SGOTM 21 - Xteam
- Thread starter AlanH
- Start date
It's just inherently tedious, Folket.
I'll be able to look at save in about 4 hours.
I'll be able to look at save in about 4 hours.
Dhoomstriker
Girlie Builder
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Suggested PPP
Turnset Goals:
1. Get units in position to capture Warwick, but leave Elizabeth with Queen's Palace (do not capture Queen's Palace)
2. Get Military Units on board boats all around Elizabeth's main island
3. Grow Utrecht (target City Size is Size 10) while working all of the Hammer-producing squares
4. Earn Failure Gold in the Heroic Epic (we can't on T152 as we didn't make Barracks yet) and the Hermitage on every turn
Diplo Policies:
Refuse Requests/Demands for:
Communism
our World Map
Gold that is more than 100 Gold
Other Requests/Demands for Techs/Gold/Resources should be accepted, except from Shaka
Do not give in to any Requests/Demands from Shaka, as we want to go to war with Shaka soon
Refuse to join in on anyone's war
Refuse to stop trading with anyone's Worst Enemy
Do not trade away these techs:
Civil Service
Philosophy
Nationalism
Communism
Do not end the war with Elizabeth (the target date to do the next round of Cease Fire + Liberation + City-recapturing is T154 or perhaps T155 if everything hasn't fallen into place for T154)
T152, 840 AD
Worker 10 (1N of Hippos): Move to the Tun H For Road that is 2NW of Hippos and Chop it
Cat in Sleepy Sheep: Head westward along the Roads
Settler in City 4: Go to New Amsterdam (to board a future Galleon)
Hindu Missionary in Utrecht: Go eastward to New Amsterdam... try to have him end his turn on the GH For Road that is 1S of the "City after Taj Mahal?" sign (he will go to New Amsterdam to board a future Galleon)
Great General: Hangs out in Utrecht
Units on Elizabeth's Queen's Palace Island:
Do not capture Queen's Palace
Knight 2, Cat 5, and Cat 8 all move 1NE onto Galleon 6
Everyone else moves 1E to the Des H that is 1NW of Queen's Palace... we just want to get into better position for teleporting; we do not want to capture Queen's Palace
Galleon 7 (NW of Hastings): Move 2W to kill the Trireme then move back 1E toward Hastings
Galleon 3 (1E of Coventry): Move into Coventry and Skip its Turn
Galleon 8 (1N of London): Move into London, load WE 1 onto Galleon 8, then move 2W of London
William (1SW of Canterbury): Move into Canterbury, load Spearman 1 into William, then move William 2SW toward Warwick
Galleon 2 (NE + N of Piscatorium): Wait for the 2 Workers who just finished Roading the Silver
Spies 3 and 4 can stay in place in Hastings and Canterbury
Confucian Missionary in Surfin' Turf: Head to The Hague to spread Confucianism there
In Coventry, load find the second Spearman 1 and give him another name, such as Spearman 10, then load him into the QE Galleon
QE Galleon stays inside of Coventry
Wake up Galleon 1 inside of Tekedda (one of Mansa's western Cities), move Galleon 1 1SW, then Skip its turn (we can still pick up Worker 5 next turn)
Galleon 5 (in Marble City): Move south and south-east to meet up with Galleon 4
Transfer Crossbowman 1 and WE 9 to Galleon 4
Confirm that we have 2 Military Units board Galleon 4 and then send Galleon 4 toward Sparta (Stone City)... we can spend a turn on the Galleon in that City to heal the War Elephant and then we can head toward the Barb City of Phrygian near Louis
X-ops: Build queue: Confucian Temple -> Hindu Temple -> Customs House
Gems: Heroic Epic -> Cat -> Odeon
Surfin' Turf: Hermitage (build a Barracks instead of the Hermitage in Piscatorium)
City 4: Settler
Athens: Wealth
Piscatorium: Barracks
Hippos: The Kremlin
Utrecht: 2 Artists -> 2 GH Mines, building Taj Mahal (we will rehire the 2 Artists at City Size 10)
Sleepy Sheep: Wealth
New Amsterdam: Harbour -> Library
The Hague: Hindu Missionary -> Hindu Missionary
Canterbury: Wealth
Marble: Whip the Confucian Missionary; Confucian Missionary -> Confucian Missionary
Hastings, London, and York: doesn't matter
Bethlehem: Wealth
Nottingham: doesn't matter
Hun: Settler
Sparta (aka Stone): Wealth
Coventry: doesn't matter
T153, 860 AD
Make this trade:
Engineering + his Gold + his World Map from Louis <-> Scientific Method
Worker 10 (NW + NW of Hippos): Move to the Tun H For that is 3N of Hippos
Worker 4 (1N of Hippos): Move to the Tun H For that is SW + S + S of Hippos
Worker 3 (1N of Hippos): Move to the Tun H For that is NW + N + N of Hippos and Chop it
Worker 7 and Worker 12 (1N of Piscatorium): Move 1NE onto Galleon 2
Galleon 2 heads toward New Amsterdam
Chariot 1 (in Hastings): Move 1W + 1NW onto Galleon 7
Galleon 7 moves 2N to NW + NW + N of Hastings and Skip turn
Worker 5 (at Mansa's City of Tekedda) moves 2SW onto Galleon 1
Galleon 1 unloads only Worker 6 into Sleepy Sheep (keep Worker 5 on board to be unloaded in New Amsterdam next turn)
Worker 6 moves 1SW and Farms the Plains square that is 1SW of Sleepy Sheep
Galleon 8 (2W of London): Hopefully, we can move to NW + N of Nottingham, then WE 3 from Nottingham can pick him up, then Galleon 8 can move to NW + W + W of London
Willam Galleon (NW + N of Warwick) moves south to drop off Spearman 1 on the GH Mine that is 1SW of Warwick, then moves to NW + N of Queen's Palace, then Spearman 6 and Spearman 1 get on board William
The rest of the stack that is 1NW of Queen's Palace does not capture Queen's Palace and moves 1E Des (1N of Queen's Palace)
Mace 1 (in York) gets on the William Galleon
Galleon 6 unloads 2 Cats and 1 Knight on the GH Mine Road that is 1SW of Warwick
Galleon 3 (in Coventry) moves 2NE of Coventry and skips its turn
Galleon 5 can head south-eastward to form a future partial Galleon chain between New Amsterdam and Mao's area
