Wanting to rebalance Exp, Imp and Ind.

[Watiggi]

Done. Thanks to Curns for the info/instructions and TAfirehawk for the mini-modcomp

CustomTraits:

Aggressive:
as per AggWithStables, see below.

Expansive:
+2 health
+50% faster settler production
+100% faster Granary production
+100% faster Harbour production

Industrious:
+50% faster worker production
+50% faster wonder production
+100% faster Forge production

Imperialistic:
+100% Great General emergence
+25% faster production for melee, gunpowder units

I'm looking for other possible changes to Imp (instead of +25% faster production for melee, gunpowder units):
+25% faster production for mounted, navy units
+25% faster production for seige units
+25% faster production for seige, navy units
free City Raider promotion for seige units

--------------------------

AggWithStables:

This one doesn't have the CustomTrait changes. It is for those who may want to try Aggressive with Stables out in a normal game. The Mongol Ger has had its cost increased for balance (much like the Zulu UB).

Aggressive:
free Combat I for melee, gunpowder
+100% faster Barracks production
+100% faster Stables production
+100% faster Drydock prodution

Mongol Ger costs 70 hammers.

 

[Aussie_Lurker]

One of the reasons I am trying to add a maintenance modifier and OccupationTimer modifier is so I can have the Imperialist Trait effect either maintenance modifiers for cities or occupation times for captured cities.

Aussie_Lurker.

 

[Curns]

Hi Watiggi,

Most of those changes are easy to make just by modifying 2 XML files. Unfortanatly there is no military production modifier built in but some modders have created one (see the CCCP in the mod components forum, but unfortinatly its not compatable with 2.08 yet).

The two files you need to modify are

Warlords\Assets\XML\Units\CIV4UnitInfos.xml
Warlords\Assets\XML\Civilizations\CIV4TraitInfos.xml

both are easy to read and can be edited in notepad without any dificulty. Just copy them over to

My Documents\My Games\Warlords\CustomAssets\XML\Units\
My Documents\My Games\Warlords\CustomAssets\XML\Civilizations\

respectivly.

Expansive: you said you wanted it to be pre 2.08 but you list health as 2, pre 2.08 it was actually 3. to change it to 3 open CIV4TraitInfos.xml and scroll down untill you find

<Type>TRAIT_EXPANSIVE</Type>
and change <iHealth>2</iHealth>
to <iHealth>3</iHealth>

now open CIV4UnitInfos.xml and search for

UNITCLASS_SETTLER

and scroll down untill you see

			<ProductionTraits>
				<ProductionTrait>
					<ProductionTraitType>TRAIT_IMPERIALIST</ProductionTraitType>
					<iProductionTrait>50</iProductionTrait>
				</ProductionTrait>
			</ProductionTraits>

and change TRAIT_IMPERIALIST to TRAIT_EXPANSIVE.

Thats it for Expansive.

Industrious: in CIV4TraitInfos.xml find <Type>TRAIT_INDUSTRIOUS</Type>

and change the 50 to 0 in each of the following

			<iMaxGlobalBuildingProductionModifier>50</iMaxGlobalBuildingProductionModifier>
			<iMaxTeamBuildingProductionModifier>50</iMaxTeamBuildingProductionModifier>
			<iMaxPlayerBuildingProductionModifier>50</iMaxPlayerBuildingProductionModifier>

in CIV4UnitInfos.xml search

<Class>UNITCLASS_WORKER</Class>

scroll down untill you find <ProductionTraits/> and replace it with

			<ProductionTraits>
				<ProductionTrait>
					<ProductionTraitType>TRAIT_INDUSTRIOUS</ProductionTraitType>
					<iProductionTrait>50</iProductionTrait>
				</ProductionTrait>
			</ProductionTraits>

thats it for Industrius

As for Imperialisitic you have already removed the settler production by changing it to expansive and as ive already explained there is no military production modifier at this stage.

Hope this helps

-Curns

 

[Watiggi]

Thanks heaps Curns

With the info in your post though, I can change it manually and have an entry for each military unit having a bonus production for imperialist. I have set it up so that Imperialistic is now +100% GG and +25% production for melee/gunpowder units. I'm going to see how it is. I might change it to +25% production for seige units only if it's a bit much. That might be more balanced.

Thanks for the help

 

[TAfirehawk]

Actually there was already a ProductionTrait for Worker....the Indian Worker doesn't have one.

