Why spread religion?
- Thread starter CapnKill
- Start date
JujuLautre
Deity
- getting an ally by making him adopt your state religion (if he does not have the religion, he cannot adopt it)
- getting a line of sight in the city if you possess the holy city and have it as your state religion
- getting income from a shrine
- creating war weariness in the city if there is a war between the both of you
perhaps I miss something, but this is still sufficient in some cases
- getting a line of sight in the city if you possess the holy city and have it as your state religion
- getting income from a shrine
- creating war weariness in the city if there is a war between the both of you
perhaps I miss something, but this is still sufficient in some cases
Soneji
Prince and Great Steward
War resistance.
If a city has your religion it can help reduce the time of revolt. Obviously this depends on how far deap / into their culture / borders the city stands.
This means it'll pop up its borders a touch quicker, and you can start working the land and making units.
If a city has your religion it can help reduce the time of revolt. Obviously this depends on how far deap / into their culture / borders the city stands.
This means it'll pop up its borders a touch quicker, and you can start working the land and making units.
They've pretty much covered it.
The main benefits are:
- Intel from seeing into the enemy city.
- Cash from a shrine.
- Diplomatic bonus (IE: "We care for our brothers and sisters of the faith") and/or removal of negatives (IE: "We are sad that you have fallen under the sway of a heathen religion."). Sometimes flipping a civ to your religion will make them positive enough that you will be able to squeeze a bit more out of them.
The main benefits are:
- Intel from seeing into the enemy city.
- Cash from a shrine.
- Diplomatic bonus (IE: "We care for our brothers and sisters of the faith") and/or removal of negatives (IE: "We are sad that you have fallen under the sway of a heathen religion."). Sometimes flipping a civ to your religion will make them positive enough that you will be able to squeeze a bit more out of them.
ChicagoCubs
Prince
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2006
- Messages
- 361
If you can get two civs to have different religions, you can also prod them into war more easily.
the shrine income benefit is ridiculously overrated .... think of all the hammers you have to spend to create missionaries and the risk/effort to transport them (need open borders!) and each city converted only gives 1 extra coin in your shrine city. You could easily get 15-20 extra commerce by working cottages with the right civics long before you manage to convert 15-20 cities.
The other reasons are good reasons, but I am growing tired of the shrine income benefit. That feature really needs to be fixed somehow (more income for city size/distance). At best it's a decent side benefit.
The other reasons are good reasons, but I am growing tired of the shrine income benefit. That feature really needs to be fixed somehow (more income for city size/distance). At best it's a decent side benefit.
Late game shrine income can be 3gpt per city, if you put Wall Street, etc, there. Generally, missionaries should be made in either production cities that wouldn't be working cottages anyway, or in cottage cities with nothing better to do. A decent amount of proselytizing is maybe 10-20 missionaries (400-800 hammers), which can be done for the early- to mid-game price of one or two wonders. An extra 30-60gpt for the entire game is hardly minimal, and if you do it right it shouldn't come at the expense of additional cottage income.
I'm not sure of the risk in transport, as I've only lost missionaries during war, and that was after forgetting about them waiting for an OB that never happened.
Anyway, that's all in addition to diplo, LoS, and warring advantages that come from it. Just proselytizing a neighbor to keep a friendly border to not have to worry about defending is priceless in itself, although granted that can be done without religion.
I'm not sure of the risk in transport, as I've only lost missionaries during war, and that was after forgetting about them waiting for an OB that never happened.
Anyway, that's all in addition to diplo, LoS, and warring advantages that come from it. Just proselytizing a neighbor to keep a friendly border to not have to worry about defending is priceless in itself, although granted that can be done without religion.
Also, if you have a heathen neighbor it may not take much to get your religion started in his empire and then let it spread by itself but I usually find it worth at least sending a missionary to visit his capital (so I can see if it is ripe for plucking).
The other line of thought is that some of those cities just aren't yours yet
The other line of thought is that some of those cities just aren't yours yet
Also, if you have a heathen neighbor it may not take much to get your religion started in his empire and then let it spread by itself but I usually find it worth at least sending a missionary to visit his capital (so I can see if it is ripe for plucking).
