Unit ideas

[ajac]

Been playing civ games for YEARS and now I LOVE CIV 4 and all but here are osme units I iwsh were availabe in the game:

Helicopter transports and aircraft
Carry up to 4 INFANTRY or artillery units only. Transport aircraft could hold one armoed unit.

Anti-sub helicopters and aircraft
Just that. Can detect submarines and attack them but cannot be attacked themselves.


Missile Submarines
Both ICBM and anti-ship missile carying types. ICBM take about the time it takes to build a single ICBM. anti-ship missile carrying give them an attack range of maybe 5?

WW I fighters
Slow ponderious easy to make and fragile

WW 1 Bombers
Same as above

Modern ground attack
A-10s harriers and such bonuses to attacking armored units.

Dreadnaught
Almost as powerful as a battleship slower and less armored and less powerful.

Escort carrier
Carries 1 fighter slow small.

Cruisers and battlecruisers
Cruisers could be given almost as powerful as battle cruisers but faster be able to detect submarines . Battle cruiser cant detect subs but heavy anti-ship firepower think of as the poor mans battleship

Stealth fighter
BRING IT BACK!!!

Unmanned aircraft
Attack and recon models. Cheap and people dont care if they die.

Landing craft wtih aircraft aka like the Tarawa and Wasp classes
Carry 2 land units 1 aircraft. Good defenses expensive and slow.


Just some ideas

 

[Zurai]

WW 1 Bombers
Same as above

No such things. Aircraft in WW1 were used almost entirely as scouts, with limited strafing ability and no bombs worth mentioning.

Stealth fighter
BRING IT BACK!!!

Again, no such thing. The stealth "fighter" from Civ3 is actually a different model of stealth bomber. There are no (publically known) stealth fighters in the world.

Landing craft wtih aircraft aka like the Tarawa and Wasp classes
Carry 2 land units 1 aircraft. Good defenses expensive and slow.

There is no way to make a unit able to carry two different domains (land and air, in this case). You have to choose one or the other when you make a unit.


Still some good ideas though.

 

[MikeC]

Again, no such thing. The stealth "fighter" from Civ3 is actually a different model of stealth bomber. There are no (publically known) stealth fighters in the world.

Not quite true.

F-117A Nighthawk

The stealth fighter emerged from the classified world while stationed at Tonapah Airfield with an announcement by the Pentagon in November 1988 and was first shown publicly at Nellis in April 1990.

 

[Lord Cerberus]

A few replies to your ideas:

First of all, I like (most of) them.

Transport Helicopters: There are some (lightly) armored vehicles that can be transported by heli.

Escort Carrier: I like this idea, BUT -- it should be FASTER than a regular carrier, not slower. Reason: it's an "escort" which means it should be able to keep pace with any other unit in it's time period.

Unmanned Aircraft: not sure how you'd implement the "don't care if it dies" part... maybe it could be a promotion to existing units, gives +2 visibility, and +1 attack?

When it comes to landing craft... how about this idea:
Modern Transports have an extra "special" cargo slot for either a landing craft (can't attack, 1 defense, 2 speed, cannot enter ocean, invisible to normal units (like sub), can carry 1 unit) or a transport helicopter.

Battleships, Dreadnoughts, Battlecruisers, Cruisers
1) Having 4 warships in the same era is a bit much. + the Destroyer!
2) Dreadnought is the word the british used to refer to what the americans called a Battlecruiser.
3) I'd recommend Destroyer, Cruiser, Battleship.
4) An alternative idea is this: Cruisers usually carry more marines than other ships (on a per capita basis at least). Maybe we could let Cruisers have only marginally more power than a destroyer, but they can carry 1 marine (marine and SEAL only)

 

[ajac]

haha I was thinking more of the way of the F-22 in my idea for a stealth figither. and thier were bombers in WW 1...

http://www.theaerodrome.com/aircraft/gbritain/armstrong_fk8.html

 

[Exavier]

I already modded a cargo plane into my game... its just a bomber with absolutly no attack gane (it can only rebase). Its kinda nice because it can let me get reinforcments to open border allied citys faster

Missle submarines are kinda a gray area right now... While it is easy to mod them to carry ICBMs its making a limited range civ 3 bombard style weapon thats the problem. As far as i can tell with the removal of the old bombard system it kinda makes it impossible (at least without the SDK) to modify anything that would come close to missle targeting (i can't even make a non-nuclear ICBM).

Escort carrier isn't a bad idea but where would you put it tecnology wise? you get the normal carrier at flight and you usually don't need anything else.

Alot of ppl (including myself) have been adding the Aegis Cruiser back into the game... Actually there is a "Lost Units Mod" in the completed mods section that has one that works kinda nice and looks even better in game with the skin.

 

[Kushan]

I already modded a cargo plane into my game... its just a bomber with absolutly no attack gane (it can only rebase). Its kinda nice because it can let me get reinforcments to open border allied citys faster

Would you mind sending this to me? Does the AI use it at all?

Kushan

 

[Zurai]

thier were bombers in WW 1...

http://www.theaerodrome.com/aircraft/gbritain/armstrong_fk8.html

160 lbs of bombs isn't enough to make any difference on a civ scale. Air power did not exist in WW1 - planes were simply too primitive for them to play a signifigant role in the war.

