A cheap upgrade, worth it?

[Ulyaoth]

How so? The cheapest one is $300, cheapest mobo $200, and you could get 2gb of DDR3 RAM for $100, that's $600. Add a vid card, say I stayed cheap on that, $120, and psu $150 let's say, and case $50. That'd be $900-$1000 I'd guess. Quite a bit more than I originally wanted to spend but if it's so much better and has an upgrade path I'd be willing to spend.

 

[Genocidicbunny]

For RAM, you want to get them in sets of 3 now. So 3GB, 6GB, 12GB etc..
You'll probly want to get 6GB to utilize the processor to its utmost. Cheapest motherboard on newegg is 225$.

If you're gonna get a Corei7 system, there is no reason to scrape the very bottom of the barrel. If you want cheaper and dont mind a slower speed, get a C2D system instead.

 

[Ulyaoth]

I don't mind slower speed, but if it'd be a better value without being ridiculously expensive I would prefer the i7 for future upgrades and such. It's just the matter of which is a better value, $500 for a cheap C2D system, or $1000+ for a i7 system. Any thoughts? And what about Phenom II again? I was just looking at a site saying that it was overclocking over 6ghz, and then the next sentence saying Phenom II will suck and be absolute crap, which I don't get.

 

[Genocidicbunny]

Phenom 2 will go to 6ghz with a very good water cooling setup. 4ghz air is what they said I think, which is very possible with an C2D E8500 on a decent air setup.

What do you mean by future upgrades? If you plan on upgrading the cpu and other major components within a year or so, best to just go all-out now. Otherwise, if you plan to upgrade in 2 years, you're probably gonna end up doing a full upgrade. Besides the processor upgrades, everything else is interchangeable between the platforms ( well, memory is only somewhat. But either way, you'll be able to buy DDR2 or DDR3 sets in a year still). graphics cards will continue to be PCIe, so those will be easily upgradeable.

What Im trying to say I guess, is that 'future proofing' is the wrong way to look at it. Look at what you need now, think about how much performance you're gonna need in a year. If you're a gamer, but you dont plan to get a new monitor and only play games at 1280x1024 ( or something like that), are you really gonna need the top of the line GPU? Same thing for processor. Do you need that extra boost that Corei7 gives? Or can you live with a C2D?

 

[GoodGame]

I'd go with an Asus or Gigabyte for a Wolfdale mobo. I think you could even go with a midi-sized board and save some money there too. You could even get integrated video and eliminate the video card if you wanted, plus still get HDMI-support. Won't have great 3D acceleration but will be a good all-around multi-media computer.

 

[Ulyaoth]

By future upgrades I mean in case the cpu gets slow in 2-3 years rather than just have the option of a crappy upgrade to a higher level C2D or buying a new mobo, RAM, and cpu, it'd just be make a crappy upgrade to a higher level i7. Yeah, I guess it doesn't make much better sense, but my thinking was that the i7 would probably last me a good 3-4 years with maybe just some more RAM and a new vid card every other year.

Either way I go I don't plan on upgrading within the next year as I don't see why I would need to, either way would be more than enough for whatever I want for a year or so, the whole thing why I might want an i7 is it'd stay better for longer, rather than start being really old and outdated within a year or 2.

I guess I'll just stick with the C2D then, maybe I'll just go spend a bit more on it from the start, get a 4850 instead of the 4830, get the case right away, maybe get a cooler for the cpu. Any suggestions on that? Like my thought on the E5200 maybe?

 

[GoodGame]

If you do go with a long-term case, I'd probably go with a full-sized one, since the number of useful midi-sized mobos is pretty small, especially for the home builder. A winner if you can find a case that accepts both full and mid-sized mobos, then you can save money on a cheaper midi-mobo with integrated video, and selectively upgrade the CPU and mobo--probably the CPU first until the mobo gets old.

 

[Genocidicbunny]

the C2D is gonna be plenty good for the next two years. Im fairly certain of that.
I've got a system that can run Far Cry 2 at ~60fps on max settings 1680x1050 resolution. If Far Cry 2 runs that well, Im certain that even in 2 years youw ill be able to play most anything fine. My system has a 2.83gHz C2Q, 4gb 1066 RAM and a GTX 260 Core 216. Cost quite a bit, but thats mostly due to the GTX 260, C2Q and motherboard. You can easily get a P45 motherboard, C2D 7200 ( or maybe even an 8500) and something like a 9800GT, OC some of the stuff and get very good performance out of it. Best part, a system like that will cost around 600$ or so (Without stuff like HDD's, disc drives and etc though).

For the case, I highly recommend an Antec 900 or 1200. I have the 1200 that I got at a very good price ( 120$ ) and it is an excellent case. My biggest beef with it is the fact that all the fans have LED's that cannot be turned off, save for the 200mm fan's LED. Its plenty big for even a full size ATX motherboard with a huge cooler on the processor and long video cards. The amount of fans also helps a lot with keeping stuff cool. That, and it feels quite sturdy. If you can find it cheaper than 150$, buy it, otherwise, save some money and get a 900 which, while a bit more compact, should still fit most components ( no huge coolers though ).

 

[Ulyaoth]

How's the fans on that? I've heard the giant fans that come in those Antec cases are kinda flimsy/easy to break. I was thinking of the 300, maybe 900 if I could find it cheap(like find an actual store so I save on the $20 shipping)

And I guess I'd be fine with the 4830 since I only have a 17" monitor with max 1280x1024 resolution anyway. So, I guess I could get the E8400 or E8500 too, better cache and not much lower multiplier. First upgrade will probably be a video card in a year then I guess.

