that is britain, you need council approval to fly a flag from your home...

...although this is occasionally overlooked...

 

[Patroklos]

Do the satan worshipers get a flag? How about the Scientologists? What happens if the Gay Pride crowd and the Neo Nazis want to celebrate on the same day?

 

[Atlas14]

Putting gay pride in the same catagory as mullets, hunters and lefties is a bit of a stretch, IMHO, but I'll take it as dramatic hyperbole. Integrating gays into a community where life can be difficult for them is a big issue, and one that Truro should be thinking more about.

They aren't integrated already? Seeing a flag being waved by the town council that shoves pride of one's own sexuality in your face isn't the best way to gain acceptance. It just isn't.

Then why bother flying the Canadian flag, if it's speech, actions, and intentionsthat count? Being able to fly at flag at your own house is the most minimal right a person can have when it comes to expression. If Truro wants to be serious about actions and intentions when it comes to gay pride, then it can show that it is not afraid to support the gay community by flying thier flag.

The town council can announce its support of the gay community in other ways than flying a flag. Heck, they could actually even show or gain support for the gays by holding town meetings and perhaps debates regarding the issue and any larger issues pertaining to being gay. There doesn't need to be an "in your face" gay pride flag that pisses naysayers off anymore than they might already be. They (whoever is anti-gay whatever) probably aren't too happy there are gays in their town to begin with, so the flag just makes it worse.

Why not? It would raise awareness of your heritage, get people talking, and maybe get them thinking about thier own heritage. And it is that much more meaningful if it is flown by town council, instead of a single person's home.

Because I personally am proud of my heritage, but I don't expect anybody else to be proud for me or with me. If somebody has an issue with Germans or German-Americans, then flying a flag in town council isn't going to do the trick of gaining acceptance.

The idea of a mayor justifying it by quoting the bible is pretty laughable to me, and shows some favouratism towards Truro's religious majority, but as long as minorities don't get special treatment....

The bible-quotes come across as meaningless when it is quite obvious what the town council's intent of particular favoratism is. Gay people can be religious.

 

[Che Guava]

All right: one more post here and then I think I'll have said all that I can here...

To me, flying a pride flag during pride week (or even just pride day) sends the following message: "We, as a town, accept gays and lesbians as a part of our community and recognize thier right to follow thier lifestyle within our community" Nothing in-your-face, nothing implying this group is better than another, nothing against those that prefer to make other personal choices. Just acceptance.

And I think that acceptance is the key word here, instead of tolerance. Tolerance means putting up with something, even if you don't want to. Every town in Canada tolerates homosexuals. They have to: its in our human rights code. Acceptance, to me, means that the community, and more importantly its representatives, accepts gays and lesbians into thier community, shows a commitment to live and let live with thier lifestyle, and that discriminating against them, regardless of personal beleifs, is wrong, not just illegal.

The rest of it (i.e. actually having discussions, protecting the rights and safety of homosexuals, etc) is of course of tantamount importance, but a symbolic gesture like this is really the bare minimum when it comes to real acceptance. Truro may tolerate neo-nazis, scientologists, or satan-worshippers, but it should ACCEPT gays and lesbians, and it should make no secret of it. FLying a flag in the middle of town does that to a T.

OTOH, maybe the Truro gov't/community only really does tolerate gays, and trying to force them to accept something they don't want around them is wrong. But there does seem to be more than a few in town that would disagree, and a few people from out of town that might change thier travel plans bcause of it. I guess that's thier choice...

 

[Atlas14]

Well if the gays within the town need that brief symbol to feel accepted, despite it being put up by people that accepted their presence and contributions to the town in the first place, maybe it should be put up. If for no other reason than to appease them.

There are individuals in my town that probably hate me as a person, but I'm not going to ask the peeps at the town council, who I feel already accept me as a person for living here, to put up a ProudToBeAtlas flag.

