Aspiring Rapper's MAFIA- Game Thread

[choxorn]

Mm, for people who don't think I'm explaining my reads - I do, in other posts. My reads lists are a summary of what I think.

Is there any particular reason you can't just get all your thoughts into one post instead of making 10 2-sentence posts every page? That would be a lot easier to parse through then all the fluff you've given us so far.

You, apparently?

Well, a lot of games on this site have a majority or some other restriction for a day 1 lynch so we often end up not lynching anyone day 1.

 

[Zack]

choxorn, do you have any thoughts besides frustration with the game's pace? Seems like that's all you've talked about.

 

[Zack]

Or a less stupidly vague question - gun to your head, who do you vote for right now?

 

[Murska]

Hey, I'm pretty proud of that ATPG day-1 lynch. Mostly because it was an actual non-random D1 lynch, which is rare, so I suppose it sort of does mean they're not generally that useful. Still, it does mean it is theoretically possible for Town to do analysis on day one successfully to lynch a wolf that would not otherwise have been lynched.

Anyway, the argument is moot since Zack is not claiming that we shouldn't play on Day 1.

Got them physics done-ish (sort of). It's midnight. I've got to make and eat dinner now. I'll try and read up on this thread if only to avoid drowning in posts tomorrow morning, but don't expect anything useful out of me unless you've got something specific to ask.

 

[landlubber]

I didn't say it was a tell, I said it fit in with your intention of cozying up to the high-content posters. Your last sentence there is transparent in what you're trying to do ("I'm not pleasant, see!").

That wasn't my intention. I don't need to brown-nose to play mafia.

Have you given a big reads/leans list? (no) Yet you demanded such from Visor on penalty of the lynch? A quarter into d1? That's being ridiculous and unfair to Visor, and I don't see how it ever made him scum, or why him responding to your threats and giving reads makes him not scum. As if a stubborn (or apathetic) refusal to do so makes him suspicious?

Show me where I asked for a big list. I never did. What I did ask was why Visor was posting so much distraction. He's usually laser-focused compared to other players, even on D1. My question was why this game seemed different. It's not about everyone providing a list, it's about everyone behaving as they normally do when they're town.

You sure took this personally.

Yes, I did, because I refuse to believe that you have to be unpleasant to be good at this game, and any amount of pleasantry must be some kind of ploy or tactic. No. I was in a good mood. That's all.

*sigh*

All these posts misconstruing my words in a pathetic attempt to try and make themselves look like noble townies and me like a cynical loser. Who said D1 was an excuse not to pay attention?

You sure took this personally.

And for the record, it is still weak. Behavioral and tone analysis is weak (see any game with Takhisis or johnhughthom ever), and that's all there is to go on right now. So yeah, there's a lot of content, but that doesn't mean it's useful for analysis. Look at all the cases being made right now, it's all pretty flimsy stuff.

I disagree. These cases aren't flimsy. We've got a lot of content from a lot of people. Not constructing a decent case from 700 posts, even if a lot of them were fluff, takes ignorance.

 

[landlubber]

I am now Visor:

You've deflected instead of addressing my real point. You haven't actually adjusted your case on me. I gave you an explanation of why I changed my vote. Either move on now, or keep tunneling.

 

[Lassie]

Skimming through a bunch of pages in Glossy's latest scum game, I'd say it's hard to compare this game to it, since it's too different sizes, and also there's a much higher activity in the other, from those part of it. So I won't care to look more into that.

@Cass, this is my read on her so far, based on this game:
She pretty much lives in the thread, posts constantly - that's rare for a scum to care to do, especially in game where high post volume isn't embraced or expected.
I'd say that is a strong indication she should be town.
Also, with such volume of posts, it will be fairly easy to go back later and see on interactions/comments including dead/outed scums.
So I'd say she is a fairly bad lynch to even consider for D1.

 

[Zack]

That wasn't my intention. I don't need to brown-nose to play mafia.

Then don't.

Show me where I asked for a big list. I never did. What I did ask was why Visor was posting so much distraction. He's usually laser-focused compared to other players, even on D1. My question was why this game seemed different. It's not about everyone providing a list, it's about everyone behaving as they normally do when they're town.

You said "I wanted reads/leans from Visor, and I said that very clearly when I voted for him" in #618, sorry for taking you at your word.

Yes, I did, because I refuse to believe that you have to be unpleasant to be good at this game, and any amount of pleasantry must be some kind of ploy or tactic. No. I was in a good mood. That's all.

I did not say or imply that. In fact, I actually made it clear that I thought jokes and stuff are not scummy like people are portraying them. I hope you recognize the cognitive dissonance in you going after Visor for "posting so much distraction" and complaining that "any amount of pleasantry must be some kind of ploy or tactic".

