A Better AI.

[Powerslave]

Just played another game (Dec 12 build). "Builder" AIs are excessively easy to conquer. I repeat my call for some sort of panic mode where they build lots of units if they lose a city or believe they are about to.

I like this idea, too. I know there's a minor "panic mode" now that prevents them from building wonders, but perhaps they should start drafting/rushing defenders obsessively, as well.

I find warmongering to be still too easy, as well. I'd like to see the AI move decisively to destroy my SoD, then push into my land as quickly as possible, while I'm still recovering from losing all those units.

 

[Blake]

Well I've upgraded the AI GP usage including Great General, they should be much smarter about settling them.

Basic algorithm for GG is now:
1) If in danger, join a unit.
2) Build Military Academy (up to one).
3) Join as Instructor (up to one).
4) If this is an offensive war, 50% chance of joining a City Attack unit.
5) Join as Instructor (up to two).
6) Build Military Academy (up to two).
7) Join as Instructor (up to four).
8) 33% chance of Build Military Academy (unlimited)
9) Join as Instructor (unlimited)
10) Run away, hide, whatever. Probably shouldn't get here ever.

The AI will still be daft with it's GG units but it'll be less likely to create daft GG units in the first place and in general.

 

[HardCoder]

Well I've upgraded the AI GP usage including Great General, they should be much smarter about settling them.

Yippee! (I think.)

Okay, one note: I gather that the AI doesn't build warriors once it has archers. I think it ought to have the sense to build some warriors if it sees quechas or in particular if it is at war with the Incans.

It might also go ahead and build units and then walls unconditionally in its capital if it is involved in an early war.

 

[acidsatyr]

i just dont see difference with blakes ai. Sorry, i just dont....

 

[Arlborn]

i just dont see difference with blakes ai. Sorry, i just dont....

Do you use the last version? And Play at least in Warlords difficulty? If yes, you should and probably installed wrong?

 

[acidsatyr]

lol

yes, yes, and no, its actually installed properly. Blake mentioned biggest difference is on low difficulties so maybe thats why. Not a major difference. Im not trying to underestimate his work or anything, just being honest

 

[Arlborn]

lol

yes, yes, and no, its actually installed properly. Blake mentioned biggest difference is on low difficulties so maybe thats why. Not a major difference. Im not trying to underestimate his work or anything, just being honest

The biggest differece probably is actually in prince-monarch..

Well, keep playing, and see if you dont see a CIV goig to cultural victory in the end, or a real big stacj going to war..

And gl ;p

 

[skankerm]

Just started a new game on the Dec 12 Build. I started right next to korea, the funny thing is when i was playing a multi game with the dec 12 build my friend started right next to korea as well, though im sure thats a coincidence. I posted a screen shot for you to see, and the save though i dont know if you needed it or now just saves me from reposting. otherwise the patches are great though in my games i havn't seen much cpu vs cpu fighting unless its shaka or ceaser but maybe im just "unlucky".
keep up the good work

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[Iustus]

Just started a new game on the Dec 12 Build. I started right next to korea, the funny thing is when i was playing a multi game with the dec 12 build my friend started right next to korea as well, though im sure thats a coincidence. I posted a screen shot for you to see, and the save though i dont know if you needed it or now just saves me from reposting. otherwise the patches are great though in my games i havn't seen much cpu vs cpu fighting unless its shaka or ceaser but maybe im just "unlucky".
keep up the good work

There is a definite bug in the start point code which is fixed internally already and will be in the next build. Part of the code intended to force civs further apart had the opposite effect.

-Iustus

 

[Iustus]

So please Iustus help me,

Altering the warmongerrespect values will screw up AI decision making or not?

Thank You!!!

This will be fine to do for BetterAI. For war, the primary value that we use is maxwarrand, also looking at limitedwarrand, dogpilewarrand to a certain extent. Cultural victory looks at traits, favorite civics, etc.

Have fun!

-Iustus

 

[Iustus]

Hmm, I saw that there was a new build (dated 12-12). I triied using it but it generates a CTD immediately upon finishing world creation etc. My guess is something in the new starts might be buggered up?

Anyone else see this or is something that I'm doing?

Thanx!

Any chance you had the wrong dll installed? Vanilla while playing warlords, or warlords while playing vanilla? Were you using a different mod in addition? If you try again, does it crash every time or only rarely? Did it happen to save an autosave 4000BC before it crashed? If so, can you post the save?

-Iustus

 

[Iustus]

I just downloaded this mod, and I'm in the middle of my first game. I've just noticed a rather irritating bug, where it tells me about the transactions between AI, even if I haven't met them.

You have cheatcode = chipotle set in your ini file. This is a feature when you have that set. There are actually quite a few pieces of information that are visible when this is set, intended to help determine what is going on, and track things that need improvement.

For example, if you hold down the alt and shift key, and hovering over a city, you get some extra information, including the values the governor places on each plot and for every citizen the city can run. I had debug mode active also for this screenshot (ctrl-z), which is why the unit AI is listed twice. As these are really debugging tools, it is considered alright to have this duplication in some cases, the idea is to be able to get the information when you want it, not to make it 100% pretty.

