C2C _ Unhealthiness Mod

[Thunderbrd]

GREAT list there! It'll definitely help me to further the disease structures once I've got the mechanism smoothed out in the dll (which will be a while since its quite a few steps down the road on the combat mod development paths - maybe not as far away as it may seem though... progress is being made in that direction.)

 

[Hydromancerx]

@TB

What steps need to be done?

 

[Thunderbrd]

It awaits not only a LOT of xml, including completing the combat class project first, but also should be significantly reprogrammed due to some discussions I've had with AIAndy. The plan is to make the current advanced disease structure not only apply potentially to diseases but to other kinds of properties, such as potentially crime. It's a major conversion of code project which is a bit complicated but should be doable and won't take too many weeks to sort out once I get there.

The main thing is that there are more foundational things to work on in the combat mod. I need to get the combat classes plotted out to all our units - a big part of what the disease mechanism will rely on. Then there's a focus on reviewing, expanding, auditing and editing our skill based promos. Balancing unit progressions regarding the more basic Combat Mod tags (such as the planning work recently done for withdrawal/early withdrawal and pursuit - there's a number of tags that will need this sort of treatment and that in and of itself is not an overnight task). Then Equipments, Poisons, THEN Disease.

Poisons are bit more straightforward so I'm thinking they'd be a little easier to implement and will present us with some proofs of concept and practice on how to work with Afflictions. This will then help us with developing and designing diseases properly.

It's becoming apparent that the initial combat mod programming formed a skeleton and a plan more than anything and that just about all of the features it brings forward require further programming and development as we begin to attempt to implement them. This is fine but time consuming. The xml design and implementation is nowhere near as fast as I had naively presumed it could be either. This is fine... just time consuming.

Aka... be very very patient here. We're getting to Diseases and Equipments - just a little slower than hoped

 

[Hydromancerx]

Thanks for explaining. And keep up the great work!

 

[JosEPh_II]

Isn't this DH's Mod?

JosEPh

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

It was but my preferred mechanism for disease is nothing like the current disease system and wont work with it as far as I can see.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Added 10 NEW Diseases to the SVN. Mostly as a placeholder until the more advanced disease system is put in place. Note they are set to all trigger at 100 disease because I had no idea where to set them at plus they probably will be triggered differently in the advanced system.

Note that stats and requirements are a WIP. They can and will be changed later so please don't everyone freak out. Right now they are easily triggered and can go obsolete at techs however they cannot spread or be cured yet.

In the finished version some may be much more severe. The new ones are ...

- Disease (Bubonic Plague)
- Disease (Cholera)
- Disease (Diphtheria)
- Disease (HIV)
- Disease (Leprosy)
- Disease (Malaria)
- Disease (Measles)
- Disease (Scarlet Feaver)
- Disease (Smallpox)
- Disease (Typhoid Fever)

Note I talked to TB first and he said "Your property based diseases would suit as good placeholders for now." So that's what they are for now.

 

[Faustmouse]

you could probably implent non contaginous diseases like:
Heart Attacks
Stroke
Various Cancers
Obesity
Alzheimer's
...

 

[khh]

Are the diseases decreased or eradicated as medication and vaccines becomes available for that specific disease (presumably though technology research)?

 

[LumenAngel]

They all go obsolete at a tranhuman tech.
But with these add, I will play like always : no fight against disease, because 300 or 100 is the same thing. It cost far less to add some healrh.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Added 10 NEW Diseases to the SVN. Mostly as a placeholder until the more advanced disease system is put in place. Note they are set to all trigger at 100 disease because I had no idea where to set them at plus they probably will be triggered differently in the advanced system.

Note that stats and requirements are a WIP. They can and will be changed later so please don't everyone freak out. Right now they are easily triggered and can go obsolete at techs however they cannot spread or be cured yet.

In the finished version some may be much more severe. The new ones are ...

- Disease (Bubonic Plague)
- Disease (Cholera)
- Disease (Diphtheria)
- Disease (HIV)
- Disease (Leprosy)
- Disease (Malaria)
- Disease (Measles)
- Disease (Scarlet Feaver)
- Disease (Smallpox)
- Disease (Typhoid Fever)

Note I talked to TB first and he said "Your property based diseases would suit as good placeholders for now." So that's what they are for now.

I'd suggest splitting them up a bit and making the more severe ones require more and the less severe ones require less (or you could think in terms of how easy it is for a disease to spread which would be the bigger determining factor in disease level basis.)

If you have them all activate at the same level you'll have a sudden dropoff for cities that hit that level and it should be much more gradual like crime is arranged now.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Are the diseases decreased or eradicated as medication and vaccines becomes available for that specific disease (presumably though technology research)?

