What do you think is the worst civ?

[greekguy]

A lot of people seem to talk about which is the best civ a lot, but i want to know what civ you guys don't like at all (you can say any of the civs, including conquests). This could also help newbies when picking a civ for their first game, so they choose one that helps them do a little better. The civs i really don't like are spain and russia. i feel that spain has a bad uu and russia doesn't have good trait mix. Also, i left most civ favorites (persian, chinese, egypt,etc.)off, but i put some civs i saw other people said they like on the list, so i can see what you all think of them. So what civ do you hate? :shakehead

 

[punkbass2000]

|Portugal|

 

[gunnerxtr]

yep i voted other, and my vote would go to portugal. their traits, while good individually, arent a good combination and their UU is not good at all IMO, especially since it replaces the caravel (a unit that doesnt have much of a lifespan in CIV3)

 

[greekguy]

sorry i forgot to put portugal on the list, but i didn't want to put every civ on the list. i do agree with both of you though that portugal is not good.

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

Portugal. Without thinking twice for a single second.

In fact, your list contains some of the very strongest Civs (Sumeria at foremost, France, England).
Zulu and Mongols are quite bad as well.

 

[punkbass2000]

You have Sumeria on there?! Wow. Didn't een notice, just scanned twice for Portugal. But yeah, they're in my top five, all in all. France and England are quite good as well, as DocT points out. I would say Carthage, Spain and Russia aren't that bad either, though I guess they're reasonable candidates.

 

[vikingruler]

i think france is the worst civ ever. first of all their uu is ****. the musketter only has an upped defense, i think. but aside from that, it cant UPGRADE. so that means, if you upgrade all your pikemen, to musketters, they cant go up to riflemen, then infantry, and then if you want mech infantry plus the french dont have the best trait mix. industrious is really good, but in C3C the increased worker actions is only about 1 turn faster then normal workers! also, industrious pretty much sucks. the commerce increase only kicks in with metropolisis, and the cheaper marketplaces isnt that good, because you can build them when you still expanding, so you wont build them often. also, greekguy, russia is a really good civ. the uu is amazing and the traits work together perfectly. if you want more info on how good russian is , refer to the thread, the cossack in civ 3 strategey and tips started by vikingruler

 

[greekguy]

vikingruler: russia is not good!!! :thumbdown the uu is good, i'll admit, but their traits are useless. science is one of the worse traits since all you get is cheap libraries and 3 free techs. (and that's if you make it to the modern age) Also expansionist works better with something like millitary or seafaring, russia is neither. so you can tell russia has nothing going for it.

btw, industrious doesn't suck, it just got toned down in C3C.

punkbass2000: i don't think sumeria is bad, i just wanted to see how much people like certain civs when they are on a worst civ list. sorry for the confusion.

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

vikingruler, that is plain simply wrong. Almost anything you wrote .
The Musketeer is a gamebreaker UU. The 3.4.1 VC3/PtW version was horrible. The 2.5.1 C3C incarnation is insanly powerful. The fact it has a defensive bombard has a big impact on the AI attack strength calculation (effectively, they count 1 HP less for their own units). Two Musketeers on a hill won't be attacked with Crusaders at all; before Cavs, they AI will never attack them, just like they never attack Armies.
Musketeers upgrade like anything else.
Most important, with Musketeers you can entirely skip Rifles and warmonger efficiently before Infantry, while you will suffer horrible casualties with Musketmen against Cavs.
IND is not that great in C3C, agreed. But, starting with Masonry and Alpha is very strong - immediate GLib prebuild! And COM is a killer trait from DG on anyway.
We just won a Sid SG with France, and I was really amazed about the perfoermance of France here.

Small note: COM gives no shield benefit fro any city improvements, so no cheaper Markets. The additional gp is nice, but no gamebreaker. The lower corruption OTOH is.

 

[punkbass2000]

Don't forget starting with Alph.

Yeah, Russia's okay, not great. France is definitely better.

 

[punkbass2000]

vikingruler: russia is not good!!! :thumbdown the uu is good, i'll admit, but their traits are useless. science is one of the worse traits since all you get is cheap libraries and 3 free techs. (and that's if you make it to the modern age) Also expansionist works better with something like millitary or seafaring, russia is neither. so you can tell russia has nothing going for it.

btw, industrious doesn't suck, it just got toned down in C3C.

punkbass2000: i don't think sumeria is bad, i just wanted to see how much people like certain civs when they are on a worst civ list. sorry for the confusion.

Token Agr. civ?

