Worst Civ in the Game??

[killmeplease]

Carthage gets a free harbor for their coastal cities which could be good for long distance settlements but eh I don't think I'm ever pressed to make harbors, and I have never really used her mountainwalk ability effectively.

harbor provides a trade network connection, which is great if you settle along the coast as you dont have to build roads. this means you save 2-4 gold per city and you start receiving trade netowrk gold the turn you founded a new city. this is also alot of the saved worker turns and instant per-city bonuses from messenger of gods and meritocracy. overall its one of the best civs (if not the best) for the liberty strategy.
not to mention harbors provide hammers on sea resources which is huge in the early game, and increased trade routes what means you can pick better partners.
but elephants and 5remes are crap, sadly.

 

[GreenofKnight45]

Your comment made me laugh, then I realized that Spain is prolly my least favority civ.

Great! Love to keep this site happy!
Spain looks like a real gamble
Sweden looks tremendously underpowered
Germany is still sucking on that brute.
America can be good but its hard not to take its UA for granted.
The Ottomans make me throw up
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Never turn your back on a Dido you can't trust.

 

[LordBalkoth]

what VC and strategy would you recommend for a denmark player?

It really depends on the difficulty level and vs humans or vs AI.

Denmark has no non-military bonuses, but doing something like trying to raid the AI to pillage them and keep them down works a lot less well than doing the same versus players. Both since the AI gets a ton of bonuses on higher difficulties and because you'll get warmongering hate.

But unless you try to attack with berserkers and/or pillage stuff...you're basically playing a vanilla civ which means any victory condition is equally viable (and you can win any condition on deity easily enough).

 

[superliminal]

Sweden looks tremendously underpowered.

You'd be surprised. Their UUs are excellent, but they really shine with the UA. If you have a lot of DoFs, you end up swimming in great persons.

 

[Astennu]

Great! Love to keep this site happy!
Spain looks like a real gamble
Sweden looks tremendously underpowered
Germany is still sucking on that brute.
America can be good but its hard not to take its UA for granted.
The Ottomans make me throw up
-----------------------------------------
Never turn your back on a Dido you can't trust.

Haha I've never played as the Ottomans and probably never will.

Really drab and uninspiring colours, its UA will usually just give you an extra Trireme or two and they are still just as unwieldy and weak as ever. Naval combat doesn't become fun until navigation. The Janissary is ok but the Sipahi is just a replacement for the really awkward Lancer, possibly the worst type of unit to have a unique for. The Ottomans also don't have any infrastructure bonus which I really dislike. Sure you'll save some gold on your navy but I prefer to have extra gold and luxuries from a Bazaar or extra food from a Polder.

The Ottomans are just overall the Civ which has nothing of interest to me.

 

[Dr. D]

Haha I've never played as the Ottomans and probably never will.

Really drab and uninspiring colours, its UA will usually just give you an extra Trireme or two and they are still just as unwieldy and weak as ever. Naval combat doesn't become fun until navigation. The Janissary is ok but the Sipahi is just a replacement for the really awkward Lancer, possibly the worst type of unit to have a unique for. The Ottomans also don't have any infrastructure bonus which I really dislike. Sure you'll save some gold on your navy but I prefer to have extra gold and luxuries from a Bazaar or extra food from a Polder.

The Ottomans are just overall the Civ which has nothing of interest to me.

Obviously you've never played as the Ottomans if you think the UA will only get you a trireme or two and that the Janissary is just okay... sure, they're domination-oriented and that doesn't fit everyone's playstyle, but they do the things they are designed to do very well.

 

[Sharples]

Obviously you've never played as the Ottomans if you think the UA will only get you a trireme or two and that the Janissary is just okay... sure, they're domination-oriented and that doesn't fit everyone's playstyle, but they do the things they are designed to do very well.

Ottomans shine when Navigation comes around, anything below that is forced coastal so it's going to be pretty hard to capture ships. Galeass become too obsolete when Frigates are overpowered at the time they come out. Privateers already have the Ottoman bonus and thus can capture any renissance ship they want. This makes the Ottomans weaker in water than on land because Privateers and frigate combination excell at taking other ships while the Ottoman bonus is medicore at the time you have to use it - Renissance or late game. Ottomans can capture Battleships when it is nice though, but I still find it medicore over the fact that it becomes a little too late in the game.

 

[IkM]

Ottomans shine when Navigation comes around, anything below that is forced coastal so it's going to be pretty hard to capture ships. Galeass become too obsolete when Frigates are overpowered at the time they come out. Privateers already have the Ottoman bonus and thus can capture any renissance ship they want. This makes the Ottomans weaker in water than on land because Privateers and frigate combination excell at taking other ships while the Ottoman bonus is medicore at the time you have to use it - Renissance or late game. Ottomans can capture Battleships when it is nice though, but I still find it medicore over the fact that it becomes a little too late in the game.

Like or not, Ottomans are one of the most effective civ in game. They are great both on sea and land. Privateers have capture ship ability but how long you can use them? Ottomans using that ability for entire game. You can get many different ships; Dromon, Great Galleass, Sea Beggar, Ship of the Line, Turtle Ship etc.

We got that, you hate Ottomans and you showing your hatred in every single thread. But you just sound childish.

 

[beetle]

You can get many different ships; Dromon, Great Galleass, Sea Beggar, Ship of the Line, Turtle Ship etc.

The Dromon, Great Galleass, Turtle ship all seem like fair targets! Enough so that I want to fire up a game just to try this! Carthage has an early boat too. Who else? What map would better for this, small continents or archipelgio?