 

[Genocidicbunny]

Unless you plan to stick things into the fans, they're fine. But then again, most case fans will be damaged if you stick something into them while they're running. I've also heard that Antec is pretty good about replacing fans that break during shipping, so that shouldnt be a major concern.

 

[GoodGame]

My fingers have yet to break a running fan when I stick my hand in them, but it does smart!

 

[Zelig]

And I guess I'd be fine with the 4830 since I only have a 17" monitor with max 1280x1024 resolution anyway. So, I guess I could get the E8400 or E8500 too, better cache and not much lower multiplier. First upgrade will probably be a video card in a year then I guess.

I'm going to go with usual plug, and recommend a quad core. If you're not going with a quad-core, go with a cheap dual core, sub-$100, so you're actually saving money.

Current games (GTA IV, for one) require a quad core to play nicely, even at low resolutions like 1280x1024.

 

[Ulyaoth]

I actually think I'm going to wait a bit longer til the Phenom 2s come out in early january, because I was reading up on it and it's supposed to be a lot better than the C2s now, and overclocking a lot better. So I'll see if it ends up good, and hope either intel's price goes down or I'll just get the AMD, since I can still use an older AM2 mobo. So, I'd get a quad that's much faster than a C2 at that price right now(the Phenom 920 is supposed to be $250 or less, and as fast as the Q9550 I think, or maybe it was the 940 but still shouldn't be too much of a difference)

 

[Zelig]

I actually think I'm going to wait a bit longer til the Phenom 2s come out in early january, because I was reading up on it and it's supposed to be a lot better than the C2s now, and overclocking a lot better. So I'll see if it ends up good, and hope either intel's price goes down or I'll just get the AMD, since I can still use an older AM2 mobo. So, I'd get a quad that's much faster than a C2 at that price right now(the Phenom 920 is supposed to be $250 or less, and as fast as the Q9550 I think, or maybe it was the 940 but still shouldn't be too much of a difference)

There's always going to be something faster and cheaper available if you wait a couple months.

 

[Ulyaoth]

well, in the case of waiting 2-3 weeks, who cares. Seriously, it's just stupid to buy things the second you start looking when something better is coming out really soon.

 

[Zelig]

well, in the case of waiting 2-3 weeks, who cares. Seriously, it's just stupid to buy things the second you start looking when something better is coming out really soon.

I'm not saying you shouldn't wait, but when you're looking at a full computer, there's always going to be something better coming out really soon.

 

[Quintillus]

From what I've read, whether Nehalem is worth it really depends on what you plan to do with it. If you plan to do lots of media/video encoding stuff, it really does give a huge boost. But if your focus is gaming, it's not much better than a regular Core 2 Quad of similar stock speed, which, for many games, won't be any better than a Core 2 Duo of the same clock speed. Since you seem to be leaning more towards games than encoding, the older ones probably are a better deal. And the E7300 with 2.66 GHz may actually prove better for you than the 920 with 2.2 GHz (assuming you don't use quad-core power).

Also, you ought to be able to pick up the RAM a bit cheaper; check out slickdealz.net for the recent bargins. $30 with a mail-in rebate is not uncommon. Just make sure you fill it in correctly.

 

[Ulyaoth]

All the things I was looking at were showing Phenom II's performance in games versus the i7s and Q9550. They had the Q9550 and Phenom being better than the i7 actually in some games, i7 was better in some though. This is just the Am2 phenom II though so the AM3 should be even better, but I don't feel like waiting until mid february for a new computer.

 

[Quintillus]

Just saw this RAM deal from Fry's; $10 for 4 GB of desktop DDR2 memory. Runs through the end of the year, so if you do end up going DDR2 memory I'd recommend grabbing it. And the benefit from DDR3 is fairly low unless you go high-end DDR3, so unless your motherboard requires it (I think Core i7 does require DDR3; Core 2 and AMD Phenom 2 appear to be fine with DDR2), I'd recommend going DDR2.

And I think I missed the entire second page when I posted earlier, but I don't think I actually repeated too much, amazingly.

 

[Ulyaoth]

Well, the phenom IIs have come and while they're not as good as were said, they still seem a good bit better and an actual decent competitor to the c2s, so now I've been thinking again, and have come down to either an E8500 and a Asus P5Q, which will come to $15 more than a Phenom II 920 with a combo deal Biostar Tforce TA790GX.

I'm leaning towards the phenom, since I'm thinking even if it may be slower clock for clock and will probably only max at maybe 3.5ghz as opposed to the I'm sure unless I get a really bad chip an easy 4ghz+ with the intel, that the performance in stuff now wouldn't be that much different, and as time goes on and things start supporting quad cores more(since if I go on how I've now held onto my current mobo/cpu for almost 6 years now, thinking even if I upgrade more often I'd still hold on to it for a while) that the phenom will be better. And also to benefit the AMD route is that that mobo has a built in gpu, so even if it's not all that good, I'd think it'd still be better than my X850pro for the low resolution I play at at least to hold on and save $100 for a while until I can get more money and maybe buy a better monitor and a 4850 or something rather than the 4830. Not gonna bother waiting for the AM3 since apparently any performance difference is just in supporting DDR3 for now, and I'm not gonna wait for end of year for new chipsets to come out and make up my mind.