And not sure why the MaxBuildingProductionModifiers need changed either.

I had already started on putting this into a modcomp so will continue from the main list changing Warlords v2.08:

Expansive:
+50% faster settler production
+2 health - same
+100% faster Granary production - same
+100% faster Harbour production - same

Industrious:
+50% faster worker production
+100 faster Forge production - same

Imperialisitic:
+100% Great General emergence - same
+50% faster military production - not easily done

EDIT
I missed the removed wonder production bonus....duh

 

[TAfirehawk]

It was probably easier to change the files and put them in the Custom Assets folder, but hey I wanted to make a mini-modcomp

Extract the RAR to the Warlords\MODS directory and load it up

 

[Watiggi]

Thanks for that TAfirehawk

I took the liberty of playing with the mod (hope you don't mind). Now it is set up as:

Expansive:
+2 health
+50% faster settler production
+100% faster Granary production
+100% faster Harbour production

Industrious:
+50% faster worker production
+50% faster wonder production <--- decided to put it back. Felt strange Ind not getting wonders
+100% faster Forge production

Imperialistic:
+100% Great General emergence
+25% faster production for melee, gunpower units

 

[TAfirehawk]

Thanks for that TAfirehawk

I took the liberty of playing with the mod (hope you don't mind). Now it is set up as:

Expansive:
+2 health
+50% faster settler production
+100% faster Granary production
+100% faster Harbour production

Industrious:
+50% faster worker production
+50% faster wonder production <--- decided to put it back. Felt strange Ind not getting wonders
+100% faster Forge production

Imperialistic:
+100% Great General emergence
+25% faster production for melee, gunpower units

Well I made it for you If you need anything else just let me know.

I never like using Custom Assets directory...in fact the ViSa mod deletes the whole thing every patch that is installed

 

[Watiggi]

Well I made it for you If you need anything else just let me know.

Cool Thanks again

 

[notagoodname]

This is great, i really like the idea of strong traits. It'd be nice if you could bring the other traits up a bit too.

Perhaps merge phi and creative into one good trait. So phi and creative both give +2 culture and +100% great people points.

Merging aggressive and protective so they both give each others bonuses wouldn't be too bad either.

Some civs like japan would need new traits if you merged the traits though, unless you could make the traits additive (that'd be awesome, perhaps too awesome).

 

[TAfirehawk]

This is great, i really like the idea of strong traits. It'd be nice if you could bring the other traits up a bit too.

Perhaps merge phi and creative into one good trait. So phi and creative both give +2 culture and +100% great people points.

Merging aggressive and protective so they both give each others bonuses wouldn't be too bad either.

Some civs like japan would need new traits if you merged the traits though, unless you could make the traits additive (that'd be awesome, perhaps too awesome).

Make a list as already started in this thread and I will make it

 

[Watiggi]

Aggressive:
free Combat I for melee, gunpowder units
+100% faster production of Barracks, Stables, Drydock

That might rebalance Aggressive more (although the Mongols will become rather strong with the Ger as it is). Would be interesting to see though.

Maybe:

Philosophical:
+100% Great People points
+1 Great People point in every city
+100% faster production of University

 

[TAfirehawk]

I will play around with the changed files you have and see what I can come up with for the extra stuff you want.

 

[Watiggi]

Ok thanks heaps The Aggressive one has been bothering me for a while. It looks balanced with the Stables now I think (although testing will tell). Genghis (and Kublai) are going to need to have the Ger made more expensive.

The Philosophical one is something I just thought of, off the cuff, when notagoodname made the comment about strengthening the other traits. It would be interesting to see if it's effective. Is it possible for it to have +1 GPP per city?

I have been playing some games with the Exp, Imp and Ind trait changes:

Expansive is fine. It can create large empires fast. The fact that it can *only* create large empires fast is what I like about it.

I am playing with Imperialisitic. I am still up in the air as to the military production bonus. It suits the Imp leader - can whip up a good offensive easily. I don't know about balance though. How do you know when it's balanced? I am finding that I can normally whip up a military and conquer easily anyway (which I think has more to do with the AI's inability to defend itself against a concentrated attack more than anything else). Maybe a seige and navy production bonus? That would satisfy both land imperialists and Vicky. I don't know...

Haven't tried Industrious yet.