You sure took this personally.

There is a difference between someone implying you're suspicious and someone implying you're a fool. The former is not personal, the latter is. I was not responding to accusations of scumtitude.

I disagree. These cases aren't flimsy. We've got a lot of content from a lot of people. Not constructing a decent case from 700 posts, even if a lot of them were fluff, takes ignorance.

Just to be clear, this is your totally not-flimsy-at-all "case" on the person you're voting for.

I'm feeling worst about Al Sips. Call it slightly hypocritical of me, but his vote on Visor feels way too contrived. vote:Al Sips

 

[Lassie]

Zack is trending up

 

[Askthepizzaguy]

Link to video.

...In all seriousness, 72 hours remain, and it is still the first day...

 

[Sooh]

Yup = Penny. Is that who you thought it was?

I wasn't sure, and short of Lassie confirming it was her I would have still been uncertain. There were a number of things I didn't really see coming from her, but you were so certain, so I was kind of leaning on you for this one.

Then again, Glossysushi has been different this game as well from what I expected. Still working on what it means.

I fell asleep 1/5th into my reread of the thread. Either I'm exhausted or it was just really boring. I'm going to give it another hour before I go to bed and see how far I get.

 

[Sooh]

Also I got a temporary avi.

 

[Zack]

You've deflected instead of addressing my real point. You haven't actually adjusted your case on me. I gave you an explanation of why I changed my vote. Either move on now, or keep tunneling.

Then you misunderstand why I'm voting you. It's not for simply changing your vote. It's because you voted Visor when it was popular to vote him, backed off when it was popular to back off him, and voted for someone who several people had indicated they thought was scummy. I found your given reasons to be flimsy justification for following popular opinion, and it doesn't hurt that your other posts consist mainly of confirming/agreeing with what other people said.

You didn't address that. You just flailed at what you incorrectly perceived to be some sort of bizarre personal attack.

 

[Cass_]

I've only been scum in the games you've read, iirc. Links have been provided.(1)

Why are you not convinced that I'm actually trying to work out alignments? (2)

I like this post of yours, but why are you less on the fence about me if you haven't seen any of my town games, and are still on the fence about visor without knowing much about his games? (3)

1. Yup, I've only read your scum and scum-hydra games at DM so far (although at first, reading Usual Suspects last night I thought you were Town, having been highlighted blue ) and I'm aware of the potential for recency bias. That's why I asked for your solo Town games .

2. I'll try to get to this with specific posts as I re-read. In a nutshell it's because on first read through, I feel like you're focusing more on the act of FoS/questioning than you are the actual results/details of the game. I saw a lot of FoS questions and 'this player (including me, OMGUS!) may be scum' without a lot of specific reasoning why (which bothers me) and then a lack of follow up/conclusions after the initial answers (which is what bothers me more - IMO if you're Town testing for reactions, you should care about the reactions and share your
reasoning/conclusions). I also feel like you're FoSing a really large number of players/things, without actually paying attention to the all the details (eg, Pointing out my vote was 'still on Visor' and suggesting it was weird/scummy when it had clearly had moved).

3. I don't really understand the question. You're asking me why I'm more sure of my lean on you than the one I have on Visor, when I've read more of your games? I'm more sure of my read on you to here precisely because I have read more of your games. Also because you've posted in a way that's consistently bugged me so far, whereas I'm back and forth on Visor and stuck on the change in his behaviour. I can totally see most of his game this far with a majority of Scum or Town motivation.

4. What lean, if any, do these questions and responses give you about my alignment? Why?

As town you'd might be interested to see if I would reveal it myself, how and why, if/when I did. Or to see if someone of Cass, Visor and Cuth would realize I'm obviously not Alette, which I'd argue would look good for the one(s) who managed to, as it would give a hint of actually trying to solve me, which would be towny.

1. Have you and Alette both played with Visor/Cuth?
2. What leans, if any, did you get from Visor/Cuth's reactions?

Most people tend to associate Lassie with Alette, especially since I'm in this game.

How would it be towny for someone to 'solve who you are'? Most people will take your word for it.

I wouldn't let someone pollute Alette's meta. If she played like this, I'd have a conniption.

Essentially that's what I was building up to, lol. If you hadn't intervened Lassie was instantly going down for being not-Lassie .

Re arakhor: you posted as if you did care. Pretending to care was my criticism.

vote: glossysushi

"Who is situated to be in a scum team of 5-6 right now in this very game". That's the only question i care about

You let up to easily IMO. Make people vote and get actual weight that can be analyzed

Not touchy feely leans

@Kenningit
1. If you're against 'letting up too easily', how does Arakhor changing his behaviour specifically in response to your criticism after the fact make him less scummy? I didn't see anything convincingly Townish in the above responses?
2. Who do you think the wagons should be between today?

