Zav1, RaR, Cultural 25k
- Thread starter Zavior
- Start date
romeothemonk
Order of the Engineer
I've got it. Romeo3 and my Juliet took up my spare time Yesterday. I am not going to complain about the latter. Playing now.
romeothemonk
Order of the Engineer
IHT: Swap St. Petes to military academy, that way it gets a barracks that gives cpt and doesn't waste shields. Swap minsk to Bazaar, move Lee's nice stack back 1 space and declare on England.
IBT: Lose 2 Rop's, give lincoln flintlock for his gems.
Turn 1: Quito slavemarket to Library, Sevestpool, wiseman to library. Tblisis starts a temple. Upgrade some workers, since it will help in 1.03. Attack Nottingham, capture with no losses, killing a pike and a tribal guardian. (2-0)
IBT: Inca lose some units to America.
Turn 2: Minsk Bazaar to courthouse, going for Prison first, then Smiths. Resistance ends in nottingham, it had no buildings but our freebies. It goest to court. Iro and Sioux both start on Clauswitz.
IBT: Inca lose more units to America.
Turn 3: We build the Military Academy. Start Summer Palace. Build a curisaar and a windfarm, another cuirasser and a bazaar ordered up. Lose 1 cavalier, kill four pikes, and capture london, 4 slaves and Shangri La. Comes with no buildings other than wonders. Kill a lose english pike and a Man of war. We now have wines. (8-1). I sacraficed a worker in london to help us out a bit, London still seems like a bit of a flip risk, but for What we get, I will sacrafice a worker.
IBT:
Turn 4: A lot of Infra builds. Positioning now.
BIT: Iro RoP expires, Americans continue to kill Inca.
Turn 5: Positioning to take last english city. We get sugar, 9 gpt and a WM from Aztecs for sugar.
IBT: Inca and America continue to kill each other.
Turn 6: Build the summer palace, start on the Forbidden. I want the reduced empire corruption before the extra 2 cpt for 2 turns. Kill 2 pikes and a teutonic knight in York, get gems, and eliminate England. (11-1). Upgrade Treb to cannon.
IBT: Steam comes in and is already known this IBT only.
Turn 7: going to finish the FP this turn then revolt. Upgrade St. Petes pikes to muskets. Upgrae our lone sword to musket. Why all the upgrades you ask? Want to Declare war on Iro but we trade with them. :argh:
Turn 8: Get perspective, WM and 6 gpt from America for Cavalry Tactics. Revolt and draw a four turn Anarchy. We have coal by Chicago. Can get America to delcare, but see no current need.
Turn 9: Moving and improving.
Turn 10: Japan moves in on an obvious sneak attack, we cannot even boot or declare on them. Thus I will declare. I do declare (In my best southern Belle voice
). Kill a chariot, knights of the Realm, samaruai, and an Elelphant Rider. (15-1). We can trade with the Americans, or sign up the Aztecs vs the Japs. Sorry guys, I just can't stand peace in RaR.
Sorry for the delay guys.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads9/ZAV1-600AD.SAV
IBT: Lose 2 Rop's, give lincoln flintlock for his gems.
Turn 1: Quito slavemarket to Library, Sevestpool, wiseman to library. Tblisis starts a temple. Upgrade some workers, since it will help in 1.03. Attack Nottingham, capture with no losses, killing a pike and a tribal guardian. (2-0)
IBT: Inca lose some units to America.
Turn 2: Minsk Bazaar to courthouse, going for Prison first, then Smiths. Resistance ends in nottingham, it had no buildings but our freebies. It goest to court. Iro and Sioux both start on Clauswitz.
IBT: Inca lose more units to America.
