What would you pick?

[chicorbeef]

Hi, I just wanted to know what other people's opinions on a start like this is. I'm playing the Iroquois and have a great start, wondering how best to capitalize it. What pantheon and social policy would you pick, what are some expansion choices? I have ideas myself but I wanna see other people's opinions first.

Spoiler :

 

[Hinin]

Depends on what policy Nobunaga takes and your difficulty level. Here is what I would do at Emperor difficulty (the one I use most often) : I would put one city south of Onondaga, one near the river on the right (to act as a fortress against Mongolia) and place the majority of my development efforts toward the north (where you have your monopoly, plenty of forests and a Natural Wonder). As for the policy / pantheon part :

• If Oda goes Authority (so threats on both sides), I would go Tradition / Goddess of Protection : you have Marble and your UB to have the best wonders in your capital, and denying Japan's best pantheon while strenghtening your own defense is good I think (you'll need to go toward the bottom part of the tech tree just after unlocking your UB though to have enough protection and faith to found reliably)
• If Oda goes Progress, I would go Authority / God of Renewal : the science from markets and forests is good at maintaining a good research output while going toward the bottom half, and you'll be able to play the land grabbing / bully game against him thanks to you UU. Once you've neutered him, I would focus on Mongolia. One thing that could be interesting with that scenario is forward-settling just north of Kyoto : you'll have plenty of resources and jungles to develop and protect yourself, and bully him even more.
• If Oda goes Tradition, I would go Progress / God of Renewal : one city south to gain the Jade and the Horse, but full economic development up north, where you have all you need for a strong empire in the mid-game. Protecting the east river against Mongolia will be key though. You can research your UU if you need some defense, but the majority of your research will be in the upper half of the tech tree.

In all cases, I would try to ally Valletta, especially if its UU is good. It could be key to beat Mongolia later.

I wouldn't go Goddess of the Hunt. Despite a good beginning at your capital (3 camps), later it falls off (nothing south, almost nothing east, a bit north), while God of Renewal will scale better in the long term. However, I would prioritize shrines in order to not fall behind faith-wise early on with that pantheon.

 

[Noob Fanboy]

Since turn 0 I would go monument stonehenge then looking to buy a worker instead of producing it. Even on Deity Stonehenge is not that difficult to get. Then I would go with renewal / progress then focus on longhouses then on working towards terracotta army. Good defensive cities and good timed wars with your UU would eventually give you an advantage towards the aggressive AIs at the side

 

[andersw]

I would say all three policy openers are viable and you can make a choice depending on the playstyle you want.
With that said, beware of Mongolia gobbling up the entire world, even more so if he gets "god of expanse" (it scales op with UB).
For pantheon, depends, I'd strongly consider taking "god of expanse" to steal of from the mongols.
If not , it depends what policy choice, are your intents wide, conquest or tall 6 city empire?

 

[Laz0r]

I would probably go authority or progress and try to get out as many cities as possible. After getting the UB and maybe markets I would suggest going right for forges/arenas/barracks/watermills. As far as settling locations, settling your first near the natural wonder and then the rest would be best sent south. After all those excellent lands south of you are taken, expand north and claim all that. Place your eastern-most cities keeping mind you'll want a good defensive terrain against mongolia who can be very dangerous.

 

[chicorbeef]

Thanks for the advice everyone.

My main plan was indeed to go Goddess of the Renewal. I strongly considered Goddess of the Hunt as well, since I'd have 6 easy access camps with just 2 cities, but Renewal has strong science bonuses and will scale much better with expansions down in the south. My first expansion was gonna be the city to the northwest actually, it has the potential to be a very good city quickly, and can split Settler production to help settle north/south simultaneously.

God of the Expanse has already been taken so that's not really an option. Protection is an option I hadn't considered, but I think I'm not going to go for it because I want to prioritize my UB and go for defensive settling, so I don't see too much a reason to go down to the lower half of the tree. AI Japan doesn't tend to utilize or even pick Protection very often anyway, so I'm not too concerned about that.

I was debating Progress/Authority, I think I have too much good land and Iroquois bonuses are more expansionist in nature, so I don't really want to go Tradition. I was not actually planning on settling those floodplains to the east, just settling slightly to its northwest/southwest.

I'm surprised Mongolia is considered this dangerous of a threat, there's not a lot of city-states he can viably tribute and he's in the corner of the map, but I may end up having a harder time against Mongolia than I'm anticipating.

