TSG49 Game in Progress

Ah, okay. I've been planting Great Artists right up to the end - I didn't realize there is a tipping point where I should just be triggering Golden Ages.

Will look into selling puppets. Hope it's worth a huge amount of gold ...

theres not an exact tipping point or anything but you certainly want to have at least one artist to pop for Utopia. golden ages also give 20% production bonus so it shaves turns there too. but 20% production/culture/gold bonus for a very long time speeds everything up. i honestly want a minimum of 80 turns in golden ages in culture vics.
 
Yeah, on this map rushing Civil Service seems good with all the river tiles and pikes upgrading to your UU, so Chicken Itza should be there for the taking to stretch out those GA's. Make sure to save up your faith for extra-long GA's after finishing Freedom.
 
Settled 1E from the wine.
Went GL+NC then another city in the middle of the jungle for more science. (Right next to the mountain for even more)
Researched Theology for HS and chosen +5cult, +%Prod for religion. First was useless, but any of them would have been, never had the chance to spread.
Went Edu, and rush bought University for the jungle city.

At the same time, I was very actively and aggressively hunted barbs. I was playing it as a strong patro game. I choosen the policy where CC give science then GP, but get only 2 gg, 1 khan, 1 GS, 1 GA.
absolutely disappointing for a VC game, but at least I could use them to ally a CC.
Also used my depleted (1 charge left) GP to ally one. I had a huge capital because of that.
Unfortunately Mongolia conquered 4 CC at the beginning. I liberated one with 1 Knight later (snatched from the Arabians who killed it for me almost fully) then Alex liberated 2 more. (yay!)

I got GL, Oracle, HS, but lost CI :(. I also got Alhambra, Terracotta, but because I did not settle on the wine (I would do it, if I start again) I could not have Petra.
Setting on the wine, would give me a faster start, the second wheat was not justifying the 1E. I got 70g from the first ruins so I was thinking it will be better maybe if I purchase the wheat)
Got everything else important.

Willem is expanded crazy, and would win around T300-350, but I will be faster.
I will finish around T275, with several mistakes, 250 should be quite possible.

I try to prebuild utopia, but I do not know how at the moment :)


- What did you do with the extra space?
Nothing really, hunted barbs for CS quest.
- What were your initial priorities?
Get NC and Jungle city fast. It was not that fast i wanted.
- What tech path did you follow?
Theology for a religion, then Education, Architecture, Archaeology. Probably not ideal - also I should have used oxford for freedom, but forget, another few round lost here.
- Were there any early wars and who started them?
Plenty, but I was not in any of them
- What Social Policies did you choose and why?
Tradition OFC, then I skipped piety and went straight to patronage. I wanted science for fast freedom. Then 3 to Piety for +33%, then Freedom and at the end liberty.

- Did you do anything exciting with your UU's?
Not at all.
 
There were many ruins on the map, and I got an upgrade to archer from one, but my archer was locked for around 20 turn by barbs. I should have leave, but there was a ruin behind a barb camp, and I wanted to take it. It really hindered my exploration, and after 20 turns when I picked it up, it gave me barb camp locations :)

Worth mention, that when you have a lot of CS on the map that is good for you, the patro +20 influence is very strong, you will be friends to all CS with no cost if you protect them (for minor diplo hit)

Diplo: Everyone hated Mongolia for conquering 3-4 CS at the beginning, so I denounced them all the time, and that made me Alex and Harun friend for a long time. Willhem coveted my land, so we never become friends but he never attacked me so far either.

If I would start again, I would settle on wine, would go Civil service before theology, and would start with 3! scout.
 
turn 167 atm I think:
got about 700 cult/t
around 250 bakkers
1 policy from completing freedom away and then its 8 more policys to go i think.

Settled on hill east of wine - went 4 cities overall + some puppets
sp order:
full tradition
3 Liberty (untill reduced sp costs) timed last 1 to come in after CI finished
piety
freedom

atm I allied pretty much every CS I found - got 250 gold per turn and cities are building pretty much only wonders at low production (apart the Perta city which ll build Utopia in end) while I spend gold early on on Cs and now on buildings - with the army of gifted units I dow civs take 1 city and then make paece for most time all their g/t or at least a lot :rolleyes:

Pretty sure this sp is perfect for cultural victory

went desert folk, pagodas and cathedrals reli wise - think these are best choises aswell - not 100% sure about pagodas - but what else?

running 4*5 Artists

atm I regret a bit that I didnt annex egypt cap after I took to run another 5 artists and didnt take/keep more cities generally - but happynes been allways pretty tight
 
This is probably way too long, but would appreciate comments from the one or two of you that might read this. Trying to improve my game. Never tried an Emperor game before other than Duel map. Most comments were written at the time so might not make sense in light of later discoveries.