Galleon 4 can move into Sparta (Stone City) and skip its turn so that our War Elephant can quickly heal for this turn
Confucian Missionary in Marble City can move 2NW, then we select him and gift him to Mao (the pink present button)
One of the Workers that are 1N of Marble can move to the G For that is 1W of Marble
Workers near Utretch, now that we have Engineering:
Workers 1 (NE + N + N of Utrecht): Move to the G For Road that is 3E of Utretch and Chop it
Workers 8 (NE + NE + N of Utrecht), 11 (NE + NE of Utrecht), and no number Worker (NE + E + E of Utrecht)--maybe name him Worker 15: can all move to the G Riv Farm that is 2S of Utrecht and build a Watermill (If we can't get Engineering in trade for some reason, don't move them and we'll figure out something else for them to do)
Worker 9 (SE + E + E of Utrecht): Chop the GH For
We don't want to Chop any of the other Forests in the Utrecht area
X-ops: Hindu Temple -> Customs House, work the 2S Windmill with the new citizen
Gems: Cat -> Odeon, work the just-completed 1E P Farm with the new citizen
Surfin' Turf: Hermitage
City 4: Settler
Athens: Wealth
Piscatorium: Heroic Epic
Hippos: The Kremlin
Utrecht: Taj Mahal
Sleepy Sheep: Wealth
New Amsterdam: Library -> Harbour
The Hague: Hindu Missionary
Canterbury: Wealth
Marble: Confucian Missionary
Hastings, London, and York: doesn't matter
Bethlehem: Wealth
Nottingham: doesn't matter
Hun: Settler
Sparta (aka Stone): Wealth
Coventry: doesn't matter
Turnset Goals:
1. Get units in position to capture Warwick, but leave Elizabeth with Queen's Palace (do not capture Queen's Palace)
2. Get Military Units on board boats all around Elizabeth's main island
3. Grow Utrecht (target City Size is Size 10) while working all of the Hammer-producing squares
4. Earn Failure Gold in the Heroic Epic (we can't on T152 as we didn't make Barracks yet) and the Hermitage on every turn
Diplo Policies:
Refuse Requests/Demands for:
Communism
our World Map
Gold that is more than 100 Gold
Other Requests/Demands for Techs/Gold/Resources should be accepted, except from Shaka
Do not give in to any Requests/Demands from Shaka, as we want to go to war with Shaka soon
Refuse to join in on anyone's war
Refuse to stop trading with anyone's Worst Enemy
Do not trade away these techs:
Civil Service
Philosophy
Nationalism
Communism
Do not end the war with Elizabeth (the target date to do the next round of Cease Fire + Liberation + City-recapturing is T154 or perhaps T155 if everything hasn't fallen into place for T154)
T152, 840 AD
Worker 10 (1N of Hippos): Move to the Tun H For Road that is 2NW of Hippos and Chop it
Cat in Sleepy Sheep: Head westward along the Roads
Settler in City 4: Go to New Amsterdam (to board a future Galleon)
Hindu Missionary in Utrecht: Go eastward to New Amsterdam... try to have him end his turn on the GH For Road that is 1S of the "City after Taj Mahal?" sign (he will go to New Amsterdam to board a future Galleon)
Great General: Hangs out in Utrecht
Units on Elizabeth's Queen's Palace Island:
Do not capture Queen's Palace
Knight 2, Cat 5, and Cat 8 all move 1NE onto Galleon 6
Everyone else moves 1E to the Des H that is 1NW of Queen's Palace... we just want to get into better position for teleporting; we do not want to capture Queen's Palace
Galleon 7 (NW of Hastings): Move 2W to kill the Trireme then move back 1E toward Hastings
Galleon 3 (1E of Coventry): Move into Coventry and Skip its Turn
Galleon 8 (1N of London): Move into London, load WE 1 onto Galleon 8, then move 2W of London
William (1SW of Canterbury): Move into Canterbury, load Spearman 1 into William, then move William 2SW toward Warwick
Galleon 2 (NE + N of Piscatorium): Wait for the 2 Workers who just finished Roading the Silver
Spies 3 and 4 can stay in place in Hastings and Canterbury
Confucian Missionary in Surfin' Turf: Head to The Hague to spread Confucianism there
In Coventry, load find the second Spearman 1 and give him another name, such as Spearman 10, then load him into the QE Galleon
QE Galleon stays inside of Coventry
Wake up Galleon 1 inside of Tekedda (one of Mansa's western Cities), move Galleon 1 1SW, then Skip its turn (we can still pick up Worker 5 next turn)
Galleon 5 (in Marble City): Move south and south-east to meet up with Galleon 4
Transfer Crossbowman 1 and WE 9 to Galleon 4
Confirm that we have 2 Military Units board Galleon 4 and then send Galleon 4 toward Sparta (Stone City)... we can spend a turn on the Galleon in that City to heal the War Elephant and then we can head toward the Barb City of Phrygian near Louis
X-ops: Build queue: Confucian Temple -> Hindu Temple -> Customs House
Gems: Heroic Epic -> Cat -> Odeon
Surfin' Turf: Hermitage (build a Barracks instead of the Hermitage in Piscatorium)
City 4: Settler
Athens: Wealth
Piscatorium: Barracks
Hippos: The Kremlin
Utrecht: 2 Artists -> 2 GH Mines, building Taj Mahal (we will rehire the 2 Artists at City Size 10)
Sleepy Sheep: Wealth
New Amsterdam: Harbour -> Library
The Hague: Hindu Missionary -> Hindu Missionary
Canterbury: Wealth
Marble: Whip the Confucian Missionary; Confucian Missionary -> Confucian Missionary
Hastings, London, and York: doesn't matter
Bethlehem: Wealth
Nottingham: doesn't matter
Hun: Settler
Sparta (aka Stone): Wealth
Coventry: doesn't matter
T153, 860 AD
Make this trade:
Engineering + his Gold + his World Map from Louis <-> Scientific Method
Spoiler :
Worker 10 (NW + NW of Hippos): Move to the Tun H For that is 3N of Hippos
Worker 4 (1N of Hippos): Move to the Tun H For that is SW + S + S of Hippos
Worker 3 (1N of Hippos): Move to the Tun H For that is NW + N + N of Hippos and Chop it
Worker 7 and Worker 12 (1N of Piscatorium): Move 1NE onto Galleon 2
Galleon 2 heads toward New Amsterdam
Chariot 1 (in Hastings): Move 1W + 1NW onto Galleon 7