Since turn 0 I would go monument stonehenge then looking to buy a worker instead of producing it. Even on Deity Stonehenge is not that difficult to get. Then I would go with renewal / progress then focus on longhouses then on working towards terracotta army. Good defensive cities and good timed wars with your UU would eventually give you an advantage towards the aggressive AIs at the side

This is actually a good strategy I should have considered. Of course it's a bit late to go for Stonehenge now. I went Trapping first because I saw the camps and I figured getting camps out and then picking Hunt would be a strong kickstart to my culture. I've shifted away from Hunt after seeing the land south, but that was my intention beginning the game.

I'm still wondering if an offensive war with Japan is going to be worth it, but I'm leaning towards Progress/defense right now. I'll see how it goes.

 

[chicorbeef]

If anyone wants to play this game from the beginning, my initial save is below. It's on Standard Speed, Continents, Deity difficulty, events/tech trading disabled.

Screenshot of my current game progress in the spoiler:

Spoiler :

I have 7 cities, have completed Progress, picked God of Renewal, am in a two front war right now. I've lost one city but I think I can hold on to the others.

Any suggestions for my Religion?

 

[Noob Fanboy]

The game is on Deity? Interesting, to be honest I normally play on Epic, the timing for certain things in Standard is quite different, I'll play and share later.

P.D: For religion, I would go with orders here to be honest
EDIT: Nevermind, there are ancient ruins. I started with free spearman and +production, these settings are not my favorite ones

 

[Noob Fanboy]

I was able to build stonehenge + terracotta army. Apart from that we have quite similar stats and similar city spots. I am thinking about entering to Medieval Eral with Chivalry though but i'm still unsure

 

[chicorbeef]

Nice, thanks for trying it out! You seem to be doing better than me in happiness/gold at least, I'm playing pretty sloppy. I can tell we settled cities in different orders as they are in different stages of development. We have almost the exact same city spots except I settled one city the Japanese took.

I didn't see too much purpose in Terracotta Army, perhaps it would have been a good idea since it was up for grabs for quite awhile (I don't remember it might still be up).

I'm going for Education to trigger the Medieval scaling quicker, in hindsight I probably should have just went for Steel instead.

The followers in my game that were taken were Veneration, Orders, and Cooperation.

 

[Bruhmoment]

Isn't deity like difficulty 10? Damn
Not sure why noob didn't settle the city in the middle, that is a really good spot. 2 cattle, bison, cocoa, (and maybe bananas), stone, and horses.

 

[Noob Fanboy]

Isn't deity like difficulty 10? Damn
Not sure why noob didn't settle the city in the middle, that is a really good spot. 2 cattle, bison, cocoa, (and maybe bananas), stone, and horses.

Super hard to defend on Deity Standard. It's better to let the AI settle that city and then conquer it yourself later. Btw I fear that game, Standard speed is not my thing, maybe I will continue it this week.

@chicorbeef , I got terracotta army as soon as it was available, that delayed my development a bit I think, but it's a good inversion in the long run

 

[Bruhmoment]

Super hard to defend on Deity Standard. It's better to let the AI settle that city and then conquer it yourself later. Btw I fear that game, Standard speed is not my thing, maybe I will continue it this week.

@chicorbeef , I got terracotta army as soon as it was available, that delayed my development a bit I think, but it's a good inversion in the long run

What speed do you play on, then?

 

[Noob Fanboy]

Epic, I think its the most balanced speed

 

[ridjack]

Epic, I think its the most balanced speed

I'd be curious to hear your thoughts on this. The game already feels skewed towards warmongers on standard speed, so giving them even more advantages feels like it would be less balanced, not more.

 

[Bruhmoment]

I'd be curious to hear your thoughts on this. The game already feels skewed towards warmongers on standard speed, so giving them even more advantages feels like it would be less balanced, not more.

And also more time for the A.I to bribe attack you
Yea pretty much gives the A.I more advantage than you

 

[Noob Fanboy]

I'd be curious to hear your thoughts on this. The game already feels skewed towards warmongers on standard speed, so giving them even more advantages feels like it would be less balanced, not more.

It's more balanced from the player point of view, you have more time to use your UU and the AI spam a bit less units. In Standard you don't get enough time to use your units before you have to upgrade them, unless you heavily beeline an specific military tech

 

[ridjack]

It's more balanced from the player point of view, you have more time to use your UU and the AI spam a bit less units. In Standard you don't get enough time to use your units before you have to upgrade them, unless you heavily beeline an specific military tech

That's not "more balanced," though. It's specifically tilting the balance in favor of warmongers, which the game already favors.