Start

Looking at the announcement. Map size is standard which normally means 7 Opponents and 16 CS's. But I they've taken 2 AI's away and added 4 CS's. Easy to get Religion? Perhaps I need to concentrate on spreading religion to the CS's. Mystery map time, so I don't know how important sea power is. Would be silly if I settle inland then discovered it was an Island map. Two fish aren't enough, so I plan to move my Warrior to the hill to see what's at sea. If nothing there, move my Settler to the south Ivory. What's the bonus for settling on top of Ivory? I'm just starting to learn how to do a Culture win, my last attempt was successful but in 1955, after building the Sidney Opera House. I understand that's way late, I should be happy with Radio… we'll see. With the lack of AI's I may have extra room, so hopefully 4 cities, if I conquer more, I'll keep them as puppets so I don't take the Policy penalty.

0 - Moving the warrior showed a wheat. Two fish, Wine, Ivory, some river tiles, mostly plains. I'm not used to standard speed, if I move to the Ivory, then decide to go back to the hill, that may be too long. Hill it is.

1 - Going to start with a Scout. If it doesn't look like an island map, I may decide on a two scout start. Getting the money by being first to the CS's may be important. Pottery to start.

6 - Moved my Warrior south, found Manila. My scout just started. It could be an island or a peninsula, don't know yet. Not sure if second scout is important, so I'll start on my Monument.

9 - Two good huts, bows for my scout, and the Archer tech. Funny they seem to go together. If it's an island, it's pretty big. Had enough money to buy the wheat tile to keep my growth going.

10 - Got a report of two barbarians for my third hut. Looking more and more like a larger land mass. May want that second scout. Met Belgrade.

12 - Got a population from my 4th hut. Don't have enough money to buy the cattle, so have to be satisfied with the Ivory. Going to slow my growth. Animal Husbandry was chosen as my second tech.

13 - Monument done, making a second scout. My Warrior will need to return soon.

16 - OMG. Got 70 gold from one hut and CALENDAR from another. Stupid barb could have attacked me in jungle, but waited until I was in jungle, on a hill and across the river! Culture border pop got the cows, nice! Now my pop is growing again.

17 - Another hut just gave me a map, but it showed two more ruins. Sorry I keep calling ruins huts :). Animal Husbandry is done, and NO horses anywhere. I don't need mining right away. Need sailing for the fish, Trapping for the Ivory and Writing for the libraries, and Philosophy. With calendar I could try for stonehenge, but best I could do is 26 turns and that slows my growth. Going to start a worker. Second scout is on his way. Warrior is going to clear the close barb camp before it causes problems. Don't need trapping right away, my worker will be busy with the wheat, cattle and wine. No, changed to the shrine, I need some faith. Not going to try for the Great Library, so going Sailing first, then Writing. Took tradition as my first policy pick.

19 - Got a 30 culture hut, started Liberty. My scout is heading for Belgrade hoping to grab a Worker, but don't see one yet.

21 - Met William. The barb camp just spawned a bow, going to have to retreat and heal. I'll head the warrior to Belgrade, perhaps they'll have a worker by then.

22 - OMG, just got Writing from a hut. Never been so lucky.

24 - Shrine's built. If I go all out production I can have the Great Library or Stonehenge in 23 turns, 26 with a bit more growth. Going to try, if I fail I can use the money to buy a worker/settler. Great Library it is for the slingshot to Philosophy. I'll keep my city growing and try 26. I need a worker, going to try and steal one, or if not, can get one in 5 turns from policy.

27 - Dang, silly me. Met Ramses, and thought I was selling him an embassy, instead I paid to place one of mine. Same thing with William. Doh! At least they don't have writing yet so my Great Library has a chance. Having trouble with barbs, my warrior is low in health. Sailing done, going optics.

28 - Picked up Citizenship to get a worker. My warrior has a sliver of health left, going to try and make it home. I keep trying to run away from other barbs with my scouts but keep running into others. I'll have to try and heal them if possible, even though it slows down my scouting. Barbs seem to be worse than I"m used to.

32 - William got writing and sold me back the embassy. At least I got my money back. 15 turns to GL, can I do it? Kill one barb with my city, my warrior is almost home but still with a sliver of health. My two scouts are still healing. My worker had to head to the cattle (not a bad choice anyway) to avoid the barb.