Holding the alt key over your name in the scoreboard will show extra information, showing the power of each player (and the total power of that player and its allies). When a player is in financial trouble, it shows a red ($$$). The barbarian numbers are not as meaningful, but I decided to leave them in. (Observant folks might notice this is a not yet released build):

Holding down the shift key shows things like what resources are connected to this plot by routes, if there is a river, which direction is it flowing, what is the city founding value for the active player, what is the stack strength calculation for that plot (both offensively and defensively):

holding down the alt key when mousing over a plot will show any non-zero city founding values (areas are basically continents, islands, oceans or lakes):

While I said we do not try to make things look pretty, I am pretty happy with the new info that will be shown when you hold down ctrl key over a stack, it shows which units are grouped together, and which units are loaded on which transports, the mission of the group, the mission ai of the group, and more!

When available, it will show things like the destination, although this is available less than I would like:

And the new war analasis info that will be in the next build (alt mouseover a player in the scoreboard):

We put these things there for debugging purposes, I point them out so that you folks can use these features to give clearer descriptions of behavior that does not seem right.

On another note, the next build will have the new seagoing stack building code, so ocean assaults should be more impressive.

-Iustus

 

[tofof]

...if there is a river, which direction is it flowing...

Okay, so this is OT and I'm sorry about that, but does this have any effect on gameplay? I never knew the flow was anything more than an animation. I searched the forums and found that rivers always flow toward the ocean so you can use that knowledge while doing early exploring. Otherwise, is this important in any way, like religion only spreading downriver or something?

 

[Iustus]

Okay, so this is OT and I'm sorry about that, but does this have any effect on gameplay? I never knew the flow was anything more than an animation. I searched the forums and found that rivers always flow toward the ocean so you can use that knowledge while doing early exploring. Otherwise, is this important in any way, like religion only spreading downriver or something?

Nope, only important graphically. (Other than being used for map generation).

-Iustus

 

[zarakand]

Iustus, thanks for the info! I'd forgotten about changing the cheatcode feature.

 

[tofof]

Okay, another quick question. Is there any chance you include the small bits of code from the Customizable Domestic Advisor mod (http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=523) in your compiled core dll?

That mod updates the cvgamecore.dll only to add back the 'Widget_Zoom_City' to warlords that had been present in vanilla by default. It's quite literally a one-line change in two files, and a two-line change plus a seven-line function in a third, and that's it.

I'm certainly expecting the answer to be 'no', but I had to ask. The alternative, of course, is that I get to learn to use the SDK to do my own builds.

That mod isn't constantly updated like this one, and it's a small enough alteration to ensure compatibility with a fairly popular interface improvement that I thought it might be possible.

PS - Thanks for the explanation about the rivers.

 

[Uncle_Joe]

Any chance you had the wrong dll installed? Vanilla while playing warlords, or warlords while playing vanilla? Were you using a different mod in addition? If you try again, does it crash every time or only rarely? Did it happen to save an autosave 4000BC before it crashed? If so, can you post the save?

-Iustus

Hmm, I had been using the 'Ethnically Diverse Units' graphics too and removing that stops the crash. But prior to the 12-12 build, I was able to use both with no problems.

Did anything change in the .dll that would preclude the graphics-only changes of the othe mod?

Thanks!

 

[HardCoder]

...And I built the Great Wall in 700 AD, and the Pyramids in 1170 AD. I know you said you toned down the Wonder production for the AI, but it seems it was toned down too much....

I finished Stonehenge in 1000AD (that's AD) on standard continents, Prince, Epic, which I thought was extremely weird.

 

[HardCoder]

On another note, the next build will have the new seagoing stack building code, so ocean assaults should be more impressive.

-Iustus

Does the AI have any notion of what it's going to do with the ocean assaults, or does it just dump a bunch of units in a good place and take it from there? There may be an impressive assortment of units coming ashore, but if they take a city that gets taken right back while all two dozen invaders are defeated by defenders on railroads, what was the point?

A couple of things about the sea invasion AI that are weak:

1) It tends to pick the same spot for a landing. If there's a coastal oil then you can pretty much plan to see a landing there. Or, in any event, wherever the AI lands after declaring war seems to be the most likely spot for future landings to appear. You can park a mech inf and modern armor on a coastal oil and kill 30 units over time. You'd think the AI could develop a Plan B, such as cutting roads near the protected resource, or leave it alone if there's not enough force to take out the defenses.

2) The AI doesn't harrass well, or at all, from the sea. The AI might perform better if it landed one or two defensive units on strategic coastal resources, pillaged, then fortified, rather than landing an entire stack.

The AI could even plan missions to (occasionally) build forts on top of strategic resources on the borders of enemy territory. That could be annoying. That seems like something that an AI in the middle or bottom of the score list would do as part of being annoying in the way that the AIs that aren't going to win try to be annoying anyway.

 

[HardCoder]

...though in my games i havn't seen much cpu vs cpu fighting unless its shaka or ceaser but maybe im just "unlucky".

You may need to encourage them to fight. If you can buy one civ into attacking another one once or especially twice, their relations are poisoned pretty much permanently. Usually the two largest enemy civs will have different religions, so if you suck up to one of them, you can often get it to remain at war with the other one most of the game, which should give you a lot of breathing room. This is true no matter whether it's vanilla, 2.08, or BetterAI.