Walls and seige weapons

[douche_bag]

walls had a much bigger effect in history than they do in the game.If you have built walls nobody should be able to attck your city sqaure,they could still pillage improvments around it though.Walls should only be destroyed by catapults and other seige weapons just like they already destroy other improvments.Having this effect would make walls MUCH more important than they are now.

 

[Colonel]

This is a great idea and it allows a few more drawn out conflicts in that era as well as a larger tech table. You could seperate siege weapons into their own tech group.

 

[douche_bag]

what do you mean own tech group? isn't it like that now?

 

[rupertslander]

Cities are currently far too easy to take by storm.

 

[CIVPhilzilla]

This is a great idea.

 

[douche_bag]

Cities are currently far too easy to take by storm.

So does this mean you agree with me?

 

[Colonel]

what do you mean own tech group? isn't it like that now?

Like you have techs that lead to others like smaller break off tech tree, so you would research siege weapons then that would lead to other groups of siege type of weapons.

 

[Zild]

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree...

In the earlier eras, with a single turn taking up to fifty years would provide a large amount of time for the attackers to find an opportunity to get past walls - destroying them with explosives or finding a way to sneak in and open the gates, for example. Not to mention the possibility of using ladders and such to go over walls (this is risky, hence the 50% bonus to defenders) - I really don't think I should have to waste a turn of city construction to build a ladder (what, 1 or 2 shields?) I assume such things are provided to all attacking units as standard.

In more modern times, tanks could easily take the walls out with a shot or two. Even Marines and Infantry would pack some form of demolition weapons (mortars, rocket launchers, C4) that would take the walls out.

I'm all for adding realism and variety to the game, but I think that a simple +50% defence bonus works well enough for city walls.

 

[rupertslander]

As I might have said elsewhere, cities are far too easy to take by storm. Attacking a city with walls shouldn't be impossible - just an operation that will almost certainly fail unless you have alot of cannon fodder.

I have tried making the required adjustments in the editor, by upping the city defense bonuses, but the AI doesn't seem to get it and invariably gets slaughtered trying to storm the gates. The AI doesn't seem to think to drag cannons with them to conduct proper sieges.

 

[douche_bag]

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree...

In the earlier eras, with a single turn taking up to fifty years would provide a large amount of time for the attackers to find an opportunity to get past walls - destroying them with explosives or finding a way to sneak in and open the gates, for example. Not to mention the possibility of using ladders and such to go over walls (this is risky, hence the 50% bonus to defenders) - I really don't think I should have to waste a turn of city construction to build a ladder (what, 1 or 2 shields?) I assume such things are provided to all attacking units as standard.

In more modern times, tanks could easily take the walls out with a shot or two. Even Marines and Infantry would pack some form of demolition weapons (mortars, rocket launchers, C4) that would take the walls out.

I'm all for adding realism and variety to the game, but I think that a simple +50% defence bonus works well enough for city walls.

When units are attacking,it fight dosent go on for 50 years or however units per turn.It goes on for a few hours tops.the fight happens then 50 years passes.Then they attack again and so forth

 

[Zild]

And they spend 50 years sitting outside the city? Might as well besiege it properly whilst they are there, with the usual killing of workers, stealing of supplies, construction of siege equipment and so on...

 

[douche_bag]

well i guess the game is unrealistic that way.Maybe it could just go a month or even a week per turn and when a civ reaches the next era ,it would skip to 1000 ad or something.

 

[Jon Shafer]

Storming city walls is a tactical concern. Walls provide a bonus of +50% representing their strategic worth, but being unable to attack a city with Walls would not fit within the current system, especially when you can rush-build walls and reestablish your city's invulnerability in a single turn. If I knew my city would be unassailable you bet I'd spend money or population getting those Walls up.

 

[KabeDerlin]

I think this probably a bad idea. I mean if you had a year (at the least) to sit outside a wall Im sure you could find some other way of entering the city rather than calling up artillary. I think the 50% bonus for defenders is already good enough in my opinion.

Making a city invulnerable to attack is just too much of a bonus. Maybe increasing defender bonus to 75% or even 100% I could stand since that would be 2 to 1 odds in favor of the defender on an even match. The only problem is that the AI would have to get smarter...

Though to be truthful, have you ever tried taking a walled city in the Early Industrial Age without Artillary anyways?

 

[James I]

perhaps the defensive bonus could go up to 75%, but you have an option to build/buy a tunnel (like using a spy kinda deal) with mixed chances of causing reduction to the bonus until a wall was repaired, or something rebuilt....

 

[plastiqe]

I like the idea of better wall defences. I think there should be different levels of walls, so you could get basic walls with masonry, better walls with construction and super walls with feudalism.

[size=-2]yay for my new ISP! : )[/size]

 

[KabeDerlin]

Too many different kinds of walls and you end up with walls becoming obsolete way too fast.

 

[rhialto]

If teh tech tree is expanded to provide decent detail to earlir ages, different fortifications could be made interesting. I envision palisade, (stone) city wall, castle. In addition, walls should reduce the maximum city population, in order to make it a real decision to sell them later.

This does of course require a re-working for the Great Wall wonder.