33 - Warrior made it home! One of my scouts had to move, but at 79 HP's is good enough to continue scouting. The other is still healing. Hopefully Ramses took care of the two barb bows that were causing him problems. I am the first to found a Pantheon, no religious AI's I guess. Agonizing over the choice. +1 hammer would shave 2 turns off the GL. But I think I'll head for the long term benefit of Fertility Rites. My citizens rejoice!

35 - Unknown civilization started a Pantheon and chose Goddess of Protection. Seems to be playing defensively.

40 - Got Optics, may need it to get around Egypt and continue exploring. Where are all the CS's? Six turns to GL.

41 - Was heading to Manila to hopefully snag a worker and fulfill a kill barb camp quest, but need to back track to kill a barb bow so my worker can head back to the wine. Started researching Trapping. Met Jakarta, first CS where I got only 15 g :(

43 - Hello Arabia. Met his scout by Jakarta. Took Republic Policy, 3 turns to GL. Hmm, my warrior has the Embarkation skill, but my two scouts don't. What's the rule on that?

46 - Finished the GL, chose Philosophy!

I need settlers, and workers and an army. Right now the Barbs are causing problems so started on an Archer. I thought I would have more money (I would have if I hadn't bought embassies, double doh!). But not nearly enough to buy a settler. I'll get one from Policy, but I'll need to start on that after the Archer. A Barb is causing problems and pillaged my wheat, left my cattle alone.

48 - Connected my Wine and sold it to William for 83 gold + 5gpt. Best deal I could get.

49 - Genghis wanted to trade embassies, I sold him one instead. Finally did it right.

50 - I'm friends with Gengis!

51 - Finally took that barb camp by Manila. Didn't notice a worker in there, it was Manila's but I kept it. Got to be his ally (for a few turns) with him anyway for fulfilling the barb quest. Now I need to head back and defend my capital with my new Archer. Still have two pillaged tiles there. Started on a Settler.

52 - Squeezed by Valetta and glad I did. Found a ruin, unfortunately just got barb info. But there seems to be more land to the south, and it's unexplored by anyone. Of course, gotta heal a bit because of barb bows :(.

53 - Hooked up the Ivory and sold it to Genghis for 145 + 3 gpt.

54 - Genghis came back and asked for gold. Perhaps I put him in a bind :). I had to refuse. He also got a Pantheon and chose God of War.

58 - Another barb showed up, had to retreat a worker, at least he repaired the wheat. Moving my almost healed warrior up to help my archer take care of him. Just have enough money now to buy a Settler, but only want one until I get my National College built. Need more units to help protect cities anyway. Going to purchase a work boat instead. My second city will be right between the Spice and the Crabs, on a river and on a coast.

59 - Started Drama and Poetry. I already have Mining, Masonry and The Wheel. Got 20 more Culture from ruins south of Valletta. Killed the barb warrior, but not until he pillaged the wheat again.

61 - Egypt started an Open Sky Pantheon. My scout south of Valetta is stuck by a barb and a Dutch scout is running by. Dang it! My settler is heading for his spot. Started on Oracle. Plan to finish that, while my second city is getting founded and getting a library, then the National College.

62 - Picked Aristocracy for the extra production for the Oracle. Can't use another settler right now.

63 - Manila wanted to find Arabia, so I bought an Embassy to fulfill that. Will be ally for a while, I need the food. Founded Sigtuna, immediately bought a work boat. Will buy the crab tile next turn and start farming it. There goes all my money !

64 - Immediately sold my crabs to Arabia for 177 gold and 2 gpt. My scout seems to be at the end of a continent near Brussels. It looks Fractaly to me. Still missing one civ and lots of CS's

66 - Sold my second Ivory to Ramses, should have done this earlier, still positive happiness.

67 - Bought a couple of tiles to start working on the Wheat south of Sigtuna.

72 - Drama and Poetry done, starting Construction for the better bowmen and lumber camps which I'll need.

74 - Genghis is being his old self and conquering CS's

75 - Finally met Alex, he's south of Tyre. There is a large part of the continent between Alex and the Arabs I haven't explored. Hopefully Alex can keep Genghis in check.

76 - Stonehenge is completed by the Arabs. Sigtuna finishes Monument, starts on Shrine. Alex invited me into a war with Genghis. Had to pass.

77 - Another barb from the south. My warrior and Archer are out of position and healing. Going to be a bit of pillaging :(.