But do you really have luck capturing Sea Beggars and SOL though? My previous efforts have failed miserably. The Ottomas have nothing special for that era.

The Ottoman prize ability on new destroyers is the bomb though. It kind of sucks though that the prized ships loose their promotions.

 

[Sharples]

Like or not, Ottomans are one of the most effective civ in game. They are great both on sea and land. Privateers have capture ship ability but how long you can use them? Ottomans using that ability for entire game. You can get many different ships; Dromon, Great Galleass, Sea Beggar, Ship of the Line, Turtle Ship etc.

We got that, you hate Ottomans and you showing your hatred in every single thread. But you just sound childish.

Huh? I'm merely giving you facts. Capturing ships isn't going to be your goal in winning this game. Pre-Renissance units aren't really that great against other cities. Renissance type units such as Frigates are incredibly powerful. They're already scary enough as is. They are basically dominant right until the age of Destroyers and Battleships. Even Ironclads won't do well against them because by the time you build them, they'll have a LOT of frigates which can focus fire on Ironclads.

I don't hate hate the Ottomans the Janissary is a good unit. The Siphai I dislike though, I haven't had much luck with it.

My hatred is my opinion, deal with it.

 

[IkM]

I don't hate hate the Ottomans the Janissary is a good unit. The Siphai I dislike though, I haven't had much luck with it.

My hatred is my opinion, deal with it.

No comment.

 

[SecretAgent]

what VC and strategy would you recommend for a denmark player?

Well Denmarks ability really doesn't help any particular strategy. So what is it they do then? They constantly leave your opponents civilizations covered in black smoke. Their all about slowing your enemies down rather than a buff to a particular win con. These strength's would seem less valuable to a domination player because well, your planning on conquering them anyway. So their is less need to slow their growth, science, production, etc. Which is why I made the comment Domination seems to me to the least likely route to go for Denmark for these reasons.

I would like to add Denmark is exceptionally fun versus real players (Not so much for them).

 

[SecretAgent]

harbor provides a trade network connection, which is great if you settle along the coast as you dont have to build roads. this means you save 2-4 gold per city and you start receiving trade netowrk gold the turn you founded a new city. this is also alot of the saved worker turns and instant per-city bonuses from messenger of gods and meritocracy. overall its one of the best civs (if not the best) for the liberty strategy.
not to mention harbors provide hammers on sea resources which is huge in the early game, and increased trade routes what means you can pick better partners.
but elephants and 5remes are crap, sadly.

Ya but if the city is close I never really feel like an instant harbor is that great. I often start building my roads ahead of time anyway. Idk I never feel rushed with my workers as I usually build a decent amount of them. Same with gold in I feel the instant connection isn't that valuable. Idk I feel like their are 10+ civs more powerful for a Liberty start but that's based on my playstyles and experiences.

 

[beetle]

...not to mention harbors provide hammers on sea resources which is huge in the early game...

Please double check that. Such was the case with GnK, and maybe even with early BNW, but nowadays harbors just adds food and gold to sea resources (plus what you mention about the city connection, and better cargo ship routes). Losing the hammers from harbors really hurts.

 

[LordBalkoth]

Please double check that. Such was the case with GnK, and maybe even with early BNW, but nowadays harbors just adds food and gold to sea resources (plus what you mention about the city connection, and better cargo ship routes). Losing the hammers from harbors really hurts.

Er, Harbors don't add food or gold (OR production) to sea resources. They allow a city connection, extend sea trade routes by 50%, and add 1 gold to the trade route calculation for both ends of the route.

Lighthouses add 1 food to coast tiles, 1 production to resources, and a further 1 food to fish.

Seaports add 1 gold and 1 production to resources in addition to 15% faster naval production.

 

[OMGFooFighters]

but elephants and 5remes are crap, sadly.

I found the elephants useful against an early mongol push. I just fortified two of them in front of my city river and the gols melee units basically suicided into them. 3 archers and city bombardment was all i had for other units. 15 kills and a GG generated, ty great Khan.

 

[LordBalkoth]

FYI, Mounted/Armor units cannot fortify. They can heal, but they don't get the 40% bonus (or inherent rough terrain bonuses or fort/citadel bonuses).

 

[Astennu]

Obviously you've never played as the Ottomans if you think the UA will only get you a trireme or two and that the Janissary is just okay... sure, they're domination-oriented and that doesn't fit everyone's playstyle, but they do the things they are designed to do very well.

I made sure I said "usually" instead of "only".....however by the time a proper navy comes into play can't you just use Privateers to capture other ships? Maybe Ottoman Privateers should have some added bonus, like increased chance to capture so that part of their UA is not made redundant by a single unit.

Anyways, what would you say is the most efficient use of the Prize Ships ability? Capturing Battleships with Destroyers would be nice, however by the time I tech to Battleships I'm usually in control of the seas anyway.

I'd also agree that the Janissary is actually quite good, however I find waging war before Artillery can be a bit of pain. It would certainly be good at defending vs a Deity AI throwing units at you since you can pick of weak units and heal.

Crap...now I'm kind of interested in testing out the Ottomans....

 

[IkM]

Crap...now I'm kind of interested in testing out the Ottomans....

Here you go.

 

[mikeburnfire]

Spain looks like a real gamble

There's a mod that I play with that changes the Wonder bonus from "500g if discovered first" to "200g when discovered". A *much* better UA, honestly. Less luck-based, and keeps you exploring until you've found them all because early gold means early advantage.