Not quite true.

F-117A Nighthawk

From that very article:

The stealth fighter attacked the most heavily fortified targets during Desert Storm (January-February 1991) , and it was the only coalition jet allowed to strike targets inside Baghdad's city limits. The F-117A, which normally packs a payload of two 2,000-pound GBU-27 laser-guided bombs, destroyed and crippled Iraqi electrical power stations, military headquarters, communications sites, air defense operation centers, airfields, ammo bunkers, and chemical, biological and nuclear weapons plants.

Also, if you read the armanents section, 100% of its weapons are bombs. It isn't a fighter, it's a bomber. It may be called a Stealth Fighter, but it's a bomber nonetheless.

 

[Tacit_Exit]

One of the more famous WW1 bombers (Handley Page):

Some people should learn that "I've never heard of" doesn't necessarily equate to "it didn't exist"

 

[maxpublic]

Helicopter transports and aircraft
Carry up to 4 INFANTRY or artillery units only. Transport aircraft could hold one armoed unit.

You can model this by making it possible to 'upgrade' regular infantry to an airmobile version. The airmobile would have a flat movement just like gunships do. Use a promotion that you've removed to give you an icon for airmobile.

Anti-sub helicopters and aircraft
Just that. Can detect submarines and attack them but cannot be attacked themselves.

ASW craft don't operate apart from their attached units. And think about what you're talking about here: even if every unit in Civ is only a division, you're talking about stacking approximately 1,000 ASW craft into their own unit...for what? I doubt the entire U.S. Navy has 1,000 ASW on hand.

If you want some sort of 'improved' ASW capability, make an upgrade to the destroyer that gives it better combat abilities vs submarines once a certain tech is reached.

WW I fighters
Slow ponderious easy to make and fragile

WW 1 Bombers
Same as above

As someone else pointed out, these aircraft were so primitive they had no practical effect on the outcome of military operations. The only thing they did well was scout.

Escort carrier
Carries 1 fighter slow small.

Why would anyone build this unit? Besides, most escort carriers were tasked to escort merchant convoys. And they weren't particularly good at their jobs.

Cruisers and battlecruisers
Cruisers could be given almost as powerful as battle cruisers but faster be able to detect submarines . Battle cruiser cant detect subs but heavy anti-ship firepower think of as the poor mans battleship

Cruisers aren't "almost" as powerful as battleships. They don't even compare. The reason why there are so many of them post-WW2 compared to battleships is that a) they're much cheaper to build, and b) modern warfare means that the battleship is unlikely to survive any serious naval engagement. Too big a target, too many missiles.

Unmanned aircraft
Attack and recon models. Cheap and people dont care if they die.

Again, think about this: an entire air wing of unmanned aircraft? There is no such thing the modern world.

Max

 

[Zurai]

One of the more famous WW1 bombers (Handley Page):

Some people should learn that "I've never heard of" doesn't necessarily equate to "it didn't exist"

WW1 "Bombers" fufilled none of the roles that Civ4 Bombers fufill. Thus, no plane existed in WW1 that would be a bomber in game.

 

[snafusmith]

Some people need to look stuff up more before speeking -

On the WW1 bombers-
-They weren't just massive biplanes like the Gotha and Handley Page
-Think: Zeplins
-Both of the above were used on a limited strategic basis (Bombings of London)
-THEY WERE USED. They had limited effect, but they were used.

Stealth fighter-
-The F117 cannot be considered a fighter, that's correct
-Ajac mentioned the F22. It IS a stealthy fighter, and could be used



Main moral, just because you don't think it's there, do at least a quick google search first. Also, try and be more constructive, they were just ideas, and not bad ones at that.


-Smitty

 

[maxpublic]

Some people need to look stuff up more before speeking

Some people need to read the posts before replying. As has been pointed out, no WW1 aircraft is capable of fulfilling the bombing role of a civ unit. In civ terms they'd have a bombardment rating of 0, meaning that there's no point in building them in the first place.

A single task force of B-17s (WW2) can unload more bomb tonnage in a single mission than all the WW1 'bombers' produced by any nation during the conflict.

Main moral, just because you don't think it's there, do at least a quick google search first.

No, the moral would be to can the ego and realize that the people here speaking on the subject know a bit about it. Probably more than you'd find in some cursory 5-minute google search.

The idea that everyone who disagrees with you is an ignoramus is immature, to say the least.

Also, try and be more constructive, they were just ideas, and not bad ones at that.

The comments are constructive. Some of the ideas aren't realistic, and among knowledgeable gamers will elicit a "WTH?" response if they download and play the mod. That doesn't mean the original poster can't make a mod with those units, but he *did* ask for opinions....

Max

 

[Exavier]

Would you mind sending this to me? Does the AI use it at all?

Kushan

Um what would be the easiest way to send it to you? lol

Its actually not that hard to mod in. Just duplicate the Bomber entry in the UnitInfos.xml file and give it an air range of 0, and cargo stats similar to tha transport (Domain Cargo needs to be DOMAIN_LAND and Cargo needs to be a number). Don't forget to create entrys in the other files (for the descryption and everything)

Honestly i don't think they AI would even understand how to use it properly...