Galleon 7 moves 2N to NW + NW + N of Hastings and Skip turn
Worker 5 (at Mansa's City of Tekedda) moves 2SW onto Galleon 1
Galleon 1 unloads only Worker 6 into Sleepy Sheep (keep Worker 5 on board to be unloaded in New Amsterdam next turn)
Worker 6 moves 1SW and Farms the Plains square that is 1SW of Sleepy Sheep
Galleon 8 (2W of London): Hopefully, we can move to NW + N of Nottingham, then WE 3 from Nottingham can pick him up, then Galleon 8 can move to NW + W + W of London
Willam Galleon (NW + N of Warwick) moves south to drop off Spearman 1 on the GH Mine that is 1SW of Warwick, then moves to NW + N of Queen's Palace, then Spearman 6 and Spearman 1 get on board William
The rest of the stack that is 1NW of Queen's Palace does not capture Queen's Palace and moves 1E Des (1N of Queen's Palace)
Mace 1 (in York) gets on the William Galleon
Galleon 6 unloads 2 Cats and 1 Knight on the GH Mine Road that is 1SW of Warwick
Galleon 3 (in Coventry) moves 2NE of Coventry and skips its turn
Galleon 5 can head south-eastward to form a future partial Galleon chain between New Amsterdam and Mao's area
Galleon 4 can move into Sparta (Stone City) and skip its turn so that our War Elephant can quickly heal for this turn
Confucian Missionary in Marble City can move 2NW, then we select him and gift him to Mao (the pink present button)
One of the Workers that are 1N of Marble can move to the G For that is 1W of Marble
Workers near Utretch, now that we have Engineering:
Workers 1 (NE + N + N of Utrecht): Move to the G For Road that is 3E of Utretch and Chop it
Workers 8 (NE + NE + N of Utrecht), 11 (NE + NE of Utrecht), and no number Worker (NE + E + E of Utrecht)--maybe name him Worker 15: can all move to the G Riv Farm that is 2S of Utrecht and build a Watermill (If we can't get Engineering in trade for some reason, don't move them and we'll figure out something else for them to do)
Worker 9 (SE + E + E of Utrecht): Chop the GH For
We don't want to Chop any of the other Forests in the Utrecht area
X-ops: Hindu Temple -> Customs House, work the 2S Windmill with the new citizen
Gems: Cat -> Odeon, work the just-completed 1E P Farm with the new citizen
Surfin' Turf: Hermitage
City 4: Settler
Athens: Wealth
Piscatorium: Heroic Epic
Hippos: The Kremlin
Utrecht: Taj Mahal
Sleepy Sheep: Wealth
New Amsterdam: Library -> Harbour
The Hague: Hindu Missionary
Canterbury: Wealth
Marble: Confucian Missionary
Hastings, London, and York: doesn't matter
Bethlehem: Wealth
Nottingham: doesn't matter
Hun: Settler
Sparta (aka Stone): Wealth
Coventry: doesn't matter
Dhoomstriker
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I think that you did all of the important stuff just as we wanted it done, Folket. Really nice work! 
Setting up for the next round of Cease Fire + Liberation + recapturing of Elizabeth's Cities is the trickiest part; I've tried to put us in a good position for that, but it's hard to plan too far in advance, so we'll just have to take it 1.5 turns as our first step and then write a new plan for the remaining part of this task after having played forward a bit more.
Once the Elizabeth wars are behind us, the turnsets should become a bit easier to plan.
There is a "Watermill" sign that is on the P Riv that is 1S of New Amsterdam, but I think that we'll instead put a Watermill over top of the G Riv Farm that is 1SW of New Amsterdam. The other P Riv Watermills for City 4 have already been started, so we can simply plan to finish them, while putting a P Riv Farm at 1S of New Amsterdam.
Setting up for the next round of Cease Fire + Liberation + recapturing of Elizabeth's Cities is the trickiest part; I've tried to put us in a good position for that, but it's hard to plan too far in advance, so we'll just have to take it 1.5 turns as our first step and then write a new plan for the remaining part of this task after having played forward a bit more.
Once the Elizabeth wars are behind us, the turnsets should become a bit easier to plan.
There is a "Watermill" sign that is on the P Riv that is 1S of New Amsterdam, but I think that we'll instead put a Watermill over top of the G Riv Farm that is 1SW of New Amsterdam. The other P Riv Watermills for City 4 have already been started, so we can simply plan to finish them, while putting a P Riv Farm at 1S of New Amsterdam.
Looked over the detailed plan and have just a few questions:
Settler in City4 is supposed to go to New Amsterdam to board a galleon, yet you have me send him to the GHforest road that is 1S of the CATTM sign. Please clarify.
E has a galley WSW of London. If we take the WEs out of London and Nottingham, any units aboard would seem to pose some risk to those cities. Is this another one of those not-in-BtS things?
[There is no worker 0 near Hippos. You must mean worker 10.]
If fast teching is our limiting factor, it would seem undesirable to liberate London and risk losing infrastructure. Might we be guilty of over-liberating? Along the same max-tech line, wouldn't HE in Xopolis this turn make sense, and, if not there, then at least in Gems?
" but I think that we'll instead put a Watermill over top of the G Riv Farm that is 1NW of New Amsterdam." Trust you mean 1SW.
Longer term: Where will we use our military next? When will the AP resolutions be coming up again?
Awaiting feedback before playing.
Settler in City4 is supposed to go to New Amsterdam to board a galleon, yet you have me send him to the GHforest road that is 1S of the CATTM sign. Please clarify.
E has a galley WSW of London. If we take the WEs out of London and Nottingham, any units aboard would seem to pose some risk to those cities. Is this another one of those not-in-BtS things?
[There is no worker 0 near Hippos. You must mean worker 10.]