The other line of thought is that some of those cities just aren't yours yet
Is it better to "infect"
the capital or does it not matter?
VoiceOfUnreason
Deity
- Joined
- Dec 5, 2005
- Messages
- 3,663
Unless I skimmed too quickly, culture flip is missing from the list...
SnowlyWhite
Emperor
A missionary is 40 hammers(marathon); let's say some fail and so on, so put it 55 hammers on average. Let's say you'd produce wealth instead of missionaries - you'd just save 55 wealth. That means after 55 turns, your missionary paid off. That assuming you're absurd and you don't build any income modifiers in your shrine city.
You'd definitelly get 15-20 commerce before you'd spread religion in 15-20 cities(though this is false if you're playin' continents and you're on one with no religion whores - the religion would spread by itself, confucianism being usually a good approach when you're with the right civs on your continent - send 2 missionaries and then let them do the rest of the work), however, getting 15-20 commerce and spreading your religions aren't by any means mutually exclusive.
All in all, the shrine, especially in early-mid game, is a very powerful tool. Ain't the a bomb, but still it's very good...
Rancid Sushi
Last year's catch
Don't forget that Market + Grocer + Bank + Wall Street in the shrine city = +200% income in that city. Eh, I think. I'm not good at math.
Absolutely -- the AI likes to stick with it's capital's religion, even if other religions spread to outlying cities.Is it better to "infect"
JimT
Warlord
Very nice to know
Is it better to "infect"
I also like to have my religion in his capital so I can see how many troops he has there and if I invade him I will probably at least keep his capital city even if I raze other cities. Finally, the capital is going to be connected to his other cities which I think helps the religion spread.
Soneji
Prince and Great Steward
Unless they found their own afterwards, then they tend to go for that.
Florian
Prince
- Joined
- Jun 23, 2003
- Messages
- 337
Here's a testimony.
In my current game (playing as Elizabeth), I was one of 4 civs on my continent, and they were all Confucian except for me. I kept waiting for Confucianism to spread to one of my cities so I could join the club, but it wouldn't.
Isabella was one of the Confucian civs, and Ragnar (who was easily the most powerful at that stage) was another, so this was not a good situation.
Then I lightbulbed Philosophy and founded Taoism. I was going to send my free missionary to my capital, but the religion spread there ahead him, so instead I sent him up to one of Ragnar's biggest cities and spread Taoism there. Next turn, Ragnar converted, and the Confucian bloc was broken. Ragnar has been my closest ally ever since, and has joined me in several wars against the Spanish and Americans.
In my current game (playing as Elizabeth), I was one of 4 civs on my continent, and they were all Confucian except for me. I kept waiting for Confucianism to spread to one of my cities so I could join the club, but it wouldn't.
Isabella was one of the Confucian civs, and Ragnar (who was easily the most powerful at that stage) was another, so this was not a good situation.
Then I lightbulbed Philosophy and founded Taoism. I was going to send my free missionary to my capital, but the religion spread there ahead him, so instead I sent him up to one of Ragnar's biggest cities and spread Taoism there. Next turn, Ragnar converted, and the Confucian bloc was broken. Ragnar has been my closest ally ever since, and has joined me in several wars against the Spanish and Americans.
Religion is essential for winning the game fairly easy... I almost always go for the first rel. like buddism and hinduism. (acctually it's best to go for the latter, cause the AI always go for the first ) In a couple of quick turns I've surpassed most of the other civs on botn gold and culture. And when it comes to the point were the other civs get close to my border, I send some agents over to convert them. This also helps me when I create a shrine, nice amount of money starts to flow in... 
The great leap in the start is very useful for the later game...
Guess people here have answered most of the technical issues behind religion, so I won't start...
) In a couple of quick turns I've surpassed most of the other civs on botn gold and culture. And when it comes to the point were the other civs get close to my border, I send some agents over to convert them. This also helps me when I create a shrine, nice amount of money starts to flow in... The great leap in the start is very useful for the later game... Guess people here have answered most of the technical issues behind religion, so I won't start...
