A strategy for consistent cultural wins on Monarch

Your article really opened my eyes towards the cultural victory.
With Civ III I never even tried to achieve this kind of victory (with my playing style its always the space race or diplomatic victory).
But thanks to your story, things have changed. While trying to master the game on Prince level (and loosing the space race continuously), I once started a game with a random leader on a standard map size, continent, high sea levels and marathon speed. The leader turned out to be Catherine (cultural, philosophical). While exploring I found myself to be the only inhabitant of a continent. At first I went for the space race victory. But by the time you get off your continent with your caravel and your alphabet you're way behind the other civs.
But with the diplomatic victory as a goal, being the lone civ on a continent becomes a huge advantage! Why? Is saw no need to develop any seafaring or military techs in the early stages of the game. My opponents would'nt arrive with their militairy forces loaded on their gallions for the next centuries to come. Instead, I got to be the first to build numerous world wonders, founding taoism and islam on the way.
The continent was large enough to reach a number of ten cities. Three became the targets for the cultural victory, two others were designated to produce military units.
These units were enough to fend off the only invading force during the whole game; hower they succeeded in raizing a minor city, they couldn't get more than six units at a time on my shores. After two rounds of attack they were open for peace negotiations.
A few centuries later I experienced a very emotional moment: I turned the research to zero. From that moment on I was managing to get the culture rating to 100%. This was achieved by a form of micromanagement: having cities generate wealth, while employing merchant specialists. The only challenge I had, was that the smallest of my three cities needed a great artist to reach legendary status before time ran out. And at marathon speed level, there was just one more to be born...
And so, while my cossacks and riflemen were guarding my resources and the other civs raced to be the first in space, I won my very first Prince game and my very first cultural victory.
Thanks to you!
 
Congrats on the Deity wins Walker!

But looking through the player log, I noticed in one of the games that you built the Pantheon (pretty crucial for cultural chances), after the AI built Notre, Sistine and G/library.

What the heck happened there??

The normal wonder progression seems to be, Henge/Oracle, Pyramids, and then Pantheon (maybe the G/lib here and there before).

You must have thought all your Xmases have come at once, lol.

Great Achievement anyway.
I've been close on Deity with cultural, but could not defend the waves of the head hunters.

Cheers
 
Bone Crusher said:
Congrats on the Deity wins Walker!

But looking through the player log, I noticed in one of the games that you built the Pantheon (pretty crucial for cultural chances), after the AI built Notre, Sistine and G/library.

What the heck happened there??
The AI doesn't seem to care much about Parthenon. So every once in a while, it is available late. Same thing happens with Hanging Gardens in some games. With Elizabeth (or any other philosophical civ), The Parthenon doesn't have a huge effect, but every little bit helps.

The deity wins are a little bit "fake". It's Hall of Fame rules, so I pick my opponents (only peaceful ones), and turn off barbarians (though it would work with barbarians on the map I choose).

Most importantly, I handicap the AI as much as possible to neutralize the second settler. To do that, I choose archipelago map with high sea level and tiny islands. It's not uncommon to start on a 4 tile island.

Since there is no room for cottages, I instead get 60% of my culture through great artists. So regen the map until I get a starting spot with at least 1 hills and at least 5 food resources (I've had up to 7 seafood). Make heavy use of whipping to build early stuff. Build the Great Lighthouse. Settle only 2 to 3 other cities (on spaces with 3 seafood, if available, and 2 seafood otherwise). All 3 cities churn out great artists. Religion is only important for pacifism. I don't build any cathedrals (not enough production).

Oh, one more thing - if you play on quick speed, the scaling is off - the speed is 2/3rds normal speed, but you only need half the culture. So it's easier to win a culture win, but you can't really win early (like the 1100's wins that are in the HoF).

That's the deity strategy in a nutshell. It's very gimmicky, but a lot of deity-level HoF is gimmicky.
 
I tried to play as Spain in my attempts, pretty much normal settings but also Archipelago, so I can get a sea resource tile to work and found 1 or 2 early religions from it. Then work from there, spreading the culture.

In my 2 attempts I did manage to chop down the Pantheon, and also my land mass is usually big enough to get my 3 cities on it.

Once I had no iron, so that was a killer, but still I was doing well, great income from spreading the religions, culture building was super etc. But the wave of the attackers that came (2 declared war at once virtually) was amazing.

