Lachlan
Great Builder of Civs !
Oh, sorry, i thinked to Frank empire of Charlemagne
At this epoch, two christian empires existed : at west Frank Empire and at east Byzantine Empire, they were never at war because not common borders... Isn't it ?
What is your favorite new BtS Civ?
- Thread starter Phoenix1595
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Oh, sorry, i thinked to Frank empire of Charlemagne
At this epoch, two christian empires existed : at west Frank Empire and at east Byzantine Empire, they were never at war because not common borders... Isn't it ?It wasn't until the traditional middle ages (1100 - 1350) that the HRE got into quarrels with the pope - they actually fought a few wars in an attempt to conquer the vatican. The HRE was created in 800 BC by Charlemagne (he conquered what is now modern germany and was crowned first emperor). The HRE "golden age" if you will was 1100-1400 where they controlled central europe, streching from eastern france to the western fringes of poland.
The Holy Roman Emperor gets his title because Charlemagne (and his lineage) was crowned Emperor of what was intended to be a Christian region (in other words, a "Papal" nation if you will, not just limited to the vatican). There was a split - I don't know why - but it formed the Pope/vatican and it stole the thunder from the title of Holy Roman Emperor. That's why the HRE attacked the Vatican, because they felt that the Kaiser ("emperor" in german) was authorized to act as the Pope, and that the vatican Pope was a fake.
The HRE technically lasted to the 1700's/1800's but as you have no doubt read on the anti-HRE threads on this board, the HRE had - problems - holding their states together into a cohesive unit and by this time, the principalities identified themselves more as Prussians, Austrians, Swiss, etc then as a member of the HRE (and this led to the unification and formation of modern germany)
EDIT - and the thing about catholic europe and orthodox byzantium - the byzantines were powerful and open confrontation was stupid, but since all the medieval Popes viewed orthodoxy as heresy (much the same way they later did protestantism) they didn't really care if the Crusaders sacked Byzantine lands on the way to the Holy Land. In fact, this European indifference to the Byzantines is why the Ottomans were able to destroy them because they didn't get any assistance.
The Holy Roman Emperor gets his title because Charlemagne (and his lineage) was crowned Emperor of what was intended to be a Christian region (in other words, a "Papal" nation if you will, not just limited to the vatican). There was a split - I don't know why - but it formed the Pope/vatican and it stole the thunder from the title of Holy Roman Emperor. That's why the HRE attacked the Vatican, because they felt that the Kaiser ("emperor" in german) was authorized to act as the Pope, and that the vatican Pope was a fake.
The HRE technically lasted to the 1700's/1800's but as you have no doubt read on the anti-HRE threads on this board, the HRE had - problems - holding their states together into a cohesive unit and by this time, the principalities identified themselves more as Prussians, Austrians, Swiss, etc then as a member of the HRE (and this led to the unification and formation of modern germany)
EDIT - and the thing about catholic europe and orthodox byzantium - the byzantines were powerful and open confrontation was stupid, but since all the medieval Popes viewed orthodoxy as heresy (much the same way they later did protestantism) they didn't really care if the Crusaders sacked Byzantine lands on the way to the Holy Land. In fact, this European indifference to the Byzantines is why the Ottomans were able to destroy them because they didn't get any assistance.
I'm not particularly crazy or have a favorite of any of them (at least, not in ridiculous proportion), although I picked the Mayans. Why?
Research Hunting, and you can build a 4 strength unit immediately, that is immune to the first strikes received by the 3 strength unit you can research afterwards? Score!
Research Hunting, and you can build a 4 strength unit immediately, that is immune to the first strikes received by the 3 strength unit you can research afterwards? Score!
They're my number one now
Phoenix1595
Lord of the Two Lands
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Looks like a close one between HRE and the Dutch, followed way behind by the Byzantines. I think these are all the ones I am looking forward to, plus the Native Americans. I suppose the Khmer is up there, but I am still bummed about Sury's leaderhead.
If a moderator is out there: anyway for either me or you to extend the poll dates? I made this poll before we knew the release date, and now it looks like it will be closed two weeks before the game even comes out (of course, someone could always make a new post-release poll). Thanks.
If a moderator is out there: anyway for either me or you to extend the poll dates? I made this poll before we knew the release date, and now it looks like it will be closed two weeks before the game even comes out (of course, someone could always make a new post-release poll). Thanks.
Spearthrower
Thrower of spears
Khmer for finally getting a look in. Global maps always need a SE Asian civ! 
dutchking
Deity
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^About Global Maps...
Since there are so many civs now, I'd wish they'd make a GIGANTIC size especially for this map (about 1500 kb, most of our comps could handle it). And have all the civs on it! Even though Byzantines and Ottomans...I know...but we could work it out! Post 700!!! ![[party]](/images/smilies/partytime.gif "Party [party]")
Since there are so many civs now, I'd wish they'd make a GIGANTIC size especially for this map (about 1500 kb, most of our comps could handle it). And have all the civs on it! Even though Byzantines and Ottomans...I know...but we could work it out!
Post 700!!! The Navy Seal
Emperor
Why is HRE in secound?
dutchking
Deity
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DUTCH!!! 
cybrxkhan
Asian Xwedodah
they want to anger HRE-haters like me.
cybrxkhan
Asian Xwedodah
^probably.
dutchking
Deity
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I don't really understand why they're so pissed...I think it's pretty cool that Charlemagne has his own civ...They couldn't make a civ called the "Charlemagne Empire", could they? Why not the Holy Roman Empire? Even though I'd rather see another deserving civ before it...
dutchking
Deity
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Alright, notice I did say that I'd like to see another deserving civ before it...let's just leave it at that...
The Navy Seal
Emperor
I think your right.
@Dutchking: All right, I didn't see the last part of your post. But still, I would have just added a medieval king for France or Germany (Phillip Augustus, Otto I, or Barbarossa), and renamed him for the Charlemagne scenario. I thought for sure that was what Firaxis was doing--they did it before in Civ3. Now, we got De Gaulle and the HRE...
Well, back on topic...
I'm warming up to the Maya. I'm not much of a rush-player, but the Holkan is easily suited for rushing attacks, although it is vulnerable to copper-containing empires. The way I see it, they can kill mounted units (horses resource), and you can rush before they get to Iron Working (so civilizations that will have access to the iron but not the copper resource are weak). Two out of the three you can beat, which is pretty good for a rush. Not to mention they get the Expansive and Financial traits, for cheaper workers, cheaper granaries, healthier cities, and better commerce. Their UB also fits in perfectly after an early rush to take somebody's capital--the growing phase. More of a reason to rush for Construction (as if you need one), and the combined bonuses of the Expansive health and the Ball Court will let your cities get big.
Well, back on topic...
I'm warming up to the Maya. I'm not much of a rush-player, but the Holkan is easily suited for rushing attacks, although it is vulnerable to copper-containing empires. The way I see it, they can kill mounted units (horses resource), and you can rush before they get to Iron Working (so civilizations that will have access to the iron but not the copper resource are weak). Two out of the three you can beat, which is pretty good for a rush. Not to mention they get the Expansive and Financial traits, for cheaper workers, cheaper granaries, healthier cities, and better commerce. Their UB also fits in perfectly after an early rush to take somebody's capital--the growing phase. More of a reason to rush for Construction (as if you need one), and the combined bonuses of the Expansive health and the Ball Court will let your cities get big.