78 - Construction done. Starting on Bronze Working so I can clear the Jungle on the Spices. Upgraded my bowman.

79 - Barb pillages an Ivory, but the Wine deal with William expires, so happiness is unchanged.

80 - Manilla lost access to furs it was giving me, just went -2 happiness.

General Comments:

I've never done so much selling of resources and buying before. But I guess that's what you have to do at the higher levels. Barbs were a big pain in the A**. Actually never lost a unit, but they slowed me down and did too much pillaging.

Plan now is to settle a city south on the Desert to pick up marble, then up north somewhere by a river. The fourth will be my last city. It will be attacked if any are, so I'll need more units. Sending a warrior up that way to check out the AI and barb activity. Civil Service is my next goal, I need the extra food. Oracle is just 2 turns away.

The only thing I did with all the extra room was to make two scouts, they still have lots of work to do.
 
u need a bit more of a gameplan - switching back and forth between tradition and liberty isnt good - stick to 1 tree early on and go straight for the big bonus (free settler or free 2 food) - u hardbuilt settler without liberty bonus?

Also not giving back the worker seems like very bad idea - u get 3 food right away from manilla - while u need like 8 turns to even start work with worker.

Get more units early on to spread over map and meet CS and complete barb camp quests - u need to aly (all types) as soon as possible.

As said stick to 1 tree - if u go tradition go grow your cap fast and try buy settler with ai gold - try steal workers from ais (hard on this map).
Might try to buy early worker as soon as u meet ais and get loans to work your lux and make more loans

Overall it seems your game doesnt "click"
 
@tommynt: i read the list and it seems he's just opened tradition then gotten into liberty. i might have missed it he dipped back into trad after republic cuz its an actual turn-by-turn write-up. he's getting oracle so ill be curious as to what he picks with that. its usually a tree finisher or opener cuz one tree is already done for me.

great hut pops for you, pholtz. and thanks for the detailed write-up. comp bows are city takers so now that you have them you can consider going on the offensive ASAP or at the least getting as many CS barb clears as you can. and 3rd and 4th cities coming late might slow the end time down. 4 cities by t80 is a little more ideal but barbs have a way of making it harder if you didnt get 3-4 archers quickly. that free early Archery wouldve made purchasing archers from the sold sea luxes a nice turnaround on the workboat rush-buy investment.
 
I'm starting to think one of my mistakes was to go after the GL. I did get it, but it slowed down my expansion too much. Without going for it I would have gotten my second city down sooner and gotten Philosophy at about the same time.

I seemed to be actually ahead of what I could do in terms of tech. I had techs to build various culture or city building items but not the time to actually build the stuff.

And yes, I should have bought a few archers with my money. It would have helped so much with the barbs.

I would like to discuss where I am now, but I am not finished with the game so can't :).
 
i wasnt sure if you were familiar that the GL slingshot not having the same value anymore. the additional early era changed that and many still get GL for scientist points but the slingshot part is less valuable than in vanilla. its still nice but 30 turns couldve been a library, settler, 2 archers instead of GS points, tech and free library. its still quite nice but more of a long-term opportunity cost, particularly if you get sniped on it. im still gunshy from trying it on emperor and higher and because my habits are different i often forget to even go for it on lower difficulties now.
 
If your money flow is decent there is nothing wrong with building wonders like gl - it doesnt give u only a free tech (which value might not be superhigh anymore - but I usually pick drama to get the free amphithaetre right when when being in Tradition tree) but also a library and 3 bakkers and later on additional culture from sp

62 - Picked Aristocracy for the extra production for the Oracle. Can't use another settler right now.
thats the comment in the list which seems just most wrong
Its just that pholtz need expand WAY faster, espacially if he s going liberty tree, and with tradition starter and free worker the free settler and settler bonus gets pushed 2 sp behind - like 20-30 turns with early low culture.

Goal should be to finish settling new cities around turn 60 - latest turn 75
So if u go liberty tree u might build a early wonder (pyras, henge, gl) but right after it collective rule should be there ( around turn 45-50) to rush out 2-3 more settlers
 
Started for a couple of days, but barely having the time in the evenings:

Went with the warrior inland, and noticed the hill between two rivers, so that's where Stockholm went. At this point I wasn't really sure if I'll go one city or not. Since my last game was a one city challenge with the Aztecs I said I'd try something new, so I went Tradition but went with a couple of more cities, thinking that I may need a bit more research power at this level (never went above prince).