Turn 3: We build the Military Academy. Start Summer Palace. Build a curisaar and a windfarm, another cuirasser and a bazaar ordered up. Lose 1 cavalier, kill four pikes, and capture london, 4 slaves and Shangri La. Comes with no buildings other than wonders. Kill a lose english pike and a Man of war. We now have wines. (8-1). I sacraficed a worker in london to help us out a bit, London still seems like a bit of a flip risk, but for What we get, I will sacrafice a worker.
IBT:
Turn 4: A lot of Infra builds. Positioning now.
BIT: Iro RoP expires, Americans continue to kill Inca.
Turn 5: Positioning to take last english city. We get sugar, 9 gpt and a WM from Aztecs for sugar.
IBT: Inca and America continue to kill each other.
Turn 6: Build the summer palace, start on the Forbidden. I want the reduced empire corruption before the extra 2 cpt for 2 turns. Kill 2 pikes and a teutonic knight in York, get gems, and eliminate England. (11-1). Upgrade Treb to cannon.
IBT: Steam comes in and is already known this IBT only.
Turn 7: going to finish the FP this turn then revolt. Upgrade St. Petes pikes to muskets. Upgrae our lone sword to musket. Why all the upgrades you ask? Want to Declare war on Iro but we trade with them. :argh:
Turn 8: Get perspective, WM and 6 gpt from America for Cavalry Tactics. Revolt and draw a four turn Anarchy. We have coal by Chicago. Can get America to delcare, but see no current need.
Turn 9: Moving and improving.
Turn 10: Japan moves in on an obvious sneak attack, we cannot even boot or declare on them. Thus I will declare. I do declare (In my best southern Belle voice
). Kill a chariot, knights of the Realm, samaruai, and an Elelphant Rider. (15-1). We can trade with the Americans, or sign up the Aztecs vs the Japs. Sorry guys, I just can't stand peace in RaR.Sorry for the delay guys.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads9/ZAV1-600AD.SAV
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 20,062
That is a strange sounding trade.
Remind me not to play after you. I like to have quite builders turns some of the time.
Signed up:
Bezhukov (on deck)
LKendter
Romeothemonk
Zavior (currently playing)
romeothemonk
Order of the Engineer
Whoops, the trade was for some garbage tech. I just cannot remember offhand.
The one good thing about playing oscillating war in RandR is that the AI rarely muster the SoD's of unmodded - especially the weak AI's. They have too many shield drains to produce the units. So you get to keep your troops in practice and get the occasional MGL with low risk. The downside is the restricted stategic options. War on the Sioux or Iroquois would be more profitable than war on Japan, and we lack the raw power to handle both at the moment.
War with Japan is the equivalent of quiet builder turns, as we can handle it with existing units, supplemented with reinforcements from Smolensk, while our other cities continue developing. Pls do not jump palace until the appropriate gardens are built...
War with Japan is the equivalent of quiet builder turns, as we can handle it with existing units, supplemented with reinforcements from Smolensk, while our other cities continue developing. Pls do not jump palace until the appropriate gardens are built...
romeothemonk
Order of the Engineer
Actually Bez, I really wanted to make war on the Iro on my turnset, but I couldn't because of deals. I couldn't even take on the Sioux during my turns, because of locked deals. BTW we are average with the sioux in terms of Military.
Through MLDR05 and other similar games, I am seeing the power of a human on a continual warpath. RaR just amplifies the little thing like kill ratio's and strategic planning. If you have a strategic goal and a tactical plan of how to accomplish it, and do not deviate from it, you can become a very sucessful warmonger.
I am absolutely salivating for a chance at LK88, a diety RaR game. I will get to do some massive warring against a tech leader. It will be the first turnset where I am not shakled with a specific peace/builder mode in mind.
Through MLDR05 and other similar games, I am seeing the power of a human on a continual warpath. RaR just amplifies the little thing like kill ratio's and strategic planning. If you have a strategic goal and a tactical plan of how to accomplish it, and do not deviate from it, you can become a very sucessful warmonger.