If fast teching is our limiting factor, it would seem undesirable to liberate London and risk losing infrastructure. Might we be guilty of over-liberating? Along the same max-tech line, wouldn't HE in Xopolis this turn make sense, and, if not there, then at least in Gems?
" but I think that we'll instead put a Watermill over top of the G Riv Farm that is 1NW of New Amsterdam." Trust you mean 1SW.
Longer term: Where will we use our military next? When will the AP resolutions be coming up again?
Awaiting feedback before playing.
Dhoomstriker
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That was supposed to be the Hindu Missionary heading eastward... I was just saying try not to put the Hindu Missionary on the square that blocks Forest growth.
She emptied that Galley when dropped off a Settler and a Horse Archer at Warwick. There have been no new units that she has picked up as her Galley sailed northward. It's not possible for units to exist in her Galley.
You are correct. Sorry, I think that we numbered him "0," although we called him Worker 10, so I got confused when looking at him.
Well, we've done it once already. In for a penny, in for a pound, to use an English expression.
EDIT: But, we could probably pick 1 or 3 Cities not to Liberate and if we pick 3, we might need a 4th war with Elizabeth.
Not in X-ops, which is why we want Barracks elsewhere, as every useful Building in X-ops is a far better investment of our Hammers than putting a similar Building in another City.
For example, a Confucian Temple's Flasks get multiplied by an Academy and Oxford, while they won't in our other Cities, and a Hindu Temple's Hammer gets multiplied by Bureaucracy's Hammer bonus, which won't happen in another City.
I'm okay with doing it in Gems. We lose a Hammer in our Catapult to make it happen, but that's fine.
You are correct.
Shaka. Most of the units at Queen's Palace will hopefully get teleported to our home continent when we next Cease Fire with Elizabeth.
If our units don't teleport, we'll just shuttle them by Galleons after we have freed up our Galleons after they are done with the last of the recapturing of Liberated Cities.
Check the F8 MEMBERS -> Apostolic Palace Resident tab... probably something like 5 turns from now, going by memory. The owner of the AP and the player with the most Hindu votes who is running the AP State Religion will be candidates.
Those players should be Us vs Shaka, with us easily winning, as we'll get Mansa's votes.
Dhoomstriker
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Since we'll have 7 Cities that we can Liberate, but the 7th one will only provide us with +1 Diplo, while the first 6 will provide us with +9 Diplo (although getting that +9 cost us -3 for a War Declaration, so it's a net +6 Diplo), you're right that it's probably overkill to Liberate the 7th City.
If London looks to be the most desirable City in terms of infrastructure, we don't have to Liberate that City.
We could also choose 3 Cities not to Liberate, for a net -3 + 6 = + 3 Diplo, instead of a net + 6 Diplo, but I'm not sure how close that would put us to having a Voting Buddy.
We will NOT get the +2 Diplo for Open Borders with Elizabeth (it will take 25 turns for +1 and we might not even want that +1... as a Worst Enemy of [I forget whom], and her only giving us +1 Trade Route, we might just keep Open Borders with her for 10 turns to gift her the QA Galleon and then Close Borders with her).
So, I'm not sure how tight the Diplo would be if we only earned a net +3 instead of a net +6 with her.
That's a decision for the turnset after the current turnset.
EDIT: There's also the option of a 4th war with Elizabeth, where we Liberate less Cities each time but just repeatedly Liberate the junkier Cities.
Dhoomstriker
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Our up-and-coming goals:
1. Getting Elizabeth as a voting buddy
2. Liberating enough Cities to Mao to be able to get Gunpowder in trade from him (then we can build 12 Musketmen whom we can use in battle against Shaka and later display as part of a parade for Catherine)
3. Building 4 Airships for Shaka which can be used in the Catherine parade
4. Warring effectively with Shaka
5. Capturing the Barb City by Louis (it could become our Hindu gift City if we want to keep Stone City until the end of the game, but since the Tanks must get built before we can win, we could also plan to gift Stone City so as to get +1 Diplo with Louis for Liberating the Barb City to him)
6. Settling a City for Toku and a City for Catherine
7. Spreading Hinduism to Marble City, a City for Louis, the City for Toku, and the City for Catherine
8. Building infrastructure that can still pay off (Granaries, Lighthouses, Libraries)
9. Building Galleons for Catherine
10. Planning to complete an Isabella task (3 Great People or Rock N Roll)
11. Building Tanks for Catherine and Galleon-chaining them across of the map... 2 Galleon chains can exist and they can be re-used on the following turn simply by having an extra boat at the start of the chain
12. Winning via an AP Victory by having less than 75% of the vote, ensuring that each AI has at a minimum a Size 1 a Hindu City, and having both Mansa and Elizabeth not running Hinduism as their State Religions
Details in there include:
i. Keeping Shaka alive with an inland Hindu City so that we will always have an AP Resolution to propose ("Stop the war against Shaka," which we will never stop)
ii. Getting Confucianism into Cities that we'll Liberate to Elizabeth at the end as a safety measure--she should be in Free Religion, but if she dips out of it, she should be encouraged to remain Confucian instead of switching to Hinduism
iii. After we have The Kremlin, whipping infrastructure or Galleons becomes quite efficient and is mostly limited by Happiness
iv. Building Railroads between our core Cities and the start of the Galleon chain so that our Tanks can travel to Catherine quickly and efficiently
v. Starting our Galleon chain sailing soon enough prior to unlocking Tanks
vi. Having extra Galleons in our chain so that mouse misclicks don't ruin our day
vii. Either getting +1 Great General from fighting Shaka or teching Fascism for the free Great General
viii. Renaming the QE Galleon to have her name in it again after joining a Great General to our boat (I'm not sure if joining a Great General will change a unit's custom name or not, but we should double check)
1. Getting Elizabeth as a voting buddy
2. Liberating enough Cities to Mao to be able to get Gunpowder in trade from him (then we can build 12 Musketmen whom we can use in battle against Shaka and later display as part of a parade for Catherine)
3. Building 4 Airships for Shaka which can be used in the Catherine parade
4. Warring effectively with Shaka
5. Capturing the Barb City by Louis (it could become our Hindu gift City if we want to keep Stone City until the end of the game, but since the Tanks must get built before we can win, we could also plan to gift Stone City so as to get +1 Diplo with Louis for Liberating the Barb City to him)
6. Settling a City for Toku and a City for Catherine
7. Spreading Hinduism to Marble City, a City for Louis, the City for Toku, and the City for Catherine
8. Building infrastructure that can still pay off (Granaries, Lighthouses, Libraries)
9. Building Galleons for Catherine
10. Planning to complete an Isabella task (3 Great People or Rock N Roll)
11. Building Tanks for Catherine and Galleon-chaining them across of the map... 2 Galleon chains can exist and they can be re-used on the following turn simply by having an extra boat at the start of the chain
12. Winning via an AP Victory by having less than 75% of the vote, ensuring that each AI has at a minimum a Size 1 a Hindu City, and having both Mansa and Elizabeth not running Hinduism as their State Religions
Details in there include:
i. Keeping Shaka alive with an inland Hindu City so that we will always have an AP Resolution to propose ("Stop the war against Shaka," which we will never stop)
ii. Getting Confucianism into Cities that we'll Liberate to Elizabeth at the end as a safety measure--she should be in Free Religion, but if she dips out of it, she should be encouraged to remain Confucian instead of switching to Hinduism
iii. After we have The Kremlin, whipping infrastructure or Galleons becomes quite efficient and is mostly limited by Happiness
iv. Building Railroads between our core Cities and the start of the Galleon chain so that our Tanks can travel to Catherine quickly and efficiently
v. Starting our Galleon chain sailing soon enough prior to unlocking Tanks
vi. Having extra Galleons in our chain so that mouse misclicks don't ruin our day
vii. Either getting +1 Great General from fighting Shaka or teching Fascism for the free Great General
viii. Renaming the QE Galleon to have her name in it again after joining a Great General to our boat (I'm not sure if joining a Great General will change a unit's custom name or not, but we should double check)
Appreciate the detailed feedback.