The other time I also founded early religions, but was an island hop away from Napoleon who despatched galley after galley of spearman, and defeated my defending axeman. (I hate that guy....)

I think cultural is the most plausible and 'fair' win on deity, the future start, the anarchy exploit are a bit of a joke I know.

I still think it's good that you pulled it off ! :-)

Maybe you could give it a try with Spain, as right now I simply find it too boring/not interesting to focus my game on cultural wins, I want to space ship win more often on Emperor.

Once you chop down the Pantheon and focus on defence, I think it's very defendable, especially if you get Iron for your Conquistadors. Their 50%+ v melee will be handy if you beeline for guilds early enough.

Cheers
 
I'm a Civ 3 veteran and got Civ 4 for Christmas. I always was a warmonger in Civ 3 and started that way in Civ 4. Thanks to this post and the one by walkerjks I decided to try my hand at a cultural victory.

3 losses (yes Virginia you do still need a military;) ) later I got my first cultural victory. I used these two threads for alot of my strategy and fine tuning. Thanks to the OPs of both threads and those of you who have added to the threads. I now have more than one way to try and win that I enjoy playing.
 
All of my culture wins have happened by accident. I have always gone for diplomatic or space race, and try to get my opponent's border citys. It's like when you are going for conquest and get domination or the other way around.
 
Termilyn said:
I'm a Civ 3 veteran and got Civ 4 for Christmas. I always was a warmonger in Civ 3 and started that way in Civ 4. Thanks to this post and the one by walkerjks I decided to try my hand at a cultural victory.

3 losses (yes Virginia you do still need a military;) ) later I got my first cultural victory. I used these two threads for alot of my strategy and fine tuning. Thanks to the OPs of both threads and those of you who have added to the threads. I now have more than one way to try and win that I enjoy playing.

LOL - I guess this post only makes a little sense since I thought I was posting in the notes and tips thread started by spiceant. But the point is the same - I now enjoy the game even more thanks to you all.
 
Great thread, I should thank everyone for the insights. I was a Noble player before GOTM, then I played GOTM2 on Prince and won Diplomacy. Now on GOTM3 it was Monarch and Tokugawa, but I pulled a Cultural! Will tell the whole story in the spoilers when they come out.
 
Just finished my first civ 4 win (cultural) with English on Prince on a standard map standard speed by 1942ad. My biggest mistake was realising value of spreading many religions and building cathedrals. By end of games on my island with America all my three cultural cities had 4 cathedrals each adding +50% culture with an added +100% by a certain civic. Having a tech lead i found 3 religions and the Americans found christianity. I think perhaps i could of cut off my science rate to zero earlier on as no other nation landed on my island all game. I also should of spread the religions much earlier as this delayed my cathedrals.

I certainly wasnt going to research scientific research no matter how many civs wanted to trade it with me. Room for improvement me thinks. It was fun game anyway. Hmmm i doubt this would of worked on monarch without a focus on the goal ahead.
 
I play Noble and would like to go for a cultural win. I much prefer Epic speed. Is cultural still fairly doable at this speed and at this level?
 
I don't know about Epic speed, but I managed to win my very first Noble game today with a cultural victory. I played a sloppy start and was I stuck on an island with Tokoguwa. I managed to build nine cities but I was never able to build a big enough military to challenge Tokoguwa, and he wouldn't ever trade techs with me, so I started falling behind in techs.

Mid-game I other civs exploring found me and I was able to finally trade some techs to catch up and luckily 4 religions spread to my cities. So, I managed to build a couple wonders and cathedrals in my 3 mains cities and pulled off a cultural victory as the AI was finished building casings. Great strategies posted here, I might try again on Noble to refine my early game a little before I try anything on Prince. :D
 
Hey, excellent strategy...

I tried (just about as I could) followin tightly.

The settings were, Elizabeth, China (mixed leaders, chose china for Pavillion and to a less extent, cho-ko-nu), standard size, pangea, everything else defaults on Noble.

It was my first victory on noble (and first time NOT getting crushed since BTS)...

Won in 1944, went to the "accept all demands, gave everyone help (unless help in war) using techs (while i've got them) and happyness resources as gifts" and it really worked...

There were 7 civs, and i got no religion until 6 of them were hinduist (seemed safe as the other was 5 civs apart from me)...