Sigtuna just below Belgrade (I kind of regret positioning my capital in the middle of the place at this point), Helsinki went a bit inland close to the spices (thought I'd stop here, but browsing through the tech tree I find Petra, and I regret once again the positioning of my capital), and Birka went further north on a desert hill, within reach of gold and cotton.

Bought a couple of workers and stole one from Manilla (which was a big mistake as they were upset with me for about 40 turns).

This went before turn 65 so I started hitting happiness issues (due to selling luxuries in order to get the cities faster). Got a small archer/warrior army (I regret the warriors, since the upgrade path isn't that nice with Sweden) as my neighbors were trigger happy (except for the Mongol who went directly with Friendship).

Sold embassies as I wasn't familiar with the concept, so that was 125 gold down the drain, and up until the turn I am in I kept hitting unhappiness problems so that my cities are rather small.

Barely finished tradition by turn 115 or so, which seems really slow to me, so I'm guessing it's not going to be all that fine and dandy.

The Mongol went after Florence and Hong Kong, got them, Alex and the Dutch disliked me, so I dennounced the Mongol and now everyone's a pal of mine.

Speaking of the Dutch, he got most of the wonders. I managed Stonehenge, the Terracota Army and Petra will be done soon way up north. My explorer is in the east, blocked by Egypt, while I forgot to upgrade my small army at the gates of Hong Kong (so I'm attacking with Archers and Warriors, while Alex already freed Florence).

I'll focus, I think, next on getting Granaries, Aqueducts, Mills and so forth so that my cities will start to grow (doing really poorly at the moment with an average of 6). Although I need to upgrade my culture output, as I'm doing fairly poor in that aspect also.

Speaking of religion: oh, boy. With all the desert tiles around I kept thinking I'll get Desert Folklore, but chose Fertility rites seeing that my cities were a bit of a mess. Also got Tithe and Cathedrals but now I don't know how to spread the religion outside of my capital.

Not doing that great, but I'm still hoping I'll get a win, although the Dutch seems so be going strong on research.
 
t103

tried a different culture game,went for the settler policy and spawned cities, have now 8 river cities rivers and got the happiness pantheon. the old faithful and the many unique luxuries also helped. sweden will rule all the land between the mountain ranges, from the old faithful to the rock from gibraltar, all the way south.

all cities build monument first and second library, squeezed water mills in with the first two nearby cities

finished civil service and on my way to acoustics

used ge from liberty finisher for terracotta army in fourth city. did not start with piety yet, which is way behind schedule now. still hoping to catch up later.

petra, ci, great mosque and hs are next up on the list for the other cities

capital will start nc in 6 turns

mongolia wiped out two cultural states. the dutch are denouncing and im getting ready to bomb rotterdam.
 
Would love to see a screen shot of this, and some more on your build order to get so many settlers out so quickly. What trade-offs did you make?
 
100 turns and going strong. Emperor is my difficulty of choice but Sweden is new to me. This is my 1st GotM training and I know I'm late but here goes:

- What did you do with the extra space?
Used it to protect me from AIs, so I could skimp on military.
- What were your initial priorities?
Explore the map for ruins, settling spots, and to see what kind of map it is.
- What tech path did you follow?
Calendar, Trapping, Writing. After finding the desert up north I beelined Currency. Then Iron Working and Philosophy.
- Were there any early wars and who started them?
Mongolia ate a few city states, otherwise no wars yet.
- What Social Policies did you choose and why?
Tradition let me grab up resources quickly (Stockholm is a few tiles southeast of start so that 2 wheat, 1 ivory, 1 wine are all in 2nd row), get immediate monuments, and wonderspam. Piety will boost Culture. I took Oral Tradition belief to profit from nearby bananas/cotton/silk/spice as well as wine in capital.

1st expansion is far north from capital but desert hills will be sick with Petra (10 turns away now). 2nd expansion is on the river to the north-east adjacent to a mountain. University + hella jungle + observatory = hella science. My main concerns atm are making friends (I should denounce Mongolia to make friends with his 3 enemies to the east) and defending against a probable DOW (several War Chariots sitting near my capital).

I'd post a screeny but I don't have GIMP or photoshop.
 
100 turns and going strong. Emperor is my difficulty of choice but Sweden is new to me. This is my 1st GotM training and I know I'm late but here goes:

I'd post a screeny but I don't have GIMP or photoshop.
Welcome to CivFanatics and GOTM. :wavey:

Good luck in this and future games. :thumbsup:

For screenshots, you could try IrFanview. :)
 
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