I played T152 and went to 153, made the Engineering trade with Louis, changed the builds in Piscatorium and Gems, paused, and saved the game.
Shaka cancelled the trade for corn, but will still trade for it. Don't understand this. Request advice on how to deal with the man.
Louis gets a GS.
Mansa now worst enemy of E.
Save posted at Central and below.
I have RL responsibilities for the next couple of hours, but will certainly finish T153 tonight and more if requested.
Save: http://gotm.civfanatics.net/download.php?file=Xteam_SG021_AD0860_01.CivBeyondSwordSave
I played T152 and went to 153, made the Engineering trade with Louis, changed the builds in Piscatorium and Gems, paused, and saved the game.
Shaka cancelled the trade for corn, but will still trade for it. Don't understand this. Request advice on how to deal with the man.
Louis gets a GS.
Mansa now worst enemy of E.
Save posted at Central and below.
I have RL responsibilities for the next couple of hours, but will certainly finish T153 tonight and more if requested.
Save: http://gotm.civfanatics.net/download.php?file=Xteam_SG021_AD0860_01.CivBeyondSwordSave
Dhoomstriker
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The answer is that we had 2 Corn Resources, then we lost 1 when we Liberated a City to Elizabeth, yet we were handing out 2 Corn Resources. I suppose that the game picked the oldest trade or used some other logic, such as Shaka's turn coming first, to decide which Corn to cancel.
Dhoomstriker
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In terms of infrastructure, I only see:
Canterbury has Lighthouse
Hastings has Granary
London has Lighthouse
York has Forge + Courthouse
Nottingham has Lighthouse
Coventry has Granary + Lighthouse
Warwick won't have any infrastructure
I count:
+1 Religion (will disappear)
+4 Trading
+1 Past Events
+1 Gave her Help (may disappear)
+1 Tech Discoveries
+12 Liberations
-3 War (will disappear)
-3 Traded with Worst Enemies--will likely go down to -4
-6 Declared War on her
-2 Declared war on her friend
-2 Brought in a war ally against us
-2 Razed a Holy City
-1 Refused to help us during wartime
That's a total of +1, but +1 will disappear, -3 will disappear, and we'll get another -1, so a total of +1 - (+1) - (-3) + (-1) = 1 - 1 + 3 - 1 = +2
Liberating 7 Cities will give us 7 * 1.5 = +10.5 aka +10, for a net total of +12, but +1 might disappear for a total of +11.
We can probably get her up to +2 Supplied her with Resources pretty easily, and we can probably get her up to +2 with a Shared Civic of Free Religion.
So, if we only got +7 instead of +11, we could probably bring her up to +11, but we'd be locked into Free Religion to make it happen. Or, we'd just have yet another war for another net +3.
So, here are the options:
Option A] Keep York (Forge and Courthouse)
Lose 1 population point in each of:
London, Nottingham, Hastings, Coventry
Risk losing up to 6 Buildings
OR
Option B] Keep York (Forge and Courthouse), Coventry (Granary and Lighthouse), and London (3-seafood Lighthouse)
Lose 2 population points in each of:
Nottingham, Hastings
Risk losing up to 3 Buildings 2 times each (although if a Building gets lost the first time, it can't get lost the second time
)
Option B] means an extra war, but other than having to spend more turns on the process, it looks like a marginally better option. So, we can plan to go with Option B].
Thus, we could plan for:
T154, 880 AD
1. Capture Warwick
T154 or T155, as soon as we have enough units on boats in position:
2. Confirm that Mansa is not Pleased toward Elizabeth... if he is Pleased toward Elizabeth, then we don't execute the rest of the plan yet
3. Cease Fire with Elizabeth
4. Liberate these Cities to Elizabeth:
Warwick
Canterbury
Hastings
Nottingham
5. Declare war on Elizabeth
6. Recapture those 4 Cities
7. As soon as Elizabeth is willing to talk with us again, repeat the process one more time from step 2.
So, which Galleon gets used on which City?
William Galleon gets used on Warwick
Galleon 3 gets used on Coventry (we can update the plan to change where we'll move it)
Galleon 7 gets used on Hastings
Galleon 8 gets used on Nottingham
We can probably also make a bunch of tech sales. Catherine won't give us the full amount for Metal Casting, so we can sell her 2 techs. I'll add tech sales suggestions to the plan after looking at updating the positioning of Galleon 3.
Also, I'll add a couple of micro comments for the Cities this turn and see if I can provide suggestions for next turn, too.
