Avahz Darkwood
Emperor
It may sound strange but I have never heard of it...
Does it go by another name. I assume it has something to do with gunpowder...
Does it go by another name. I assume it has something to do with gunpowder...
Whats a "Saltpeter"
- Thread starter Avahz Darkwood
- Start date
VanOranje
God-Emperor
Its a chemical compound, dont ask me preciously what it made of but your right because its used to make gunpowder.
duke o' york
It don't mean a thing....
BlueMonday
Can I Kick It?
Saltpeter + sulfur + charcoal = gunpowder
Vinc
Prince
I was wondering that too...
So I guess that's the strategic ressources to do early gun units like the Cossack. I guess the marine also, wich is not early.
So I guess that's the strategic ressources to do early gun units like the Cossack. I guess the marine also, wich is not early.
ChrTh
Happy Yule!
For reality's sake, once you discover Medicine or Scientific Method,
you shouldn't have to have the Saltpetre (I prefer this spelling) resource (I'd choose Chemistry, but since it follows immediately after gunpowder, that's pretty silly). By 1770 (don't remember the exact year), the Europeans finally figured out how to manufacture it (instead of trading for it). The game should reflect that
you shouldn't have to have the Saltpetre (I prefer this spelling) resource (I'd choose Chemistry, but since it follows immediately after gunpowder, that's pretty silly). By 1770 (don't remember the exact year), the Europeans finally figured out how to manufacture it (instead of trading for it). The game should reflect that
D_L_26
Surface Marshal
I thought salt peter was what they gave soldiers so they wouldnt be horny? Or am I missing something
From encyclopedia.com:
potassium nitrate, chemical compound, KNO3, occurring as colorless, prismatic crystals or as a white powder; it is found pure in nature as the mineral saltpeter (or niter). It is slightly soluble in cold water and very soluble in hot water. When it decomposes (on heating) it releases oxygen. Potassium nitrate is prepared commercially by the reaction of potassium chloride with sodium nitrate. It has been used extensively in the manufacture of gunpowder since about the 12th cent.; it is also used in explosives, fireworks, matches, and fertilizers, and as a preservative in foods (especially meats). It is sometimes used in medicine as a diuretic.
potassium nitrate, chemical compound, KNO3, occurring as colorless, prismatic crystals or as a white powder; it is found pure in nature as the mineral saltpeter (or niter). It is slightly soluble in cold water and very soluble in hot water. When it decomposes (on heating) it releases oxygen. Potassium nitrate is prepared commercially by the reaction of potassium chloride with sodium nitrate. It has been used extensively in the manufacture of gunpowder since about the 12th cent.; it is also used in explosives, fireworks, matches, and fertilizers, and as a preservative in foods (especially meats). It is sometimes used in medicine as a diuretic.
TrailblazingScot
I was kittenOFchaos
Dude in chariot...if Europeans could manufacture saltpeter in the 1770s why in the "American Civil War" in 1862 did the Union need to get 5 ship loads of it from the Du Pont company in India???
In fact had Britain intervened cos of a confed win at Sharpsburg (only called Antetium cos of the Union winning) then the Union would have had no saltpetet, have run out of gunpowder and been whooped by the British
In fact had Britain intervened cos of a confed win at Sharpsburg (only called Antetium cos of the Union winning) then the Union would have had no saltpetet, have run out of gunpowder and been whooped by the British
CurtSibling
ENEMY ACE™
- Joined
- Aug 31, 2001
- Messages
- 29,453
A vital compound for gunpower production, well back then anyway..!
"Pass the salt, Peter!"
Okay, I'll get my coat...
"Pass the salt, Peter!"
Okay, I'll get my coat...
ChrTh
Happy Yule!
Originally posted by kittenOFchaos
Dude in chariot...if Europeans could manufacture saltpeter in the 1770s why in the "American Civil War" in 1862 did the Union need to get 5 ship loads of it from the Du Pont company in India???
In fact had Britain intervened cos of a confed win at Sharpsburg (only called Antetium cos of the Union winning) then the Union would have had no saltpetet, have run out of gunpowder and been whooped by the British
Well, if you look at the link above ("Eat Lead") you'll see the description for making saltpetre...from 1862. So obviously it was already known how to manufacture it.
I'm not familiar with the DuPont incident, but I hardly see that as an argument against. I mean, Britain knews how to make guns in WWII, yet they still bought a lot from the US. It takes awhile to make saltpetre (several months from scratch). If the British in India have extra lying about, I'm sure they'd sell it, especially since it being natural it doesn't have an unlimited shelf life.
