XML investigation

The TechInfos file does not contain all the techs. If you read the comments at the start you will see that some have already been moved to the optional module they belong in to make the module fully optional. This should be the case for the alt-timeline "Punk" and the custom religions. It is a work in progress.

Yes I've read that. Though there's only one religion tech (canaanism) and one alt timeline tech (clockpunk) that are in modules.


TECH_SPECIAL_PROMOTION and, I think, TECH_RELIGION are about promotions. They are used to hide promotions that are given free by buildings. Otherwise you can choose them which is not what we want.

I haven't found instances of TECH_RELIGION outside of this file (and some audio define files).


There used to be many techs that gave free units. Archery was one. I am not sure why those nolonger do.

It's not the free unit for each civ when it discovers the tech, it's the free unit for the first one to discover the tech...


Only if one is a prerequisite of the other. Otherwise you can get the same effect following differing paths which is OK.

Irrigation is indeed a prerequisite of the (much farther tech) Canal Systems.


Another question: when there's only one tech in OrPrereqTech, can it be transferred in AndPrereqTech? If there's a choice among 1 tech, I'd say this tech is mandatory...
 
SoundMP Reference to the sound played when this tech is researched in a multiplayer game.

via: http://modiki.civfanatics.com/index.php/Civ4TechInfos

OK, thanks. I guess then that when it's empty there should be the same thing as in <Sound>?


I used Cold Fusion with the Nuclear Power Complex because I thought it was a proper tech. Don't we have something more advanced than Fusion?

BTW, Cold Fusion is considered a bit like a pseudoscience (like water memory, magnetism therapy, etc. - not so much a "futuristic tech that we don't master yet" but rather a "phenomenon that noone ever demonstrated it really existed"), it could be fitting for an alt-timeline, but I wouldn't really put it in the main line...
 
It's not the free unit for each civ when it discover the tech, it's the free unit for the first one to discover the tech...

Exactly. Normal in BtS vanilla and earlier.

Another question: when there's only one tech in OrPrereqTech, can it be transferred in AndPrereqTech? If there's a choice among 1 tech, I'd say this tech is mandatory...

Yes and no. If you do it will make the tech tree look wrong. If I remember correctly if it is an AND tech there will be no line shown on the tech tree as it only shows the OR connections. That means that if you make it an AND or mandatory tech it will just hang on the tree with no links. Weird I know.
 
It's not the free unit for each civ when it discovers the tech, it's the free unit for the first one to discover the tech...

It is a known to the AI effect. If it gives a free unit and stuff then the AI will rate it as a higher priority to study. There is a mod out there that adds other effects along similar lines but the AI does not understand them
- free unit for all who study
- free money, research, culture to first to study
- and so on.​

I would like to include those at some stage but only if the AI understands them.

The AI does not know about the free gatherer to all who study gathering. The reason it prioritises the tech is the free gatherer to the first to study (maybe).
 
Yes and no. If you do it will make the tech tree look wrong. If I remember correctly if it is an AND tech there will be no line shown on the tech tree as it only shows the OR connections. That means that if you make it an AND or mandatory tech it will just hang on the tree with no links. Weird I know.

OK. That being said, maybe it'd worth reordering a bit the techs between AndPrereq and OrPrereq to make the tech tree clearer - now you have lines going behind techs, lines crossing and missing lines... to be honest I rarely look at the lines currently because I find them more confusing than helping.

For example Raft building doesn't require Trap Fishing, Microlith doesn't require Fine Edged Tools and there could be a line between Ritualism and Cultural Identity and between Naturopathy and Druidism...

py4F2T0.jpg


c8BuMRI.jpg


I'll put my hands in this bag of knots and see what I can do :D
 
It is a known to the AI effect. If it gives a free unit and stuff then the AI will rate it as a higher priority to study. There is a mod out there that adds other effects along similar lines but the AI does not understand them
- free unit for all who study
- free money, research, culture to first to study
- and so on.​

I would like to include those at some stage but only if the AI understands them.

The AI does not know about the free gatherer to all who study gathering. The reason it prioritises the tech is the free gatherer to the first to study (maybe).

Does the AI really needs that to prioritize Gathering? It's not like there's much choice so early on, and researching Language or Cave Dwelling just before or just after Gathering won't really change the performance of the AI...
 
I have just finished comparing your and my versions of the base subdued animals. Now I need to go through and make the <constant> stuff all on one line and then do the ones that are not in the base set. ;)

I do want to get all the Subdue Animal stuff into core fairly soon. It is stable and has been for awhile. I may keep the sea critters out of core while I do the new work on them as well as the new animals.
 
Here's a new version of the core CIV4BuildingInfos.xml file with the following (significant) changes:

- It was split into 5 files:
Regular_CIV4BuildingInfos.xml
NationalWonders_CIV4BuildingInfos.xml
GreatWonders_CIV4BuildingInfos.xml
Cultures_CIV4BuildingInfos.xml
SpecialBuildings_CIV4BuildingInfos.xml

First four should be obvious, the 5th one includes all the buildings with an iCost of -1, meaning it has all the crime, diseases, dances, achievements, etc. buildings that are build by units or autobuilt some way or another.