Sushi's scum

Visor might be scum

I miss cass's piggy avatar, but I'm pretty sure she's town.

@Cuth - Not that I disagree/don't appreciate the vote of confidence and the lol for piggy comment/potential nod/buddying but
1. Why?
2. Why?
3. Why?

 

[landlubber]

Then don't.

Okay, I'm done with this. I wasn't brown-nosing, and it's not up for argument.

You said "I wanted reads/leans from Visor, and I said that very clearly when I voted for him" in #618, sorry for taking you at your word.

What i meant was that I never needed a list of everyone; just any amount of substance. I've provided my views on people's metas and behavior throughout the game-- something similar was all I expected from Visor.

I did not say or imply that. In fact, I actually made it clear that I thought jokes and stuff are not scummy like people are portraying them. I hope you recognize the cognitive dissonance in you going after Visor for "posting so much distraction" and complaining that "any amount of pleasantry must be some kind of ploy or tactic".

Because three words when I've just woken up are equivalent to pages and pages of fluff? Please. That's not cognitive dissonance.

There is a difference between someone implying you're suspicious and someone implying you're a fool. The former is not personal, the latter is. I was not responding to accusations of scumtitude.

No one was implying that you were stupid. We're saying that this D1 is a lot more meaningful than you seem to be giving it credit for.

Just to be clear, this is your totally not-flimsy-at-all "case" on the person you're voting for.

There are a few reasons why my vote on Al Sips doesn't have as much argument behind it. First, he's barely posted. Second, my vote is in large part a pressure vote. Third, a lot of the cases on the more complicated players, like sushi, have already been discussed. I chose to go for an alternative instead of beating a dead horse.

I again say that you shouldn't deflect so much. Do you really think I'm scum? Honestly? Because I have a hard time believing that.

 

[Zack]

I again say that you shouldn't deflect so much.

Who's deflecting?

Do you really think I'm scum? Honestly? Because I have a hard time believing that.

Okay, I'm done with this. I wasn't brown-nosing, and it's not up for argument.

---

There are a few reasons why my vote on Al Sips doesn't have as much argument behind it. First, he's barely posted. Second, my vote is in large part a pressure vote. Third, a lot of the cases on the more complicated players, like sushi, have already been discussed. I chose to go for an alternative instead of beating a dead horse.

I could say pretty much the same thing about my vote dude. Biggest difference is there's a distinct lack of righteous indignation from Al Sips.

 

[Zack]

(edited the quote formatting in #656)

 

[Lassie]

"1. Have you and Alette both played with Visor/Cuth?
2. What leans, if any, did you get from Visor/Cuth's reactions?"

1. I haven't played with Visor. I believe Alette has played with both
2. In hindsight, I don't think any of Visor and Cuth has played enough with Alette, to really have much of a chance to realize it isn't her. I think Visor's reaction to the reveal wasn't pingy, from what I recall - didn't like Cuth's reaction, but not to a point that I think it is noteworthy(also I don't recall his exact wording at this point, just my impression when seeing it).

 

[landlubber]

Then you misunderstand why I'm voting you. It's not for simply changing your vote. It's because you voted Visor when it was popular to vote him, backed off when it was popular to back off him, and voted for someone who several people had indicated they thought was scummy. I found your given reasons to be flimsy justification for following popular opinion, and it doesn't hurt that your other posts consist mainly of confirming/agreeing with what other people said.

You didn't address that. You just flailed at what you incorrectly perceived to be some sort of bizarre personal attack.

I dispute that I'm flailing. I am peeved.

I actually did address your "case" on me, here:

What I did ask was why Visor was posting so much distraction. He's usually laser-focused compared to other players, even on D1. My question was why this game seemed different.

and here:

Yes, the "winds were changing," but they were changing for a reason-- Visor changed his behavior.

I admit that I followed popular opinion, but it's because my vote and others on Visor were based on similar logic, and Visor's behavior was enough to convince me to move my vote off of him.

 

[landlubber]

Who's deflecting?

Both of those quotes are me trying to stick to relevant topics of discussion. Saying that I was trying to brown-nose is not relevant. Keeping a circular argument going instead of focusing on who's being scummy is not relevant.

I could say pretty much the same thing about my vote dude. Biggest difference is there's a distinct lack of righteous indignation from Al Sips.

There are similarities between my vote on Visor and Al Sips's vote on Visor, I'll give you that. I'm no longer voting for Visor, that's the difference.