Thanks for your interest in helping TAfirehawk. Much appreciated

 

[Curns]

Hi,

These are the tags that are editable for traits without SDK changes:

<iHealth> # /city
<iHappiness> # /city
<iMaxAnarchy> sets max turns of anarchy, -1 default, 0 spiritual
<iUpkeepModifier> civic upkeep modifier ie organised
<iLevelExperienceModifier> changes % experiance for promotions ie charasmatic
<iGreatPeopleRateModifier> changes great person birthrate
<iGreatGeneralRateModifier> ditto great general
<iDomesticGreatGeneralRateModifier> not sure what this does
<iMaxGlobalBuildingProductionModifier> world wonder production
<iMaxTeamBuildingProductionModifier> team project production ie Internet
<iMaxPlayerBuildingProductionModifier> National wonder production
<ExtraYieldThresholds/> gives +1 yield on tiles of # or more ie financial
<TradeYieldModifiers/> again not sure, isnt used in game but might be used in a scenario
<CommerceChanges/> changes the commerce /city ie creative
<CommerceModifiers/> % rate change commerce, not used in main game
<FreePromotions/> sets which free promotions to give
<FreePromotionUnitCombats/> sets which combat classes to give the promotions to. this overrides the promotions combat class ie can give a promotion to a unit regardless of if it can normally recieve it.

As you can see you cant give +1 GPP per city. (and if you did change the SDK to allow +1 GPP per city this would imediatly change to +2 with the +100%GP birth rate)

The free promotions give ALL of the promotions to ALL of the combat classes listed so it isnt possible to combine aggressive and protective.

As for Philisophical maybe give them +20% research.

-Curns

 

[zyphyr]

<iDomesticGreatGeneralRateModifier> not sure what this does

My guess on that one would be that it modifies the GG XP gain for fights inside your own borders (much as the Great Wall does).

Merging aggressive and protective so they both give each others bonuses wouldn't be too bad either.

Given the limitations on how free combat promotions are handled, it would probably be most effective to not merge them and instead to give leaders that currently have one of the two traits the other as well (for a total of 3 on those individuals).

 

[Watiggi]

<iDomesticGreatGeneralRateModifier> not sure what this does

It's for the Great Wall: Double Great General with combat within own borders. (edit: beat me to it )

As you can see you cant give +1 GPP per city. (and if you did change the SDK to allow +1 GPP per city this would imediatly change to +2 with the +100%GP birth rate)

Yeah, I didn't think it would be easy. I might just leave Phi as it is for now. I don't really play it enough to know what it needs.

 

[Aussie_Lurker]

For what it's worth, I am in the process of trying to add more tags to the LeaderTraits XML file. So far I have added <iNumCitiesMaintenanceModifier>, <iDistanceMaintenanceModifier> and <iOccupationTimerModifier>, more will hopefully follow.

Aussie_Lurker.

 

[TAfirehawk]

For what it's worth, I am in the process of trying to add more tags to the LeaderTraits XML file. So far I have added <iNumCitiesMaintenanceModifier>, <iDistanceMaintenanceModifier> and <iOccupationTimerModifier>, more will hopefully follow.

Aussie_Lurker.

That is great

 

[TAfirehawk]

Ok thanks heaps The Aggressive one has been bothering me for a while. It looks balanced with the Stables now I think (although testing will tell). Genghis (and Kublai) are going to need to have the Ger made more expensive.

The Philosophical one is something I just thought of, off the cuff, when notagoodname made the comment about strengthening the other traits. It would be interesting to see if it's effective. Is it possible for it to have +1 GPP per city?

I have been playing some games with the Exp, Imp and Ind trait changes:

Expansive is fine. It can create large empires fast. The fact that it can *only* create large empires fast is what I like about it.

I am playing with Imperialisitic. I am still up in the air as to the military production bonus. It suits the Imp leader - can whip up a good offensive easily. I don't know about balance though. How do you know when it's balanced? I am finding that I can normally whip up a military and conquer easily anyway (which I think has more to do with the AI's inability to defend itself against a concentrated attack more than anything else). Maybe a seige and navy production bonus? That would satisfy both land imperialists and Vicky. I don't know...

Haven't tried Industrious yet.

Thanks for your interest in helping TAfirehawk. Much appreciated

I am glad to help, as are others here. I have free time every once in awhile from working on ViSa