In BTS some things will be different:

a) Apostollic palace... if you don't make it, and the one who has it, is from another religion... you're dead (Jihad's coming for you)
(this time, one of the hinduist build it)

b) But... someone passed some decission on "assing that city to"... once for one of the other civs (failed) and twice for me...
(build 2 settlers with chop rushing, got lucky with iron and got a barb city with one swordsman... then, some hundred years later, got the "working citys" by those AP flips and everything went well)

c) There's something you cannot control, and that are the "events". If you have bad luck, and you have an "unnaproved marriage" failing with your neighbour... that's probably war again...

d) it never reached to the point, but i tend to believe that corps (that the other civs will eventually create) might be a problem (money flying out of your window) ... so "rush to victory" to prevent it.. (or close external markets, but that's not good either)

e) some things should be rethinked (or recalculated) with the new techs and stuff (i'm to lazy right now to do the math/stats)...

anyway... thanks for the article, it's really good, and "stands the test of expansions" (for most of what i read, it seems to be written for the original, because it never says anything about Great Generals appearing (though is obvious because of the "hippie" (all peace) behavior..

f) (almost forgot) Great Spies... you "start" with 4 Espionage points per turn, and somehow, you will get stuck with one of them... the only good thing I though I could do with it, was starting a golden age (first one in BTS is only 1 GP)... i wouldn't know what to do if a second appeared..

thanks again.... looking forward for your "adjustments" for BTS... :king:
 
Wouldn't using SE for this instead of CE, and generating culture with Artists and Great Artists work better though?

With SE you are not required to become a sitting duck when you turn on the "culture switch" - all but 3 of the top cities can still continue producing scientists (and even your 3 cultural cities will still generate some science if you are running Representation).

Not to mention, at higher levels SE is generally more efficient, as it is not affected by inflation the same way CE is.
 
I think you underestimate Industrious a bit. Even if it only allows 1 extra early wonder for 6 culture/turn, that doubles to 12 after 1000 years, and with free speech and 3 cathedrals, that's 42 culture per turn at the end. Just one extra early wonder can easily produce 8-10% of a city's culture for a game.

Also, Sistine chapel is a huge gain. Even without the specialist bonus, that's 15 base culture in your 3 cities from the religious buildings.

My favorite for culture is Huayna Capac. Ind and Fin both help a lot.
 
Very nice post.

After reading it, I have used this strategy several times and it works great. The last couple of times I decided to go cultural late and actually did better for my victory date, one game hitting 1802ad on Monarch (but I think I was on Epic speed so that probably explains why it was so early). I has two cities with over 1000culture/turn in my last game. And it was about 65 turns from flipping the switch to winning with all the Great Artists I had stored up or generated. I had 6 religions to work with in this game, captured a city with that founded two religions in the BCs :P

1) I progressed farther into the tech tree before I flip the 100% culture switch. Namely, I go to Radio to get the extra 50% culture in each big 3 city from Eiffel Tower and the Broadway, RocknRoll +50%s.

2) One of my culture cities is always my NE/NP GP farm city. Which will pretty much always win the race with all the Artists specialists they will have when I flip the switch. And it can make a lot of Great Artists when it first comes online.

So the nice thing is you can figure out you can't win Space Race and still get your act together to win Culturally, as long as you build the religious infrastructure along the way (best to do that with Organized Religion active obviously). The religious infrastructue helps you anyway, and otherwise yo basically play the game like you might for a dominatin or space race victory until you get to liberalism. Then you can decide if you will win the Space Race, or if it is even worth it to try, when you can probably win culturally faster.
 
Hello, I've been using your guide to try to win my first cultural game and it worked very well.
I've been playing a shadow game of the first 'cultural victory challenge' (noble). It's 1620 I have 3 cities with more than 50.000 culture points in the victory screen since 2 turns ago. However, I don't get the victory yet. Does anyone know why?
Thanks in advance
 
Hello, I've been using your guide to try to win my first cultural game and it worked very well.
I've been playing a shadow game of the first 'cultural victory challenge' (noble). It's 1620 I have 3 cities with more than 50.000 culture points in the victory screen since 2 turns ago. However, I don't get the victory yet. Does anyone know why?
Thanks in advance
The amount of points you need to qualify as a "legendary" city increases on the longer game speeds. Are you playing on Epic or Marathon?

Go into one of your 3 cities, look at the lower left, and it'll tell you how many points you need to achieve Legendary status.

Wodan

ps the guide should say this. ;)
 
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