Canterbury has Lighthouse
Hastings has Granary
London has Lighthouse
York has Forge + Courthouse
Nottingham has Lighthouse
Coventry has Granary + Lighthouse
Warwick won't have any infrastructure
I count:
+1 Religion (will disappear)
+4 Trading
+1 Past Events
+1 Gave her Help (may disappear)
+1 Tech Discoveries
+12 Liberations
-3 War (will disappear)
-3 Traded with Worst Enemies--will likely go down to -4
-6 Declared War on her
-2 Declared war on her friend
-2 Brought in a war ally against us
-2 Razed a Holy City
-1 Refused to help us during wartime
That's a total of +1, but +1 will disappear, -3 will disappear, and we'll get another -1, so a total of +1 - (+1) - (-3) + (-1) = 1 - 1 + 3 - 1 = +2
Liberating 7 Cities will give us 7 * 1.5 = +10.5 aka +10, for a net total of +12, but +1 might disappear for a total of +11.
We can probably get her up to +2 Supplied her with Resources pretty easily, and we can probably get her up to +2 with a Shared Civic of Free Religion.
So, if we only got +7 instead of +11, we could probably bring her up to +11, but we'd be locked into Free Religion to make it happen. Or, we'd just have yet another war for another net +3.
So, here are the options:
Option A] Keep York (Forge and Courthouse)
Lose 1 population point in each of:
London, Nottingham, Hastings, Coventry
Risk losing up to 6 Buildings
OR
Option B] Keep York (Forge and Courthouse), Coventry (Granary and Lighthouse), and London (3-seafood Lighthouse)
Lose 2 population points in each of:
Nottingham, Hastings
Risk losing up to 3 Buildings 2 times each (although if a Building gets lost the first time, it can't get lost the second time
)Option B] means an extra war, but other than having to spend more turns on the process, it looks like a marginally better option. So, we can plan to go with Option B].
Thus, we could plan for:
T154, 880 AD
1. Capture Warwick
T154 or T155, as soon as we have enough units on boats in position:
2. Confirm that Mansa is not Pleased toward Elizabeth... if he is Pleased toward Elizabeth, then we don't execute the rest of the plan yet
3. Cease Fire with Elizabeth
4. Liberate these Cities to Elizabeth:
Warwick
Canterbury
Hastings
Nottingham
5. Declare war on Elizabeth
6. Recapture those 4 Cities
7. As soon as Elizabeth is willing to talk with us again, repeat the process one more time from step 2.
So, which Galleon gets used on which City?
William Galleon gets used on Warwick
Galleon 3 gets used on Coventry (we can update the plan to change where we'll move it)
Galleon 7 gets used on Hastings
Galleon 8 gets used on Nottingham
We can probably also make a bunch of tech sales. Catherine won't give us the full amount for Metal Casting, so we can sell her 2 techs. I'll add tech sales suggestions to the plan after looking at updating the positioning of Galleon 3.
Also, I'll add a couple of micro comments for the Cities this turn and see if I can provide suggestions for next turn, too.
Dhoomstriker
Girlie Builder
- Joined
- Aug 12, 2006
- Messages
- 13,465
Suggested PPP
New plan: 2 more wars with Elizabeth but with less Cities being Liberated each time.
T153, 860 AD
X-ops: Mine -> Windmill to grow in 2 turns
Gems: NE P to 1E P as we're about to complete the Farm on the 1E P
New Amsterdam: Build Library
London: Build Culture -> Granary
York: Build Culture -> Granary
Coventry: Build Culture -> Library
Trade:
9 GPT from Louis <-> Corn
Make these trades:
30 Gold from Shaka <-> Drama
30 Gold from Toku <-> Code of Laws
70 Gold from Catherine <-> Code of Laws + Metal Casting
60 Gold from Isabella <-> Music
50 Gold from Mao + World Map <-> Banking
Moves yet to be made:
Worker 10 (NW + NW of Hippos): Move to the Tun H For that is 3N of Hippos
Worker 4 (1N of Hippos): Move to the Tun H For that is SW + S + S of Hippos
Worker 3 (1N of Hippos): Move to the Tun H For that is NW + N + N of Hippos and Chop it
Worker 7 and Worker 12 (1N of Piscatorium): Move 1NE onto Galleon 2
Galleon 2 heads toward New Amsterdam
Chariot 1 (in Hastings): Move 1W + 1NW onto Galleon 7
Galleon 7 promotes to Flanking II
Galleon 7, with Chariot 1 aboard, moves 2N to NW + NW + N of Hastings and Skip turn
Worker 5 (at Mansa's City of Tekedda) moves 2SW onto Galleon 1
Galleon 1 unloads only Worker 6 into Sleepy Sheep (keep Worker 5 on board to be unloaded in New Amsterdam next turn)
Worker 6 moves 1SW and Farms the Plains square that is 1SW of Sleepy Sheep
Galleon 8 (2W of London): Move to NW + N of Nottingham, then WE 3 from Nottingham can pick him up, then Galleon 8 can move to 3W of Nottingham
Willam Galleon (NW + N of Warwick) moves south to drop off Spearman 1 on the GH Mine that is 1SW of Warwick, then moves to NW + N of Queen's Palace, then Spearman 6 and Spearman 1 get on board William
The rest of the stack that is 1NW of Queen's Palace does not capture Queen's Palace and moves 1E Des (1N of Queen's Palace)
Mace 1 (in York) gets on the William Galleon
Galleon 6 unloads 2 Cats and 1 Knight on the GH Mine Road that is 1SW of Warwick
Galleon 3 (in Coventry) moves to 1SE of Canterbury
Galleon 5 can head south-eastward to form a future partial Galleon chain between New Amsterdam and Mao's area
Galleon 4 can move into Sparta (Stone City) and skip its turn so that our War Elephant can quickly heal for this turn
Confucian Missionary in Marble City can move 2NW, then we select him and gift him to Mao (the pink present button)
One of the Workers that are 1N of Marble can move to the G For that is 1W of Marble
Workers near Utretch, now that we have Engineering:
Workers 1 (NE + N + N of Utrecht): Move to the G For Road that is 3E of Utretch and Chop it
Workers 8 (NE + NE + N of Utrecht), 11 (NE + NE of Utrecht), and no number Worker (NE + E + E of Utrecht)--maybe name him Worker 15: can all move to the G Riv Farm that is 2S of Utrecht and build a Watermill (If we can't get Engineering in trade for some reason, don't move them and we'll figure out something else for them to do)
Worker 9 (SE + E + E of Utrecht): Chop the GH For
We don't want to Chop any of the other Forests in the Utrecht area
QE Galleon: Stay in Coventry to heal
T154, 880 AD
Make this trade:
Whatever Gold + World Map Mao will give to us <-> Economics
Bombard with Cat 5 at Warwick
Attack Warwick with Cat 8
Promote Knight 2 to Combat I and attack Warwick
Capture Warwick with Spearman 1 if we haven't captured it yet
Our stack of units near Queen's Palace should move 1SE Des (to 1E of Queen's Palace) but should not capture Queen's Palace
Assuming that we successfully captured Warwick, confirm that Mansa is not Pleased toward Elizabeth.