(I'll ignore the notion that Britain would ever have committed troops to the Confederate cause)
To clarify my original statement, Europe did not know the "recipe" for saltpetre until around 1770 (again, I don't know the exact year). Obviously the recipe was well known in the East. But once the Europeans figured out how to make it, they were no longer dependent upon the East for their saltpetre.
How you would represent this in the game is tough; obviously saltpetre (or the ingredients to manufacture it) occurs naturally, but once you know the recipe, well, I could make it in my backyard (heck, I'm even raking the leaves tomorrow). That's why I think the discovery of medicine or scientific method should negate the need for the resource. OR...
How about, once you reach Medicine or Scientific Method, workers are able to "create" the resource on a specific type of square (say, grasslands)? That would be probably be the most realistic; it allows some advantage to those who have it at first, but eventually everyone could have it, but if they want it, they have to commit resources to it.
beorhtwulf
Chieftain
- Joined
- Oct 9, 2001
- Messages
- 30
Well, that's sort of what happens -- the more
advanced units like tanks no longer need saltpeter, only the primitive black powder units. Granted it's not tied to a tech, but still....
advanced units like tanks no longer need saltpeter, only the primitive black powder units. Granted it's not tied to a tech, but still....
ChrTh
Happy Yule!
Is that the case? I wasn't sure. If so, then yeah, reality is reflected well there.
Do resources still show up after they've outlived their usefulness? If you (or any other civilization) no longer require bronze, for example, do the bronze icons disappear from the screen?
Good question ChrTh. I wold think it might also depend on other Civ's that may be dependant on the resource too. Hmm.
But I think I'll go out on a limb and say they stick around forever. They seem to be very rare according to some of the previews I've seen. Like the guy building F15's but couldn't do tanks cause he didn't have rubber.
But I think I'll go out on a limb and say they stick around forever. They seem to be very rare according to some of the previews I've seen. Like the guy building F15's but couldn't do tanks cause he didn't have rubber.
Morten Blaabjerg
Settler
You forget, that you can still sell your "obsolete" ressources to tribes less fortunate in the tech race... Might be a cheap way to make friends. You don't need it any longer yourself anyway.
.:KNAS:.
Civfanatic
that seem to be pretty nice , moorten but i wouldnt sell uranium though
, moorten but i wouldnt sell uranium thoughbrandon749
Warlord
Originally posted by kittenOFchaos
Dude in chariot...if Europeans could manufacture saltpeter in the 1770s why in the "American Civil War" in 1862 did the Union need to get 5 ship loads of it from the Du Pont company in India???
In fact had Britain intervened cos of a confed win at Sharpsburg (only called Antetium cos of the Union winning) then the Union would have had no saltpetet, have run out of gunpowder and been whooped by the British
Du Pont is an American company that was manufacturing gunpowder before the war of 1812 in the United States.
Robespierre
Committee Chairman
Saltpeter is a chemical that is made when a lot of bats in Argentina defecate on cavern walls. That's why Germany was worried when World War I first started because they didn't have control of the Atlantic and hence didn't have access to Argentina's large saltpeter deposits - all of this changed when the Germans discovered a chemical process that allowed them to basically make unlimited gunpowder without saltpeter. I guess this will be impossible in Civ3 - if you ain't got saltpeter, all the science in the world ain't gonna save you
TrailblazingScot
I was kittenOFchaos
Read the bit I got my info from...a Du Pont AGENT in India bought 5 shiploads of saltpeter for the Union...but the British wouldn't let it leave due to one particular row over the blockage the Union had setup. The Union victory at Antetium meant Britain wasn't going to go to war with the Union to secure her cotton supply and helping the Union was profitable for many reasons:
1. selling war material, saltpeter, clothes, guns and ships.
2. europe needed food as there was a famine! KING CORN beat KING COTTON.
3. In 1862 there were still stockpiles of cotton from the large pre-war harvests.
4. Merchant raiders of the confed were giving more commerce to British flag bearing ships that the confed wouldn't attack.
I don't buy this idea that the Union was artifically producing saltpeter and only shipped it in cos it was easier...had the British withheld the saltpeter the Union would have been as ****ed as Britain in ww1 & ww2 without America providing a nice trade in war goods.
1. selling war material, saltpeter, clothes, guns and ships.
2. europe needed food as there was a famine! KING CORN beat KING COTTON.
3. In 1862 there were still stockpiles of cotton from the large pre-war harvests.
4. Merchant raiders of the confed were giving more commerce to British flag bearing ships that the confed wouldn't attack.
I don't buy this idea that the Union was artifically producing saltpeter and only shipped it in cos it was easier...had the British withheld the saltpeter the Union would have been as ****ed as Britain in ww1 & ww2 without America providing a nice trade in war goods.