Here are the current ones ...

|Req Tech|Req Resource|Req Terrain|Req Building|Req Disease lvl|||Obsolete Tech|Other
Anthrax|None|Cow or Sheep|-|-|+100|0|1|Smart Drugs
Bird Flu|None|Poultry or Parrots|-|-|+100|0|1|Smart Drugs
Bubonic Plague|Agricultural Tools|-|-|Pests (Fleas)|+200|2|5|Modern Health Care
Cholera|Canal Systems|-|-|-|+100|0|4|Smart Drugs|+1 with Sanitation, +1 Modern Sanitation
Common Cold|None|-|-|-|+1|0|1|None
Diphtheria|Trade|-|-|-|+100|0|2|Medicine
Dysentery|Canal Systems|-|-|-|+50|0|3|Modern Healthcare|+1 with Sanitation, +1 Modern Sanitation
HIV|Genetics|-|-|-|+100|2|5|Homo Superior|
Kuru|None|-|-|-|+0|0|1|None|-5%
Leprosy|Crop Rotation|-|-|-|+100|1|2|Modern Healthcare|
Malaria|None|-|-|Pests (Mosquitoes)|+150|0|4|Modern Healthcare|
Measles|Anatomy|-|-|-|+100|0|3|Modern Healthcare|
Scarlet Feaver|Biology|-|-|-|+100|0|3|Smart Drugs|
Scurvy|None|-|-|-|+50|0|1|Modern Healthcare|+1 with Lemons
Smallpox|Sedentary Lifestyle|-|-|-|+200|2|5|Antibiotics|
Swine Flu|None|Pigs|-|-|+100|0|1|Smart Drugs|
Typhoid Fever|Sedentary Lifestyle|-|-|-|+150|1|3|Antibiotics|+1 with Sanitation

Note these are all subject to change and open to suggestions on how to improve them.

I'd suggest splitting them up a bit and making the more severe ones require more and the less severe ones require less (or you could think in terms of how easy it is for a disease to spread which would be the bigger determining factor in disease level basis.)

If you have them all activate at the same level you'll have a sudden dropoff for cities that hit that level and it should be much more gradual like crime is arranged now.

Like I said I have no idea at what Disease level they should be. I would gladly chnage them if some told me what values they should be.

 

[Thunderbrd]

hmm... there are some communicability datas on diseases in RL... they're all rated on how easily they are spread and such. Perhaps a little research on the diseases themselves and how they are rated by the CDC might give us some basis for developing the disease thresholds.

 

[LumenAngel]

Mainly, I think ALL contagious disease have to reduce trade route, not only some unhealth
Bubonic Plague and Smallpox at 200 Disease. Malaria and Typhoid at 150

Anf I think C2C really need a "No <ressource>" tag. So Scurvy can have a "No Lemons" tag and having some medecine ressource can really "delete" the disease, and not a tech.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Mainly, I think ALL contagious disease have to reduce trade route, not only some unhealth
Bubonic Plague and Smallpox at 200 Disease. Malaria and Typhoid at 150

Anf I think C2C really need a "No <ressource>" tag. So Scurvy can have a "No Lemons" tag and having some medecine ressource can really "delete" the disease, and not a tech.

1. Sure I can chnage those.

2. Well the +1 is canceled out buy the +1 of Lemons. Thus its like the disease is not there, until it goes obsolete.

EDIT: I updated my chart with the new disease levels you suggested.

 

[LumenAngel]

2. Well the +1 is canceled out buy the +1 of Lemons. Thus its like the disease is not there, until it goes obsolete.

Only because it's the only effect of this disease.
And not in a city with no from buldings. Disease wille give you more health, then...

 

[Nimek]

@hydro
How are you doing so nice tables. How syntax looks like?
I would like to add export to this format to my XML parser.

 

[Hydromancerx]

With Code

|X|Y|Z
A|0|0|0
B|1|1|1
C|2|2|2

Without Code
|X|Y|Z
A|0|0|0
B|1|1|1
C|2|2|2

 

[Nimek]

Ok thanks

I will try

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

OK, I think I know know enough and we have enough to get at least some of the diseases working as I would like.

Firstly the disease buildings stand as they are now with maybe a few tweaks. They represent the fact that the disease is in the city.

Outbreaks are severe occurrences of the disease. They last 1-2 turns and kill population! Once you have had an outbreak in a city it is immune for a number of turns. The chance of an outbreak depends on your disease level as does its severity and how long the city is immune for.

These are not events and all disease events will be replaced by this system.

Basically each turn each of these select diseases are checked for in the city.

Has the disease been eliminated or has your nation run the immunization program? If so then no outbreak.

If an outbreak is happening check to see if it continues. If it does apply the effects and remove the outbreak building. If it doesn't then just remove the outbreak building.

If the disease is not present then no outbreak. (Remove the immunity building if it exists.)

If the disease and immunity building are present than a check is made against the immunity failing, if it fails it disappears (check for outbreak) otherwise it stays and there is no outbreak.

If the disease is present and immunity building is not present then there is a chance of an outbreak based on the city disease level. The effects take place and and outbreak building is added to the city.​

This will need Python but will be visible via the buildings. It probably does not need more AI as I believe the ai already tries to keep disease under control.

Idea 1: With this change I would like to see a special small project to develop the cure and perhaps another UN project to eradicate the disease.

The UN project would cost some amount and each x turns you are asked to supply some amount to the cause until the full cost has been paid. Naturally you would have options on how much to pay or not which would have impact on international relations.

Idea 2: Weaponized Disease. If a disease has been eliminated in a nation it becomes susceptible to a weaponized version of the disease...