If we captured Warwick and if Mansa is not Pleased toward Elizabeth, then we can safely execute the following steps; otherwise, do not execute these steps:
1. Cease Fire with Elizabeth
2. Liberate these 4 Cities to Elizabeth:
Warwick
Canterbury
Hastings
Nottingham
3. Declare war on Elizabeth
4. Use a unit on the William Galleon to capture Warwick
Build Wealth in Warwick
Have the William Galleon enter Warwick, load the attacking unit back onto the William Galleon, then if we have movement points remaining, head to the Clam that is 3N of The Hague
Use Longbowman 1 on Galleon 3 to capture Canterbury
Build Wealth in Canterbury
Have Galleon 3 enter Canterbury to load Longbowman 1 back onto Galleon 3, then if we have movement points remaining, head eastward out of Canterbury as far as we have movement points to sail
Use Chariot 1 on Galleon 7 to capture Hastings
Build Wealth in Hastings
Have Galleon 7 enter Hastings, load Chariot 1 back onto Galleon 7, then move NW + NW of Hastings (1N of the Fish)
Use a War Elephant on Galleon 8 to capture Nottingham
Build Wealth in Nottingham
Have Galleon 8 enter Nottingham, load the War Elephant back onto Galleon 8, then move to SW + SW of Nottingham
Once Galleon 2 unloads the 2 Workers inside of New Amsterdam, Galleon 2 can move to 2NW of New Amsterdam
Galleon 1 will end its turn in New Amsterdam, and we can unload Worker 5 there
Workers at New Amsterdam can probably build a P Riv Farm 1S of New Amsterdam
Workers 10 and 4 around Hippos can complete their Chops
Do we want to Chop the Deer and Fur? I'm thinking that we won't need to, so Worker 3 can start to build a G Workshop on the G Farm that is 2N of Hippos
Once the Workers near Utrecht finish the Watermill that is 2S of Utrecht, they can build a Watermill SE + S of Utrecht
New plan: 2 more wars with Elizabeth but with less Cities being Liberated each time.
T153, 860 AD
X-ops: Mine -> Windmill to grow in 2 turns
Gems: NE P to 1E P as we're about to complete the Farm on the 1E P
New Amsterdam: Build Library
London: Build Culture -> Granary
York: Build Culture -> Granary
Coventry: Build Culture -> Library
Trade:
9 GPT from Louis <-> Corn
Make these trades:
30 Gold from Shaka <-> Drama
30 Gold from Toku <-> Code of Laws
70 Gold from Catherine <-> Code of Laws + Metal Casting
60 Gold from Isabella <-> Music
50 Gold from Mao + World Map <-> Banking
Spoiler :
Moves yet to be made:
Worker 10 (NW + NW of Hippos): Move to the Tun H For that is 3N of Hippos
Worker 4 (1N of Hippos): Move to the Tun H For that is SW + S + S of Hippos
Worker 3 (1N of Hippos): Move to the Tun H For that is NW + N + N of Hippos and Chop it
Worker 7 and Worker 12 (1N of Piscatorium): Move 1NE onto Galleon 2
Galleon 2 heads toward New Amsterdam
Chariot 1 (in Hastings): Move 1W + 1NW onto Galleon 7
Galleon 7 promotes to Flanking II
Galleon 7, with Chariot 1 aboard, moves 2N to NW + NW + N of Hastings and Skip turn
Worker 5 (at Mansa's City of Tekedda) moves 2SW onto Galleon 1
Galleon 1 unloads only Worker 6 into Sleepy Sheep (keep Worker 5 on board to be unloaded in New Amsterdam next turn)
Worker 6 moves 1SW and Farms the Plains square that is 1SW of Sleepy Sheep
Galleon 8 (2W of London): Move to NW + N of Nottingham, then WE 3 from Nottingham can pick him up, then Galleon 8 can move to 3W of Nottingham
Willam Galleon (NW + N of Warwick) moves south to drop off Spearman 1 on the GH Mine that is 1SW of Warwick, then moves to NW + N of Queen's Palace, then Spearman 6 and Spearman 1 get on board William
The rest of the stack that is 1NW of Queen's Palace does not capture Queen's Palace and moves 1E Des (1N of Queen's Palace)
Mace 1 (in York) gets on the William Galleon
Galleon 6 unloads 2 Cats and 1 Knight on the GH Mine Road that is 1SW of Warwick
Galleon 3 (in Coventry) moves to 1SE of Canterbury
Galleon 5 can head south-eastward to form a future partial Galleon chain between New Amsterdam and Mao's area
Galleon 4 can move into Sparta (Stone City) and skip its turn so that our War Elephant can quickly heal for this turn
Confucian Missionary in Marble City can move 2NW, then we select him and gift him to Mao (the pink present button)
One of the Workers that are 1N of Marble can move to the G For that is 1W of Marble
Workers near Utretch, now that we have Engineering:
Workers 1 (NE + N + N of Utrecht): Move to the G For Road that is 3E of Utretch and Chop it
Workers 8 (NE + NE + N of Utrecht), 11 (NE + NE of Utrecht), and no number Worker (NE + E + E of Utrecht)--maybe name him Worker 15: can all move to the G Riv Farm that is 2S of Utrecht and build a Watermill (If we can't get Engineering in trade for some reason, don't move them and we'll figure out something else for them to do)
Worker 9 (SE + E + E of Utrecht): Chop the GH For
We don't want to Chop any of the other Forests in the Utrecht area
QE Galleon: Stay in Coventry to heal
T154, 880 AD
Make this trade:
Whatever Gold + World Map Mao will give to us <-> Economics
Bombard with Cat 5 at Warwick
Attack Warwick with Cat 8
Promote Knight 2 to Combat I and attack Warwick
Capture Warwick with Spearman 1 if we haven't captured it yet
Our stack of units near Queen's Palace should move 1SE Des (to 1E of Queen's Palace) but should not capture Queen's Palace
Assuming that we successfully captured Warwick, confirm that Mansa is not Pleased toward Elizabeth.
