When/how to use Espionage and GSpies?

[Atreyu]

Howdy,

I always find myself not using the new espionage system nor the great spies very effective...I merely perform counter espionage if anything at all.
I understand that it can be crucial if used correctly, but how do you do that??

Thanks!

 

[madscientist]

I build EPs mostly to evaluate AIs techrate. If I get a great spy I usually settle them or use them as a GA. Although there is alot of discussion about stealing techs via the great spy I have done this rarely.

Spies are great in war. They can incite city revolt eliminating the culture defense for quick victory.

I will occasionally steal the treasury.

I perform counter espionage late in the game, when I have a good tech lead.

My biggest flaw is I am lazy and do not spread the EPs out optimaly.

 

[johncross21]

I use espionage to check out the AIs cities

I put spies in my front line cities to counter AI spies

However I will probably play a game soon where I spend more on EP - just to see what works and what doesn't

presumably strong economy is key to this

probably try to save some GPs till late in the game (easier said than done)

Some questions

I) how do you prioritise great spies
II) what civs are best for spying (philosophical make more gps, financial gets more wealth)
III) what techs do you need to build spies
IV) any wonders that might help

 

[Gnarfflinger]

I tried a version of the Sumerian Spy Scam, but since I play with 18 civs on a standard pangea.

I ran a philosophical civ with the Sumerians, getting spies running earlier due to the ziggeraut, and having the Philosophical trait pays off a Great Spy faster. I selected my capital for this. What I did was settle the first spy then use the second for Scotland Yard. This meant that with the palace, ziggeraut, spy and great spy, the 22 EP becomes 44 every turn.

I used this for counter espionage. More civs means that more attempts will be made to sabotage you.

The Great Wall adds 2 GS points per turn, so it helps there. It also doesn't hurt for the main effects. I'd say that the GW is now my favourite early wonder...

 

[CBPE]

If I get a great spy I usually settle them or use them as a GA.

Sorry... what does it mean?!?

 

[Vince-G]

Golden Age.

I don't tend to use Spies very much, myself: I've never seen them as being particularly useful. Others will disagree.

 

[TM Moot]

Have a read of the current ALC thread (Sumerian).

There are useful ideas and gameplay in there re: Espionage and Spying.

 

[Derbus]

Hey guys, I'm new to the game and getting to the stage where I'm dabbling in espionage. I've searched the forums and main site to try to find an article on Epsionage, but can't seem to find any.... anyone able to point me in the right direction?

quick questions though.

1. Can regular spies increase EP generation ?? eg: send to city x to 'spy' on them.

2. Performing espionage;
- How do the discounts work? (stationary spy)
- For general missions (not city specific, eg: steal tech), can you steal them from anywhere within the civs cultural borders? is it more effective stealing from a city or capital city?

3. How's the detection mechanic work?
- Random Chance ??
- Does enemy unit occupying/passing through the same tile increase detection chance?
- Can spies see enemy spies?

4. Spy defense(kinda ties into the 2nd question); Best way to use spies to protect your empire against other spies ? Do you set a spy in your cities? or spread them around your borders?


5. Stealing Techs. In the game i'm playing now, I saw that the Incan bastard had Engineering but 'Would not trade' it with me, so I sent in my spies to try to steal it from him!! haha, but when I activated the steal tech action, Only Drama came up.... how come Engineering didn't show?

 

[KrikkitTwo]

5. Engineering was too expensive for you to get

For all the rest there is a thread on spy detection rates and everything else about them

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=247719

 

[Bobbalouie]

I used spies to great effect in either a prince or monarch diffiuclty game. I was Cyrus (i think), and I was wanting to try out a spy based research. I managed to get the pyramids for representation, and then i started expanding. I bee-lined to CoL so i could make courthouses for spy specialists, and I settled all my great spys at my capital with a scotland yard. I raised my spy spending, and slowly it came together. I was getting incidental reserach from the spy specialists, and tons of points to steal techs. In the middle ages, I was spying away, eventually I was the tech leader.

One thing I really enjoyed about that game is that a settle Great Spy wil give you enough of a boost on his own to let you eventually see the research of all your neighbours w/o spending on espionage.

 

[johncross21]

1. Can regular spies increase EP generation ?? eg: send to city x to 'spy' on them.

not that I know but spies can use ep point to perform counterespionage against an AI rival in order to make spying by that rival more costly for them. send to a city and select counterespionage option

2. Performing espionage;
- How do the discounts work? (stationary spy)

when you have the opportunity o perform the espionage missions (you are in an enemy city) it is cheaper in terms of EP points to perform those missions if you have a lead in EPs compared to the AI and more expensive if they have the edge

- For general missions (not city specific, eg: steal tech), can you steal them from anywhere within the civs cultural borders? is it more effective stealing from a city or capital city?

you have to be in a city. the size of the city seem to have some effect. not sure about the benefits of being in the capital. others may know ?

3. How's the detection mechanic work?
- Random Chance ??
- Does enemy unit occupying/passing through the same tile increase detection chance?
- Can spies see enemy spies?

there is a calculation of odds which determine the probability of being etected (thread somewhere). probability of detection is increased by having your spy in the same location. but I don't know how near your spy needs to be ?

in warlords enemy units ialso increased chance of detection not sure how BTS works ?

as far as I am aware spies can't see enemy spies - unless they have detected them

4. Spy defense(kinda ties into the 2nd question); Best way to use spies to protect your empire against other spies ? Do you set a spy in your cities? or spread them around your borders?

I set spies in cities near border and that seems to have some success. security bureau helps

 

[Derbus]

Thanks for the replies guys. Bhurics post was pretty informative though, I think a lot of it got lost on me. Often when the math comes into play, the numbers just send me loopy!!

I posted a quick recap of the concepts he posted, could you take a look at them and see if I made any wrong assumptions