I am absolutely salivating for a chance at LK88, a diety RaR game. I will get to do some massive warring against a tech leader. It will be the first turnset where I am not shakled with a specific peace/builder mode in mind.
Well, LK88 presents a good opportunity to compare play styles, as I picked it up and played it to the end when I thought the game was dead. I promised not to post any more info from my game, as LK rightly pointed out that this was spoiler info, but when LK88 completes, I'll let you know how my game, and very different strategy, played out.
I think the bottom line is - the RandR AI needs help.
I think the bottom line is - the RandR AI needs help.
Press enter.
Turn1
Shift units towards japan.
Turn2
Some minor skirmishes at border.
Turn3
We take Satsuma. Japan is rallying her troops to north?
Turn4
Japanese counterattack is ridiculous. They suicide few champions
Turn5
Well, not so ridiculous anymore. They can actually kill units.
Turn6
Quiet turn. Some attacks on satsuma. No losses
Turn7
WW hits. Sign peace with japan. We need more troops to offer any resistance against kensai.
Turn8
We get industrialization. Start on steam engine.
Turn9
I absolutely know nothing to write. 2 cossacks head towards satsuma.
Turn10
Steam engine in 3. 3 Cossacks at go-to towards satsuma.
Turn1
Shift units towards japan.
Turn2
Some minor skirmishes at border.
Turn3
We take Satsuma. Japan is rallying her troops to north?
Turn4
Japanese counterattack is ridiculous. They suicide few champions
Turn5
Well, not so ridiculous anymore. They can actually kill units.
Turn6
Quiet turn. Some attacks on satsuma. No losses
Turn7
WW hits. Sign peace with japan. We need more troops to offer any resistance against kensai.
Turn8
We get industrialization. Start on steam engine.
Turn9
I absolutely know nothing to write. 2 cossacks head towards satsuma.
Turn10
Steam engine in 3. 3 Cossacks at go-to towards satsuma.
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I noticed that my request about was ignored.LKendter said:
I noticed a fortified leader in St. Petersburg. This is the same leader from the start of Zavior's turn. Leaders should be used ASAP.
What I am going to suggest is switch St. Petersburg to Heroic Epic (2 culture points), then leader rush National Monument for another 3. The factory should wait until after the critical 750AD date for culture doubling.
Pre-flight: Somehow I dont think our host is completely with the program, as our capital still has 8 pop, and St. Pete only 17. Kinda hard to generate leaders when youve already got one on ice. Cmon, Zav, youre a better player than that! Satsuma is a flip risk even for me, Im afraid to even ask LK about it starvation diet there. Wow, Londons got some nice wonders pls do not research Ship Building, as it turns off our Colossus there. Tblisi builds Hardy Colonist to claim city near American gold colony. Switch Moscow to Colonist to bleed pop before disbanding. Will short rush factory once St. Pete gets extra pop.
Somehow, weve managed to fall behind 7 techs. Zav, if youre just going to hit enter ten times, why play?
What happened to building Smiths? Too late now well just have to capture it.
710AD: Minsk: Port->SofS in 1, Odessa: Guild Hall->Temple (it has a specialist), Moscow: Colonist->Colonist
Oh, and our rep is also busted, as the Iros will pay nothing for our wine. Great. We lack the funds to short rush the factory. Making 100 spt.
IBT: Iros build Encyclopedia, lots of cascading
720AD: Short-rush factory in St. Pete via army gaining one turn of production for 215 gold. Minsk: Sofs->Factory, Smolensk:Line->Line (in 3), Pucara: Wise->Academy
730AD: St. Pete: Factory->Nat. Monument (in 7), rushed, Chicago: Town Clock->Academy (in1), Odessa: temple->market (happiness), Tblisi: Hardy->Academy in 1, Moscow:Colonist->dead.
Trade Steam Engine to Iro for three required techs, Sioux give us 750 gold, allowing 4 turn research on High Explosives.
Switch St. Pete to Palace Gardens in one, as they havent been built yet.