If we captured Warwick and if Mansa is not Pleased toward Elizabeth, then we can safely execute the following steps; otherwise, do not execute these steps:
1. Cease Fire with Elizabeth
2. Liberate these 4 Cities to Elizabeth:
Warwick
Canterbury
Hastings
Nottingham
3. Declare war on Elizabeth
4. Use a unit on the William Galleon to capture Warwick
Build Wealth in Warwick
Have the William Galleon enter Warwick, load the attacking unit back onto the William Galleon, then if we have movement points remaining, head to the Clam that is 3N of The Hague
Use Longbowman 1 on Galleon 3 to capture Canterbury
Build Wealth in Canterbury
Have Galleon 3 enter Canterbury to load Longbowman 1 back onto Galleon 3, then if we have movement points remaining, head eastward out of Canterbury as far as we have movement points to sail
Use Chariot 1 on Galleon 7 to capture Hastings
Build Wealth in Hastings
Have Galleon 7 enter Hastings, load Chariot 1 back onto Galleon 7, then move NW + NW of Hastings (1N of the Fish)
Use a War Elephant on Galleon 8 to capture Nottingham
Build Wealth in Nottingham
Have Galleon 8 enter Nottingham, load the War Elephant back onto Galleon 8, then move to SW + SW of Nottingham
Once Galleon 2 unloads the 2 Workers inside of New Amsterdam, Galleon 2 can move to 2NW of New Amsterdam
Galleon 1 will end its turn in New Amsterdam, and we can unload Worker 5 there
Spoiler :
Workers at New Amsterdam can probably build a P Riv Farm 1S of New Amsterdam
Workers 10 and 4 around Hippos can complete their Chops
Do we want to Chop the Deer and Fur? I'm thinking that we won't need to, so Worker 3 can start to build a G Workshop on the G Farm that is 2N of Hippos
Once the Workers near Utrecht finish the Watermill that is 2S of Utrecht, they can build a Watermill SE + S of Utrecht
Spoiler :
Dhoomstriker
Girlie Builder
- Joined
- Aug 12, 2006
- Messages
- 13,465
Another thought is that we'll soon be going to war with Shaka, so if Shaka Requests/Demands anything out of us, we should refuse him, so that we don't get locked into 10 more turns of enforced Peace. He's already involved in 2 wars, and he is unable to attack us for 3 turns, so we should not fear denying him.
I've updated the Diplo Policies to reflect this update.
I've updated the Diplo Policies to reflect this update.
Understand the plan. Playing now.
Dhoomstriker
Girlie Builder
- Joined
- Aug 12, 2006
- Messages
- 13,465
We can sell our Corn to Louis for 9 GPT. That's better than selling it to Shaka for 5 GPT.
Good luck!
Good luck!
Good luck CP! 
Played into T154 without incident, E's cities liberated successfully re-taken, paused, and saved for further discussion.
Notes:
IBT 83/84:
Isa cancels our Peace Treaty and is now worst enemy of Louis
MM now has 280 gold
A spy outed near New Am
Confu spreads to Khabarovsk
Louis adopts Theo and Merc
E now worst enemy of both Isa and Mao
MM now worst enemy of both E and Toku
For discussion:
What about spy points on Shaka and moving spies into his territory with possible intent to pillage copper and horses?
Should QE attack trireme north of Hastings this turn or is it more important to move her into galleon chaining position?
Confu fails to spread in Hague, so . . .?
What about moving Hindu missionary #5 (3NW of S&T) into caravel and taking him to . . . ?
How soon do we want to move on Shaka?
Do we know exactly where our two settlers are going to settle? Does either need workers or protection or a missionary?
Can't find info on next AP decision.
Many unmoved workers and several other units, including: workers 15&16 near Marble; Utrecht workers; workers in NewAm; workers near Sparta; spies; and Confu missionary in Marble
Getting late here. Should be able to continue tomorrow with feedback.
Save from Central: http://gotm.civfanatics.net/download.php?file=Xteam_SG021_AD0880_01.CivBeyondSwordSave
Notes:
IBT 83/84:
Isa cancels our Peace Treaty and is now worst enemy of Louis
MM now has 280 gold
A spy outed near New Am
Confu spreads to Khabarovsk
Louis adopts Theo and Merc
E now worst enemy of both Isa and Mao
MM now worst enemy of both E and Toku
For discussion:
What about spy points on Shaka and moving spies into his territory with possible intent to pillage copper and horses?
Should QE attack trireme north of Hastings this turn or is it more important to move her into galleon chaining position?
Confu fails to spread in Hague, so . . .?
What about moving Hindu missionary #5 (3NW of S&T) into caravel and taking him to . . . ?
How soon do we want to move on Shaka?
Do we know exactly where our two settlers are going to settle? Does either need workers or protection or a missionary?
Can't find info on next AP decision.
Many unmoved workers and several other units, including: workers 15&16 near Marble; Utrecht workers; workers in NewAm; workers near Sparta; spies; and Confu missionary in Marble
Getting late here. Should be able to continue tomorrow with feedback.
Save from Central: http://gotm.civfanatics.net/download.php?file=Xteam_SG021_AD0880_01.CivBeyondSwordSave
I think if we are going for an other war with Elizabeth we should liberate all cities. If we just liberate some, it will just not gain us very much. Liberating 7 cities is a net +7/8 relation while 4 is +3 net relations.
Shall we tech Rifling next so we have something that will just run over Shaka extremely easy?
Shall we tech Rifling next so we have something that will just run over Shaka extremely easy?
