Venice Question

[vivalamexico]

I am going for a diplo victory with Venice. It is turn 155. How much GPT is considered standard for this time?
I am currently making 106 GPT (soon unlocking more Commerce policies), but I feel as if I should be making more. Agree, disagree?

 

[reddishrecue]

The more you make the more chance you have to get the city states.

 

[vivalamexico]

At turn 186 I have 145 GPT and around 5000 gold. At this rate, will I have enough for an eventual diplo victory when WC comes around?

 

[GWashington]

If you keep saving money like that, you probably will. If I were you I would try and ally all the CS I can, and the ones that the AIs hold on to I would coup or if not coup, puppet with a merchant. What difficulty are you playing on?

 

[reddishrecue]

Start to get allies sooner to benefit from their bonuses earlier.

 

[vivalamexico]

If you keep saving money like that, you probably will. If I were you I would try and ally all the CS I can, and the ones that the AIs hold on to I would coup or if not coup, puppet with a merchant. What difficulty are you playing on?

King (because its my 1st time with Venice, so I wanted to try it out on a slightly easier difficulty)

 

[vivalamexico]

Around when is it best to start locking down CS allies with Venice? I am inexperienced with this civ, so I wanted to know if anyone has more knowledge on the subject

 

[GWashington]

Around when is it best to start locking down CS allies with Venice? I am inexperienced with this civ, so I wanted to know if anyone has more knowledge on the subject

Anytime is fine, really. I would do it earlier because the bonuses are better. I usually wait until I get spies to ally all the CS I can, but early on I usually try to ally all the nearby CS (and depending on the continent size I also try to ally all the CS on the continent).

 

[njmfff]

do CS quests and use few trade routs to do Trade Route quest when they ask for it.

Finish Patronage (or at least open it) and just dump gold turn before World Congress. You shouldn't have a problems.

 

[vivalamexico]

Great
Thanks to everyone for the feedback

 

[Helmling]

I play on Quick so I don't have a good sense of where 186 falls in the scheme of things, but if you early adopt Freedom, beeline for the policy at the top that gives up +4 influence per turn for trade routes with CS.

 

[sendos]

Can't get diplo victory until UN is established (Atomic era).

Your current gpt is considered standard for all civs but maybe substandard for Venice in particular. See if you can get it up to 300gpt later in game. Look for sea trading opportunities, especially with Portugal (if they're in your game) buy out 2 CS' and have 2 internal sea food trade routes to the capitol.

Did you manage to get the Colossus? Colossus + harbor + market + DEIC will give you a lot of gpt via sea trade routes and you will gain at least 16-20 gpt from other civs sending sea trade routes to Venice. Sending sea trade routes to CS' is viable once you have the treaty organization tenet in Freedom.

 

[Helmling]

Can't get diplo victory until UN is established (Atomic era).

Your current gpt is considered standard for all civs but maybe substandard for Venice in particular. See if you can get it up to 300gpt later in game. Look for sea trading opportunities, especially with Portugal (if they're in your game) buy out 2 CS' and have 2 internal sea food trade routes to the capitol.

Did you manage to get the Colossus? Colossus + harbor + market + DEIC will give you a lot of gpt via sea trade routes and you will gain at least 16-20 gpt from other civs sending sea trade routes to Venice. Sending sea trade routes to CS' is viable once you have the treaty organization tenet in Freedom.

Wait, DEIC?

 

[sendos]

Dutch East India Company. Increases gpt from civs sending trades to you by 4 if it is sent to the city that has it.

 

[Helmling]

Dutch East India Company. Increases gpt from civs sending trades to you by 4 if it is sent to the city that has it.

Oh, duh. Thanks.

 

[s8g]

On King, you'll going to be just fine. Just ally any CS you can and save up some cash towards the end. Try to maximze bpt for Globalization, so you can choose wether you use your spies as diplomatcs or position them in the CSs.

 

[GhostSalsa]

I am currently making 106 GPT (soon unlocking more Commerce policies), but I feel as if I should be making more. Agree, disagree?

Commerce doesn't do very much to improve Venice's GPT. All your international trade routes should be cargo ship in the long run, so Exploration is better for GPT.

Rather, Commerce is better for incidental gold events - doubling Great Merchant trade mission yields (which is quadruple for Merchant of Venice) and saving gold on rush-buys. Both of which you have to maximize Merchant generation - build bank ASAP, build merchant point wonders, work all your merchant slots in the capital, get Great Person multipliers, etc - to get the most out of. You need to go on trade missions as well as buy up puppets (which is where you'll be doing your rush-buying) to get the most out of commerce.

If you aren't generating a lot of MOV's, all Venice gets out of commerce is the trading post bonus. In which case Exploration is better.

 

[budweiser]

Commerce doesn't do very much to improve Venice's GPT. All your international trade routes should be cargo ship in the long run, so Exploration is better for GPT.

Rather, Commerce is better for incidental gold events - doubling Great Merchant trade mission yields (which is quadruple for Merchant of Venice) and saving gold on rush-buys. Both of which you have to maximize Merchant generation - build bank ASAP, build merchant point wonders, work all your merchant slots in the capital, get Great Person multipliers, etc - to get the most out of. You need to go on trade missions as well as buy up puppets (which is where you'll be doing your rush-buying) to get the most out of commerce.

If you aren't generating a lot of MOV's, all Venice gets out of commerce is the trading post bonus. In which case Exploration is better.

You forgot to factor the commerce opener into your analysis.

Sometimes for low city/single city play several openers are a better choice than going deep in a tree.

But, I tend to think sooner or later Venice needs the whole commerce tree.