Where's the Official Fantasy Map?

[LordGek]

Hey Gang,

Whatever became of Sirian's Fantasy Realm map? While the title of this random map initially had me thinking of "Orcs and Dragons" its actually even more clever and twisted and in no way related to fantasy as related to Lord of the Rings or Dungeons & Dragons but is more about illogical or altered resource placements. Here is Sirian's own description (quoted from his guide released months ago):

Fantasy Realm
NOTE: This map type is not shipping with the initial release of Civ4. It will be available later.

Fantastical Map: World Wrap at all map seams (top edge wraps to bottom, left edge to right)
Land-Heavy Map: 52 plots wide, 32 plots tall, at "Standard" map size
Sea Level: "Sea Level" setting will slightly increase or decrease the lake sizes
Oddball Climate: Hot and cold terrain types mix all over the place, defying common sense

RESOURCE APPEARANCE - Choose where and how bonus resources will appear.

* Logical - Places resources in the normal way (Bananas in the jungle, etc).
* Irrational - DEFAULT - Places resources anywhere except where they normally appear.
* Crazy - Eliminates eight resources, chosen randomly, and causes four resources to appear in crazy amounts all over the entire map.

 

[Psyringe]

Right, I had forgotten about that map type ... it sounded (and still sounds) very interesting. Especially the part about eliminating resources. I like it when I can't be sure to be able to build certain units ... it's a little like the original MoO, where you couldn't be sure which hi-tech weapons were in each game, so that you had to adapt your game strategies according to what you could research. It always feels unrealistic to me that I exactly know what future technologies will give me.

 

[LordGek]

Exactamente!

Cool sub games with resources, essentially.

Could it be this kind of stuff broke the AI? Or that the AI would have to be modified to adequately handle it?

 

[Psyringe]

Possible ... the AI might not be capable of readjusting tech values after finding out that certain resources don't exist in the game. After finding out that a certain resource is missing, the AI should lower the value of all techs which provide units that require that resource, and should also raise the values of the techs that enable *other* (buildable) units. Since the AI has no reason to expect something like this to happen in vanilla Civ4, it might not be able of coping with it - which in turn can easily be exploited by the player.

Civ3 had a similar problem, the AI assumed that a resource was valuable under any circumstances. You could (in a mod) offer the AI a resource that did nothing more than enabling a unit which was weaker and more expensive than units the AI could already build, and it still would pay for it gladly, because it just couldn't see that it didn't really have a use for this resource.

However, only Sirian will be able to tell us the real reason. Might as well be that he just didn't have the time yet.

 

[Junuxx]

I'm going to add the logical/irrational/crazy choice to Atlas... It's cool.

I think Fantasy isn't included because wrapping around both axes doesn't work (well, it behaves pretty freaky)

 

[KingTux]

There's more than the fantasy realm map. I was looking through one of the files and found 5 more mentioned there. Please post if any of these are actually in there now (I don't think they are). There's:

Hub (no clue on the name, this is the reference name, could be short for something) - Each player starts in a separate region. The regions connect via land bridges to the polar hub at the map's center.

Maze - Novelty map that randomly generates an extremely twisty maze of land and water.

Mirror - Land-based map, randomly generates half a world in the west then mirrors it exactly in the east.

Team Battleground - Teams are placed on opposite sides of the map with a neutral zone between them.

Wheel - Each player starts in a separate region. Regions are connected via land bridges, forming a complete wagon wheel (both ring and hub).

 

[Sirian]

Please post if any of these are actually in there now (I don't think they are).

Half the map scripts are featured from the Play Now menu, the other half are tucked away under Custom Game option (where all twenty scripts are available).

Try launching a Custom Game.


As for Fantasy Realm... Yes, it was the wrapping holding it up. Soren mentioned that in his audio interview. You can understand why some of the other patch issues got more attention, though.

As to whether Fantasy Realm will ever make it in... It's not my call.


- Sirian

 

[xGBox]

There's more than the fantasy realm map. I was looking through one of the files and found 5 more mentioned there. Please post if any of these are actually in there now (I don't think they are). There's:

Hub (no clue on the name, this is the reference name, could be short for something) - Each player starts in a separate region. The regions connect via land bridges to the polar hub at the map's center.

Maze - Novelty map that randomly generates an extremely twisty maze of land and water.

Mirror - Land-based map, randomly generates half a world in the west then mirrors it exactly in the east.

Team Battleground - Teams are placed on opposite sides of the map with a neutral zone between them.

Wheel - Each player starts in a separate region. Regions are connected via land bridges, forming a complete wagon wheel (both ring and hub).

The other five you just listed are there, but we've yet to see fantasy.

 

[Psyringe]

Junuxx, what's this "freaky behavior" of two-axis-wrapping you mentioned?

 

[KingTux]

Half the map scripts are featured from the Play Now menu, the other half are tucked away under Custom Game option (where all twenty scripts are available).

Try launching a Custom Game.


As for Fantasy Realm... Yes, it was the wrapping holding it up. Soren mentioned that in his audio interview. You can understand why some of the other patch issues got more attention, though.

As to whether Fantasy Realm will ever make it in... It's not my call.


- Sirian

Well, thanks for telling me that they're in there. I haven't played it too much, as I've been spending most of my time digging through the artwork and XML to play around with them (I LOVE to mod). I think that I've spent at least 2-3 times more time digging through the files than actually playing it. I played it once for about 20 hours straight, but most of my games haven't lasted for longer than an hour and a half. Basically, it's like I'm playing Civ2 all over again, because I haven't spent this much time trying to mod it versus gameplay since 1996. This is what's made Civilization so addictive to me, as I've been a programming hobbiest since I was 5, and am now planning on turning it into a career. So, a big thanks goes out to Firaxis for making it so addictively moddable.

It's a shame that I won't be able to touch the SDK until the Fall, as I'm going to be in school until then and need to raise the funds to get a computer within that time. However, I think that I can get through that just because I'm doing a C++ class in January (might be a little basic for my tastes, but I've got to start somewhere). I'll just have to work extra hard there to show the professors all the skills that Civilization has given me.

I apologize if this was slightly off topic, but when I saw that Sirian answered me, I thought that I'd drop my thanks.

 

[Planescaped]

Crazy amounts of resources sound fun. 7 hills around you city all producing iron, holy production.

 

[Thalassicus]

Holy Production, Batman! ...more like

Imagine if Iron and Coal are the resources picked...

 

[Junuxx]

Thanks for the explanation, Sirian. I hope to see the Fantasy Realm some time.

Junuxx, what's this "freaky behavior" of two-axis-wrapping you mentioned?

If you scroll over the north/south edge of the map, where the map is supposed to be wrapped, it messes up. Half the screen is black or flickers, units are displayed in the void, just no good.

Try setting wrap Y=1 in a worldbuildersave to see what I mean
By the way, Psyringe, did you get my 1mb savegame? Did it work?

 

[Psyringe]

Thanks for the explanation. I just tried Y-wrapping myself and ... hope it's being fixed.

By the way, Psyringe, did you get my 1mb savegame? Did it work?

No unfortunately I didn't receive it. I thought you forgot about it or didn't see my post. If you send it again, I'll be able to test it, but it's okay as well if you don't or can't.