Wonders for completing social policies
- Thread starter Louis XXIV
- Start date
That's not really a wonder so much as a trade route, though. One of the things I disliked about the early Civ games was how so many of the later wonders were events or achievements instead of actual substantial objects you could look at and see, or reach out and touch.
Instead, I would suggest the Royal Dutch Mint for commerce.
As for autocracy, I would suggest the Eagle's Nest (Kehlsteinhaus), except it doesn't look that impressive from the outside.
That nerdy kid
Vampire Slayer Slayer
silk road would be great for commerce, and i was thinking Schonbrunn for autocracy (we already have the Kremlin and Brandenburg gate, so the Hapsburg palace would be great. it is also a UNESCO world heritage site 
jabbawackybacky
Warlord
- Joined
- Jun 20, 2010
- Messages
- 116
Tradition:
Abu Simbel
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Simbel_temples
Liberty:
Parthenon
Ashoka's pillars
Honor:
Porcelain Army
Military units gain +10% when fighting in your territory, barracks all produce +2 culture
Piety:
Templo Mayor
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Templo_Mayor
+4 culture, temples give military units +3 experience
Also maybe Ellora Temple in India or St Peters Basilica
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellora
Patronage:
Bank of Medici-reduces the cost of all financial gifts by 20%, +5 minimum reputation with city states
Commerce:
East Indies Company (this might be more of a national wonder actually)
Rationalism:
The Beagle (Darwin's ship)
Cities with
produce +2 science
Order:
what about something from the Mexican muralist tradition? They produced some of the most aesthetically appealing Communist art in the world (and were much more colorful characters anyways than the dour Stalinists of Russia) maybe the central library at UNAM? The biblioteca Central is a UNESCO heritage site actually
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:UNAM_Biblioteca_Central.jpg
The cost increase of building a great specialist is reduced in all cities, the city you build the wonder in gains 10% less
from population
Autocracy
Black Dragon Society
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kokuryu-kai
Enemies at war with you lose 10% happiness, your sea units gain +1 :c5move: and air units gain +5 range
Perhaps there should be 2 wonders-one for starting the tree, one for finishing? Or one which is a world wonder and one which is a national wonder? I'm not sure
Abu Simbel
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Simbel_temples
Liberty:
Parthenon
Ashoka's pillars
Honor:
Porcelain Army
Military units gain +10% when fighting in your territory, barracks all produce +2 culture
Piety:
Templo Mayor
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Templo_Mayor
+4 culture, temples give military units +3 experience
Also maybe Ellora Temple in India or St Peters Basilica
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellora
Patronage:
Bank of Medici-reduces the cost of all financial gifts by 20%, +5 minimum reputation with city states
Commerce:
East Indies Company (this might be more of a national wonder actually)
Rationalism:
The Beagle (Darwin's ship)
Cities with
produce +2 scienceOrder:
what about something from the Mexican muralist tradition? They produced some of the most aesthetically appealing Communist art in the world (and were much more colorful characters anyways than the dour Stalinists of Russia) maybe the central library at UNAM? The biblioteca Central is a UNESCO heritage site actually
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:UNAM_Biblioteca_Central.jpg
The cost increase of building a great specialist is reduced in all cities, the city you build the wonder in gains 10% less
from populationAutocracy
Black Dragon Society
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kokuryu-kai
Enemies at war with you lose 10% happiness, your sea units gain +1 :c5move: and air units gain +5 range
Perhaps there should be 2 wonders-one for starting the tree, one for finishing? Or one which is a world wonder and one which is a national wonder? I'm not sure
I like this idea, though it doesn't seem to differ enough from the finisher policies already in place. I believe most players aim to complete policy branches one at a time during standard gameplay. Having a wonder on top of the finisher would only create further incentive to keep this strategy and never deviate from it. Why not give the player incentives to play differently?
Some ideas of my own: Players already 'race' through the tech tree beelining towards their wonder and/or unit of choice via RAs and GSs. Yet no such 'race' exists in the purple tech tree of policies. How many times have you almost completed a wonder that could have been yours if only you had reached the tech earlier? This scenario can not happen through policy choices, only tech choices. If I finish the tradition branch before another player, I receive a nice bonus but my opponent is not denied anything. They too are fully capable of finishing the same branch which does not deny my empire anything. Having wonders as part of finishing a branch does create a 'race' towards finishing policies, but again creates narrow play styles.
If the policy tree branch is just another 'tech' tree branch, why not have single policies 'activate' wonders much like a tech would? Yes this is sort of hypocritical since you are again doubling up policies with wonders, but I feel this will create more of an incentive for the player to not just finish branches but open up many different branches prior to finishing any one in order to build wonders unique to those branches before their opponents. Off topic a bit, I think Great Artists should help you beeline policies much like GSs help you beeline techs (free policy immediately or a one time culture boost).
Polices could also open up city improvements, units, tile improvements, etc.. Yes the policy tree serves a specific purpose separate from that of the tech tree, but even the smallest inclusion can create some worthwhile choices for the player. Who would like to see new religious buildings (cathedrals, abbeys, religious academies, churches, synagogues, etc) and units (crusaders, missionaries, monks, etc) activated via policies in the Piety tree? I would welcome them.
