unit limits

[Darkform]

it would be great if somehow there was no national limit but each unit had a limit of how many you could have in 1 stack with core being unlimited and that you have to have at least 3 core in a stack. probably very hard to code but I'm thinking along the lines of how you can't move tired units or 0 attack power into a stack of enemies. (so it would check how many of that 1 unit is in the tile you want to move on and if it is at max limit already then you can't move it into that stack.) this way you can have unlimited troops but in each stack you're limited, so each stack will have combined arms and if you want more high power units you can't use stack combat without combined arms.

need 4 new tags:

Core: must have 3 or more together to start stack
Special: can have 0-4 in stack
Rare: can have 0-2 in a stack
Hero (WH definition so not a mod hero but more like a character): 0-3
Lord: 0-1

the mod heros would ether be a Hero or Lord class Zombie Dragon would be a Hero while Count Vlad von Carstein would be a Lord.

for Vampire Counts

Lord:
Vampire Lord
Mod Heros

Hero character):
Necromancer
Vampire (not thrall or bloodkissed)
Wight King
Zombie Dragon
weak Mod Heros

Rare:
Varghulf
Cairn Wraiths
Tomb Banshee
Blood Knights
Black Coach

Special:
Grave Guard
Black Knights
Fell Bats
Spirit Host

Core:
Zombie Horde
Skeleton Warriors (any 1 handed weapon)
Skeleton Spearmen
Crypt Ghouls
Dire Wolves

I would go as far to say you should have to have 3+ core in a city before the city lets you build a non-Core unit and you have to have a available slot open. core slots are always open. (this also keeps you from putting all your good units in just your border citys because they just won't fit.)

I think this balances unique troops and common troops on every map size. smaller you have less citys and stacks larger you have more citys and stacks.

all of this is just a idea and probably a good one IF the mod was just in the beginning stages.

 

[Darkform]

the current National limits are to big for small maps and to small for large maps. of course if you can find a way to change national limits based on size of map that would also sound good.

 

[Ahriman]

As I have stated before, I think that the design decision to put national unit limits in is an excellent one.
1. The limits forces use of both weaker core "militia" units that are never made obsolete, as well as the more powerful elite units. The civ engine is such that if you could always build unlimited elite units, thats all you would do. Why build militia spearmen when you can build pikemen?
2. The system forces the player to play more strategically and use your elites (and siege units) in particular areas. You can't keep a couple of catapults in every border city in a large empire to fire on any invading enemy stacks.
3. The system acts as a reverse slippery-slope mechanic. (eg see http://gamefire.com/shows-community...-perpetual-comeback-in-company-of-heroes.html ). It slows your rate of advance; the bigger the empire you have, the lower must be the average density of your national limit units in any particular region.
4. The system increases the difficulty of the mod; when 1 human player fighting wars against multiple AI players, the AI gains a slight advantage by being able to field more elite units, and the human player must use theirs more carefully.
5. The system encourages warfare; once you have built up a full complement of elite units, the gains of not going to war are much lower, since you can't keep increasing . So you should go to war (and risk losing some elite units) in order to build more.

I accept that it is slightly unfortunate that the unit cap doesn't scale with map size, but I think the consequences of this are mild. The unit caps are designed for a standard/large map; if you play something less than that, the caps will be a little low, and if you play a huge map, the caps can be a little high, but nothing that breaks the game experience.

Trying to put limits on the number of units in a single stack is difficult to code, difficult for the player to understand (I can hear the "why can't I move unit x into stack y, this mod sux!" threads now), and impossible for the AI to understand. It adds nothing really to the game except getting very slightly closer to a strict interpretation of tabletop rules, in fairly clumsy way.

And dropping limits would require a total redesign of the unit roster.

 

[Psychic_Llamas]

i think a national limit scale aaccording to map size would be intersting, no idea how to code it though im afraid.

 

[Ajidica]

Couldnt you change due to map sieze via python? I know next to nothing about python but coulnt their be a function that keeps track of map size? I had though that national units alreay scalled to map size, at least I could have sworn they did back in vannila.

 

[Ahriman]

I don't even know if its worth doing. There are a ton of other features that don't "scale" according to map size. Wonders that benefit all cities are relatively more useful on larger maps, wonders that benefit one city are relatively less useful. Civics like God King are relatively more useful on small maps, less useful on larger maps (while civics like city states are relatively more useful on large maps). Limits like the Elves have where many units can only be built in a single city (the capital) are more restrictive on larger maps.
etc. etc.

The game plays differently on a larger map size. There's nothing necessarily wrong with that.