Just my opinion I guess

 

[Leonel]

I never understood the pride about sexual orientation thing to me. If I'm to understand the biology of it, it sounds like a trivial thing to be proud of. It feels like saying "I'm left-handed and I'm PROUD! Left-handed pride parades for anyone!"

 

[Catharsis]

I suppose it's as much as celebration of being able to celebrate as of being homosexual. A Left-Handed Pride parade might be looked upon as trivial because left-handers (and this might not be true) haven't been persecuted in the past.

 

[Che Guava]

I never understood the pride about sexual orientation thing to me. If I'm to understand the biology of it, it sounds like a trivial thing to be proud of. It feels like saying "I'm left-handed and I'm PROUD! Left-handed pride parades for anyone!"

ok..one more, just for good measure...

Ever get insulted in the street for being a lefty? Ever get told that you are less than human because of it? Ever wake up to anti-lefty graffitti on your front door and fear for your safety because you've been identified to others as a lefty?

The reason that it is different is because it matters to people, just like race or gender does. You're right: it shouldn't matter any more than any other trivial genetic difference, but to a lot of people, it does (and I'm not talking about gays themselves right here, although that is another issue). When discrimination of gays and lesbians is a thing of the past (and we're not there yet) I don't think they'll be much need for pride flags and festivals. But in the meantime, its an important reminder that people are different in a lot of ways, and the more we get comfortable with the diversity of people around us, the less likely we are to hate them for no good reason.

ok, done, I promise....

 

[Leonel]

I suppose it's as much as celebration of being able to celebrate as of being homosexual. A Left-Handed Pride parade might be looked upon as trivial because left-handers (and this might not be true) haven't been persecuted in the past.

Actually I think left-handers have been persecuted in the past before as possessed by the devil or the left hand was considered unclean something to that effect.

 

[Catharsis]

Yes, I do seem to remember being told something about that, actually. Che explained it better, though: if there was any anti-southpaw feeling, it certainly isn't a problem today (a few not-very-good comedians, perhaps, excepted). Homosexuality is still a major issue in politics, religion, etc.

 

[CartesianFart]

I am kinda curious to know why aimeeandbeatles starts a thread and then leave it as it is with little or no participation. It is as she suddenly appear with a topic and vanish from it.

I think this is going a bit crazy. It seems like any moment, they (the supporters) will snap and there will be a riot. There was entire pages of letters to the editor since it was published that they wouldn't fly the flag.

What do you think

Symbolism is simply put. A right of expessing symbolically (a goofy flag representing their so-called identities) of their wants and needs to be reconized as among equals.

Woopee doooo with their goofy freakin flag!!!

Might as well construct a flag of my own representing- "I don't freakin care who you are and you freakin sexual orientation!"

 

[aimeeandbeatles]

I am kinda curious to know why aimeeandbeatles starts a thread and then leave it as it is with little or no participation. It is as she suddenly appear with a topic and vanish from it.

I like to see where it goes without me interfereing.

 

[nivi]

I like to see where it goes without me interfereing.

That's a bit pardoxical.

ok..one more, just for good measure...

Ever get insulted in the street for being a lefty? Ever get told that you are less than human because of it? Ever wake up to anti-lefty graffitti on your front door and fear for your safety because you've been identified to others as a lefty?

The reason that it is different is because it matters to people, just like race or gender does. You're right: it shouldn't matter any more than any other trivial genetic difference, but to a lot of people, it does (and I'm not talking about gays themselves right here, although that is another issue). When discrimination of gays and lesbians is a thing of the past (and we're not there yet) I don't think they'll be much need for pride flags and festivals. But in the meantime, its an important reminder that people are different in a lot of ways, and the more we get comfortable with the diversity of people around us, the less likely we are to hate them for no good reason.

ok, done, I promise....

There was lots of anti-leftie hate back in the old days, my dad is left handed and so am I, but my dad had his hand tied behind his back so he could write with his right hand.
There were no left-handed parades, even though there was hate. The hate went away on its own, and the same will happen with this.