Some ideas of my own: Players already 'race' through the tech tree beelining towards their wonder and/or unit of choice via RAs and GSs. Yet no such 'race' exists in the purple tech tree of policies. How many times have you almost completed a wonder that could have been yours if only you had reached the tech earlier? This scenario can not happen through policy choices, only tech choices. If I finish the tradition branch before another player, I receive a nice bonus but my opponent is not denied anything. They too are fully capable of finishing the same branch which does not deny my empire anything. Having wonders as part of finishing a branch does create a 'race' towards finishing policies, but again creates narrow play styles.
If the policy tree branch is just another 'tech' tree branch, why not have single policies 'activate' wonders much like a tech would? Yes this is sort of hypocritical since you are again doubling up policies with wonders, but I feel this will create more of an incentive for the player to not just finish branches but open up many different branches prior to finishing any one in order to build wonders unique to those branches before their opponents. Off topic a bit, I think Great Artists should help you beeline policies much like GSs help you beeline techs (free policy immediately or a one time culture boost).
Polices could also open up city improvements, units, tile improvements, etc.. Yes the policy tree serves a specific purpose separate from that of the tech tree, but even the smallest inclusion can create some worthwhile choices for the player. Who would like to see new religious buildings (cathedrals, abbeys, religious academies, churches, synagogues, etc) and units (crusaders, missionaries, monks, etc) activated via policies in the Piety tree? I would welcome them.
Louis XXIV
Le Roi Soleil
While a fair point, I think the reason to offer a wonder in addition to the finisher bonus is it requires production, not culture. There still might be a wonder race if two Civs finish the policy branch around the same time. I think we have a similar idea. Essentially, a culture race rather than a tech race where the civ with more culture has the leg up on the tech.
I could see having it related to specific policies rather than the branch as a whole. I think that adds a greater risk of balancing issues, however. At least with it being unlocked after finishing the branch, you're only balancing overall branches (is Liberty better than Tradition) rather than the individual policy.
I do like the idea of opening up units and other things as well. It would certainly allow for interesting possibilities. I'll give this some thought and come up with an integrated approach. I might tweak the Wonders idea to be something closer to the 7 (or 9) Ancient Wonders scenario. In other words, doing a bunch of different things unlock them rather than a bunch of the same thing (finishing policies).
I could see having it related to specific policies rather than the branch as a whole. I think that adds a greater risk of balancing issues, however. At least with it being unlocked after finishing the branch, you're only balancing overall branches (is Liberty better than Tradition) rather than the individual policy.
I do like the idea of opening up units and other things as well. It would certainly allow for interesting possibilities. I'll give this some thought and come up with an integrated approach. I might tweak the Wonders idea to be something closer to the 7 (or 9) Ancient Wonders scenario. In other words, doing a bunch of different things unlock them rather than a bunch of the same thing (finishing policies).
Agreed on this. It has also been suggested these special wonders would cost more, perhaps even a resource requirement of some kind. This again changes things and makes the 'race' less one dimentional.
As for units and buildings and whatnot. I'm not against it by default but I'm vary wary. Whatever would be unlocked should be very distinct from anything already in the game.
Random ideas:
completing piety gives you the monk unit. This civillian unit costs normal upkeep, but when stationed in a city adds 1 smily face to the bucket for the golden ages per 2 citizens.
Well, as long as the finisher wonders have good bonuses to deviate me from building tradtional tech wonders I do not see any problems with them.
A quick idea: Why not take wonders already in the game and make them finishing wonders? It would help level the playing field between blue and purple tech trees. Pretty easy to do with earlier wonders (since there are so many to choose from) but it gets a little tricky in later eras. I also liked jabbawackybacky's idea for naitonal wonders.
Tradition: Hanging Gardens
Liberty: Temple of Artemis
Honor: Temple of Zeus
Piety: Hagia Sophia OR Notre Dame OR Sistine Chapel
Patronage: Sistine Chapel OR Forbidden Palace (perhaps a new wonder would be best)
Commerce: (a new wonder)
Rationalism: Porcelain Tower?
Freedom: Statue of Liberty OR Eiffel Tower
Autocracy: Brandenburg Gate?
Order: (a new wonder)
A quick idea: Why not take wonders already in the game and make them finishing wonders? It would help level the playing field between blue and purple tech trees. Pretty easy to do with earlier wonders (since there are so many to choose from) but it gets a little tricky in later eras. I also liked jabbawackybacky's idea for naitonal wonders.
Tradition: Hanging Gardens
Liberty: Temple of Artemis
Honor: Temple of Zeus
Piety: Hagia Sophia OR Notre Dame OR Sistine Chapel
Patronage: Sistine Chapel OR Forbidden Palace (perhaps a new wonder would be best)
Commerce: (a new wonder)
Rationalism: Porcelain Tower?
Freedom: Statue of Liberty OR Eiffel Tower
Autocracy: Brandenburg Gate?
Order: (a new wonder)
headcase
Limit 1 Facepalm Per Turn
I love this idea. I'd also expand it to Wonders being available upon certain achievements, e.g.
- after your first happiness golden age
- after creating x cities
- after earning your first GG from experience
- after exploring x hexes
- inspiration after finding specific natural wonder
- after meeting x% of civs and\or CSs
- need to have and maintain at least x gold while building wonder, until it's completed.
- I also think SOME wonders should require happiness of 0 or more to build
Anything to move some of them off the tech tree.
- after your first happiness golden age
- after creating x cities
- after earning your first GG from experience
- after exploring x hexes
- inspiration after finding specific natural wonder
- after meeting x% of civs and\or CSs
- need to have and maintain at least x gold while building wonder, until it's completed.
- I also think SOME wonders should require happiness of 0 or more to build
Anything to move some of them off the tech tree.