740AD: London: Forge->CH, Quito: Temple>Bazaar, Tblisi:Academy->SofS, Paracas:CH->Temple, Chicago:Academy->Toll House (in 1)
High Explosives falls to 2 turns. Our tech pace is picking up nicely.
750AD: More pollution hits St. Pete (two turns in a row, luckily not effecting production), St. Pete builds Nat. Monument->Coal Plant in 3 (may change once pollution is cleared), Sevastopol:Aqueduct->Town Clock, Chicago:Toll House->Guild Hall, Smolensk: Line->Line (every third turn, he can squeak out a little growth), Tblisi -> SofS->colonist (to grab Iron Works city location to north), Switch St. Pete to HE in 2 to get doubling faster (good fit with current production), will be able to get Forbidden Gardens in one soon with rails.
760AD: Various builds.
Send Aztecs our spare horse for sugar, we want to help the weaklings to try to slow down tech we are behind on buildings. We get 4 techs for High Explosives. We now have parity in required techs, but Electricity cancels our free granaries and monuments.
770AD: St. Pete: HE->Wiseman (Ill get these out of the way while railing should boost shields for bigger builds soon), Tblisi: Colonist->granary,
IMORTANT: Laborers take 12 turns to rail, peasants 24 (lets get em upgraded!)
780AD: Odessa: Library->Academy (in 1), St. Pete:Wiseman->SofS (research time dropped another turn), Tblisi:granary->factory, Quito: Bazaar->laborer
790AD: Get two techs and a bunch of cash for Steel, City Planning in 4, making money. Upgrade a bunch of workers. We now have replacable parts (rifles), this also makes Cossacks not quite so good. Still the best unit in Civ for cleaning up counters, but not so much for attacking cities.
I envision Chicago and Vladivostok being twin cities, both maxing at 15 pop (minimizing pollution, not needing sewers) and cranking lots of units. Vlad can get the Iron Works)
800AD: Well, the Iros just showed up in our north, so Ill let Romeo decide how to respond. All units have movement left. Good luck!
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads9/ZAV1-800AD.SAV
Somehow, weve managed to fall behind 7 techs. Zav, if youre just going to hit enter ten times, why play?
What happened to building Smiths? Too late now well just have to capture it.
710AD: Minsk: Port->SofS in 1, Odessa: Guild Hall->Temple (it has a specialist), Moscow: Colonist->Colonist
Oh, and our rep is also busted, as the Iros will pay nothing for our wine. Great. We lack the funds to short rush the factory. Making 100 spt.
IBT: Iros build Encyclopedia, lots of cascading
720AD: Short-rush factory in St. Pete via army gaining one turn of production for 215 gold. Minsk: Sofs->Factory, Smolensk:Line->Line (in 3), Pucara: Wise->Academy
730AD: St. Pete: Factory->Nat. Monument (in 7), rushed, Chicago: Town Clock->Academy (in1), Odessa: temple->market (happiness), Tblisi: Hardy->Academy in 1, Moscow:Colonist->dead.
Trade Steam Engine to Iro for three required techs, Sioux give us 750 gold, allowing 4 turn research on High Explosives.
Switch St. Pete to Palace Gardens in one, as they havent been built yet.
740AD: London: Forge->CH, Quito: Temple>Bazaar, Tblisi:Academy->SofS, Paracas:CH->Temple, Chicago:Academy->Toll House (in 1)
High Explosives falls to 2 turns. Our tech pace is picking up nicely.
750AD: More pollution hits St. Pete (two turns in a row, luckily not effecting production), St. Pete builds Nat. Monument->Coal Plant in 3 (may change once pollution is cleared), Sevastopol:Aqueduct->Town Clock, Chicago:Toll House->Guild Hall, Smolensk: Line->Line (every third turn, he can squeak out a little growth), Tblisi -> SofS->colonist (to grab Iron Works city location to north), Switch St. Pete to HE in 2 to get doubling faster (good fit with current production), will be able to get Forbidden Gardens in one soon with rails.