 

[The Omega]

vikingruler: russia is not good!!! :thumbdown the uu is good, i'll admit, but their traits are useless. science is one of the worse traits since all you get is cheap libraries and 3 free techs. (and that's if you make it to the modern age) Also expansionist works better with something like millitary or seafaring, russia is neither. so you can tell russia has nothing going for it.

btw, industrious doesn't suck, it just got toned down in C3C.

punkbass2000: i don't think sumeria is bad, i just wanted to see how much people like certain civs when they are on a worst civ list. sorry for the confusion.

I like scientific......

 

[Durkz]

scientific OWNZ!!! take look at this
Click me
I got 3 SGLs by the 730 BC on emperor
+ You get libraries/universities/r.Labs by half price + 3 Free tech's

 

[Flintlock]

I voted Incans, since I couldn't think of anything good about them. Their UU is, IMO, absolutely useless, I never find any use for the increased attack/defense, I turn barbs on sedentary so barb fighting is out, and by the time I get one out, all the AI nations have warriors in their cities, so rushing is out.
But then again, I've only played one game as them, and generally never play as a non-european civ. And I'm part Portugese, so couldn't stand flagging them as the worst civ.

scientific OWNZ!!! ...
You get libraries/universities/r.Labs by half price + 3 Free tech's

I myself have found no use for the reduced price libraries and universities and whatnot since I dont ever do my own research anyway.

 

[gunnerxtr]

I turn barbs on sedentary so barb fighting is out

well of course the Inca are bad when playing with barbs on sedentary, all expansionist civs are bad when playing on sedentary because there are no goodie huts.

 

[predesad]

hmm, i think russia is a good civ, i love the scientific trait, 30 shield librairies and then cheaper universities and the 3 free techs are not a slouch. i am in a pbem as russia and the free tech at the start of the middle ages catapulted me from barely keeping up to being the tech leader because i also built a lot of cheap libraries at the same time and now i am at least 3 techs ahead (and my free tech was feudalism, if you have iron you have to love that.)

i think the inca is also a good civ, i absolutely love the expansionist trait (which is partialy why i like russia) and even with nonexpansionists i play with raging barbs. i dont like the higher cost scout unit, but still a good civ.

and france, a very good civ, imho.

who else did you guys complain about, let's see - Spain, that is really an awesome uu if you use it right. sure, it has low attack and defense, but it moves 6 tiles regardless of terrain just like the explorer. awesome for pillaging, cpaturing workers / settlers and if you're taking on a civ with no iron or saltpeter they are good units for warring, granted that is an isolated situation.

and the Mongols, you almost have to warmonger with them, but i love them. again, their uu is best suited for certain situations but also has an advantage when stacked with pikes, the pike will defend an elite keshik whereas an elite knight will defend making them possibly more vulnerable to attacks. my first emporer attempt was with the mongols (okay, i haven't actually finished that game yet, but only because i managed to somehow let the game get all the way to the modern age mostly because i could not reach the other continent until magnetism / navigation and i am clearly in control except for those annoying greeks, oh i am rambling now)

i would agree that portugal is not a good civ, mainly because i almost never use caravels because as someone else pointed out, the age of caravels is short. and their trait combo is not so good, expansionist is best on pangea, seafaring on arch. the two together are okay at best on continents. the other civ i really don't like is the hittites. here i am a very big fan of the expansionist trait and i pick two expansionists as the worst civs.

 

[Capt Buttkick]

Portugal was just recently played in a Cotm and I don't see how they're all that bad on continents. Exp will be good for as long as it usually is anyway (I have no luck with GHs myself, so Exp always sux anyway ). Sea is good for reaching other continents and you're bound to have a lot of coastal cities so a nice increase in income, espescially if you like to fit those coastal cities tight
Sure, their UU sucks, but there are so many other UUs that I never use. At least the Carrack will kick off your GA at an ok time in many games (although not great). The Impi will either not kick off your GA or kick it off too early. Zulu are my choice.

And Inca/Sumeria shouldn't be up there at all. Their UUs both belong on my never-use list, but Agr is so powerful, I'd trade most combos for just Agr (provided the start isn't on an island deprived of fresh water...).

 

[punkbass2000]

You don't think a 10-shield Spearman is a good UU?!

 

[gunnerxtr]

That was my reaction too, punkbass2000, of course maybe he means never use it as in it will spark a GA in despotism? not sure tho....

 

[Tomoyo]

IMO you absolutely cannot choose an agricultural civ as the worst. I vote Mongols. Portugal actually has a decent trait, with SEA, and the Zulu have a cool UU.

EDIT: Argh!!! I voted Zulu by a misclick!