6 player FFA: set time, days flexible

[the oob]

I've played with a double turn rule at my LANs and it has worked, but I think this should be left up to a vote. So I vote in favour of a double turn rule. I've made a post here which discusses how this would work.

Another thing we might like to try is having a few AI players so that if someone gets taken out or severely crippled early on (which is likely if we're playing a pangaea game) they can take over from an AI, otherwise our six player game could rather quickly become a 3-4 player game. I vote for three AIs for this reason. If we end up doing this, we'd need to discuss how it would work (eg. can you switch several times?)

I have a pretty high end machine (quad core) and am happy to host.

So here are my votes for settings:
* No double turn rule: yes
* Map type: pangaea
* Regular number of CS
* AI players: yes, 3 (see above)

 

[Zoeff]

Monday it is then.

What exactly are double moves?

 

[Kyp Durron]

I think double moves are too much a part of the game. I can have a less than superior military and survive with my "skills" on the battlefield.

 

[the oob]

Monday it is then.

What exactly are double moves?

Basically, moving at the end of the turn (after your opponent) and then moving before them at the start. So you get to move twice before they have time to react.

 

[Kyp Durron]

Just be more aware.

 

[the oob]

Just be more aware.

Yeah but it's not really that simple, since it depends on latency and all that jazz. There also seems to be some difficulty where you need to promote a unit first before you can move it, and sometimes the game will ignore a move order and you have to do it a few times.

If Civ V had great net code it wouldn't be as necessary, but unfortunately it doesn't. I'm not especially fussy about this but I've tried playing both ways and find a set turn order works best. I suspect a lot of you complaining about a double turn rule haven't actually tried it.

 

[the oob]

Anyway, I'll be hosting the game, so at least I'll have the latency advantage

 

[Kyp Durron]

True...

But I can have 4 units moved within the first second of a turn at times....

 

[the oob]

Like I said, I'm happy to play either way, but would prefer a turn order. A simple vote (which I expect to lose) should settle the matter.

 

[Kyp Durron]

Sure, ill remain open to the idea, or perhaps a twist towards, it being allowed on defensive only?

 

[the oob]

Not sure what you mean, please elaborate

 

[Onan]

If we're ready to vote, we can vote. If we need more discussion about what we actually mean by having a rule about it, let's keep talking.

Other rules we've imposed in the past include things like: No War before turn X (80-100 usually), unless someone settles closer to your capital than their own, and such things. And in fact I think this was the best game we've had so far--Zombie Spaceships of Doooom!!

I guess I favor no rule for double moves, not because I particularly like them or enjoy abusing them, but because trying to prevent them or have a rule about them will almost certainly lead to some disputes and reloads, slowing down the game. For example, what happens if (with a turn order) Player A has more units than they can actually move in a turn? Or more than they can move in the first half of the turn, and they're at war with Player B, who's waiting to move? And if it's a war involving 3 or more players?

Also, if a player is prepared with a proper sentry net and army, or even watching the spot their enemy is likely to come from, with as yet unmoved units, they can punish the player using the tactic. Double moves do have drawbacks, too. For that second turn, your units end up sitting ducks, and the guy that got double-moved on first can then pick them off at his leisure.

If anything I might favor a gentleman's agreement to try to move everything as soon in a turn as possible...but this would naturally break down in war anyway, as people try to press for advantage or exploit opportunities created by opponents' moves. Who's going to move or blink first / initiative and counter attacks are a great part of the game. I don't want to do anything to move away from the 'real time' aspect of simultaneous play...I enjoy that factor.

Yes, the no-move before a promotion can suck...but then if you're first on the promotion button before the other guy attacks your wounded unit and you heal to full, it can suck equally for the other guy.

Also I have seen no hard evidence that ping / latency consistently determines who wins such races.

 

[the oob]

Everyone who's playing tonight should PM Onan or myself their Steam name.

 

[Onan]

I've got them all Oob, you needn't worry.

I'll take the initial host tonight and pass it off to you when/if we have trouble (which could be tonight, with six of us). Just for insurance, each player should save the game at the end of every session.

If there's no further discussion here in the thread regarding double moves or any other external rules (no early war, etc.) we want to have, we'll proceed with none tonight.

Finally, those of you in the northern hemisphere--please make sure you have the time correct. I have no idea when you might be 'falling back' / coming off your daylight savings time.

 

[the oob]

It'll probably be easiest to vote on settings in Steam chat before the game starts.

 

[Onan]

Votes only for imposed rules. Settings to be agreed upon. I'd rather we get this set up ahead of time rather than spend half an hour or more trying to decide, when we could be playing.

So far we have as suggestions: pangaea, regular # CS, and 3 AI.

I'm in favor of a small pangaea map, no AI (with AI we'd have to bump up to a standard map), to avoid game issues later in the game. For the same reason, as well as a bit of space on the map, a lesser number of CS is preferred.

I'll probably be out most of the day and/or busy with the kids, so I won't be able to check in here till 2-5 hours before game time. I'll try to take any suggestions into consideration, but my main concern is the playability and stability of the game.

 

[Kyp Durron]

Up for anything.

 

[Zoeff]

I'm unfortunately still recovering from a flu and I'm not sure if I'll be willing to go out of bed in time for the match. I had hoped the flu would've passed by now...

 

[Onan]

Okay, hope you feel better. Thanks for the advance notice.

I will log on a bit before the appointed time just in case you have changed your mind and are up for it after all. Maybe the rest of us can play a one-off game or something...or i'd be up for a cton or something, Kyp (and anyone else interested in that type of game or a shorter ffa), I haven't played one of those in ages.

If you don't make it and I don't see anything else posted here by you, Zoeff, I'll assume you'd like us to postpone the start so you can participate.

 

[Onan]

Had a chat with Brenador and he may join us in future, though Mondays probably won't work for him. Note: I'm not suggesting he'll take Zoeff's place tonight, rather Rob's spot which he seems more than happy to give up.