760AD: Various builds.
Send Aztecs our spare horse for sugar, we want to help the weaklings to try to slow down tech we are behind on buildings. We get 4 techs for High Explosives. We now have parity in required techs, but Electricity cancels our free granaries and monuments.
770AD: St. Pete: HE->Wiseman (Ill get these out of the way while railing should boost shields for bigger builds soon), Tblisi: Colonist->granary,
IMORTANT: Laborers take 12 turns to rail, peasants 24 (lets get em upgraded!)
780AD: Odessa: Library->Academy (in 1), St. Pete:Wiseman->SofS (research time dropped another turn), Tblisi:granary->factory, Quito: Bazaar->laborer
790AD: Get two techs and a bunch of cash for Steel, City Planning in 4, making money. Upgrade a bunch of workers. We now have replacable parts (rifles), this also makes Cossacks not quite so good. Still the best unit in Civ for cleaning up counters, but not so much for attacking cities.
I envision Chicago and Vladivostok being twin cities, both maxing at 15 pop (minimizing pollution, not needing sewers) and cranking lots of units. Vlad can get the Iron Works)
800AD: Well, the Iros just showed up in our north, so Ill let Romeo decide how to respond. All units have movement left. Good luck!
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads9/ZAV1-800AD.SAV
- Joined
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- Messages
- 20,062
The fall behind in tech happened on Romeothemonk turn. We were 6 techs behind as of then, and Zavior only fell behind by one more tech. I agree there was
during Zavior's turn, but the tech picture isn't it.This is disappointing to here. I know the play was to give up on Smith's in St. Petersburg and move it elsewhere. I read the comments that justified moving it. I have no clue why both Romeothemonk and Zavior ignored it.
WTH? I ended my 500AD turn with St. Pete and 19 pop points and Moscow at 3. Romeothemonk did let Moscow grow, but St. Pete is still at 19 pop points. St. Pete was at an Optimal 100 shields and now the pop is 17 and 87 shields. Bezhukov, this is where I agree with you 100% on a major mistake. I have no idea how St. Pete shrunk, but that NEVER should have happened.
Zavior, how did this happen? Our rep was perfect as of the start of you turns. The rep was ruined with the Iroquois.
Signed up:
Bezhukov
LKendter (currently playing, but not at all happy)
Romeothemonk (on deck)
Zavior
romeothemonk
Order of the Engineer
Bez, you have to ask how I will respond?? Anyone want to join in the party of making the Iro's Irrelevant??
I smell WAR!!
I do not think that Smiths is a lost cause, we can get it in St Petes in 10, and I would try and do that. In fact, I will do that, or at least start it after I get the coal plant done. I like wars for leader fishing.
I wouldn't come down too hard on our host, this is an interesting game, and I enjoy this one. Zavior also appears to be relatively new to SG's, and I always encourage new players to host games.
Plus by trade and training you and Lee, and to some extant myself are all taught to look through all the details, do long term planning and then execute the plans. It is not necessarily fair to assume that everyone does that. I like to use the fly by the seat of my pants technique in games sometimes.
I will get to this one after LK's Blood bath game.
I smell WAR!!
I do not think that Smiths is a lost cause, we can get it in St Petes in 10, and I would try and do that. In fact, I will do that, or at least start it after I get the coal plant done. I like wars for leader fishing.
I wouldn't come down too hard on our host, this is an interesting game, and I enjoy this one. Zavior also appears to be relatively new to SG's, and I always encourage new players to host games.
Plus by trade and training you and Lee, and to some extant myself are all taught to look through all the details, do long term planning and then execute the plans. It is not necessarily fair to assume that everyone does that. I like to use the fly by the seat of my pants technique in games sometimes.
I will get to this one after LK's Blood bath game.
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