- In each file, buildings are sorted alphabetically (by their real name, not the name in Type), except SpecialBuildings which is first sorted by "categories" (so that crime buildings are together, etc.). The real name now shows in comment before each entry to avoid confusion and make searching easier.

- Tags were reordered "logically": you'll find every prerequisite tags together, then every obsolescence tags, then every construction costs tags, etc. The beginning of each category of tags is mentioned with a comment.
Spoiler :
yRNSL9Q.png


- All tags with default values were removed (no more 2000+ buildings with a <bCapital>0</bCapital>...). Each entry only has the relevant tags, making them easier to read and audit. The new files together are about 70% smaller compared to the current CIV4BuildingInfos.xml (or 12Mo smaller), this will perhaps help with the initial loading time?

- The iYield are always repeated 3 times (for :food:, :hammers: and :commerce:) and iCommerce tags 4 times (for :gold:, :science:, :culture: and :espionage:). Even though it works with the 0 entries at the end removed, I find it easier to read and less prone to errors that way.


Now I don't know whether you want to use it since it'd be extremely long to properly compare to the current version... It'll still be useful for modmods (mine or anybody else's) anyway.

If you have only done the buildings that were in the building folder then I would not hesitate to just put these in, as no one is working on those at the moment. If on the other hand you have merged some buildings from elsewhere then I will need to do the quality control thing.

Which is it? Only buildings that were in that folder or those plus others from elsewhere?
 
Does the AI really needs that to prioritize Gathering? It's not like there's much choice so early on, and researching Language or Cave Dwelling just before or just after Gathering won't really change the performance of the AI...

I don't bother with Cave Dwelling or Weaving until after I have Tracking (for Tracker), Oral Tradition, Cooking and Hard-hammer Percussion.

edit My actual bee-lines are Gathering, Language, Scavenging, Persistence Hunting, Tracking (scouts and trackers so I can start hunting animals and my gatherers can start building tracks everywhere in my territory), Oral Tradition, Herbalism, Cooking, then Hard hammer percussion.
 
Consciousness, which is well into Ancient era, doesn't require anything from that era, you can get it just with Conduct and Megalith Construction from Prehistoric era. I guess it should require Fungiculture instead? (which has Conduct and Megalith Construction as distant prerequisites anyway)

Makes sense, go for it. ^^
 
I've never put too much attention to the tech tree in-game (I usually pick a tech far ahead that looks interesting and let the game pick every prereq tech inbetween), but there are really some messed up things in there... Ceremony is just before Board Games, but requires Board Games (and Ideograms, which is already a prerequisite for BG), leading to a backward arrow going from the right of Board Games to the left of Ceremony...

I'm not sure whether the tech tree is wrong or if the prereq techs have been inverted (i.e. should Ceremony require BG or the other way around?).
 
Consciousness, which is well into Ancient era, doesn't require anything from that era, you can get it just with Conduct and Megalith Construction from Prehistoric era. I guess it should require Fungiculture instead? (which has Conduct and Megalith Construction as distant prerequisites anyway)

I don't understand why you want to change it. It has a huge cost compared with the other techs available so will probably not be researched until the Ancient anyway. What does it matter if someone does research it early.

There are a couple of places where techs have been added in as prerequisites, just to make things fit our history timeline when there is no real need and it stiffles the "what if I took this path" element of the game.
 
I don't understand why you want to change it. It has a huge cost compared with the other techs available so will probably not be researched until the Ancient anyway. What does it matter if someone does research it early.

Mainly because it's confusing that you don't need any nearby tech to discover it (you can even trigger Ancient Era with it...) despite it being litterally surrounded by many tech in the tech tree... And also the description of the tech seems fitting with needing Fungiculture rather than Megaliths :]

There are a couple of places where techs have been added in as prerequisites, just to make things fit our history timeline when there is no real need and it stiffles the "what if I took this path" element of the game.

There are many places where I think there are unnecessary prereq techs (one of the main reason why the tech tree is so confusing with lines everywhere); I can tweak some to allow more distinct development paths (currently it's rare that you can research more than a few columns ahead without requiring that you search nearly every tech earlier) and it will make drawing a nice tech tree much easier, but I don't want to mess too much with the balance and testing that has already been done... Well, if you're OK with it, just tell me.
 
I would not change any prerequisites in any of the Renaissance or earlier eras. We will be doing major changes when we get the Nomadic Start off the ground. Something I hope to be a major step closer to when I get back from my trip.
 
I don't understand why you want to change it. It has a huge cost compared with the other techs available so will probably not be researched until the Ancient anyway. What does it matter if someone does research it early.

There are a couple of places where techs have been added in as prerequisites, just to make things fit our history timeline when there is no real need and it stiffles the "what if I took this path" element of the game.

I hope this matter is already settled, but for what it's worth I totally agree with DH here.

(Figured I'd break the habit of a lifetime, and post about something I agreed with;)...)
 
I hope this matter is already settled, but for what it's worth I totally agree with DH here.

I haven't changed any of the tech prerequisites on the new xml I'm preparing (except to remove needless ones such as when tech A requires tech B and C, and tech B already requires tech C) ;)
 
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