A Tough Tiny Demigod

Buttercup said:
6. Throughout this time just cave in to any demands from AI civs or if they offer deals, try and get as much as possible. Never go out of your way to trade anything until you've done the jump. A war with either Portugal or Zulu is ok, you can normally negotiate peace by the time they arrive, but a war with Ottomans would be catastrophic for the jump.

Nope:
 

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950-Change all citizens to tax collectors. Ring up Portugal and make the deal in the screenshot. Then tell his sword to leave or declare. And he declares. Destroy sword, and change all citizens back to tiles.

Lol, now that's a neat trick :lol:

2 leaders, you lucky beast you! Game on!
 
And again with the tech tricks:
 

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Dude, I can war for decades, using Elites in every turn and not turn up an Army. I can keep using a specific Unit over and over and still nothing. Then, suddenly, just as I'm about to attack a town, the first Elite to attack it generates an Army. It's funny how that seems to be often the case. Anyway, I see you've got one killed? Or did you mean you got a Science Leader somehow and one Military Leader?

Anyway, on your 350BC save I noticed the following:

Your cash is only 17 Gold but your economy is -3 per turn with the Economy already at 60% tax and 40% Luxury. And yet you are building a large amount of cost buildings, on top of which you are at war with two nations but building no Units. To which your units consist of 2 Warriors, 2 Spearmen, 9 Horsemen and 11 Catapults and 1 Army of Horsemen. You have traded your Iron for a Luxury. None of your towns aside from the capital has any Culture and you aren't building any.

Now, on the face of it, to any 'normal' player, this situation would appear dire beyond dire. There is nothing here which suggests survival.

However, seeing this tech/trade trick, it appears you have things up your sleeve that are not immediately apparent to a 'normal' player. This is good, these are the real gems of advice.

You look set to take your first Ottoman town. I'll be interested to see how you manipulate the peace deal if that's going to be the next trick :)

Edit: ah, I see there's a new save, I shall check it out tomorrow :)
 
I didn't have one killed. I used it to rush the Heroic Epic.

Buttercup said:
Your cash is only 17 Gold but your economy is -3 per turn with the Economy already at 60% tax and 40% Luxury. And yet you are building a large amount of cost buildings, on top of which you are at war with two nations but building no Units. To which your units consist of 2 Warriors, 2 Spearmen, 9 Horsemen and 11 Catapults and 1 Army of Horsemen. You have traded your Iron for a Luxury. None of your towns aside from the capital has any Culture and you aren't building any.

Now, on the face of it, to any 'normal' player, this situation would appear dire beyond dire. There is nothing here which suggests survival.

I hadn't lost a single town at that point (and still haven't). As I tried to indicate earlier (though not so explicitly, I admit) the game isn't over unless you end up conquered or the AI wins by some other victory condition. There exists another, even more powerful tech (and gold, and military alliance and maps) trick that could get used... here's a sample game where I used it extensively at my borders. That said, you'd have to either pillage around your capital to do that in this game, or sell all your harbors. I don't think it necessary here, though you do have to play from behind on this map without it. It also comes as least powerful on a tiny map in general, as trading for luxuries often isn't easy on a tiny map, and Osman, I think the tech leader doesn't have anything to trade for.

That all said I do admit to some reloading (not for leaders though), and I do feel this a tough map. Maybe that doesn't mean all that much, as I usually play for the HoF and have better starts for my capital. Also, though you do have some nice freshwater in this game, you don't have any food bonuses anywhere nearby your starting position (in other words, even with an "average" start you'd think you'd have some food bonus in first or 2nd ring of cities somewhere... and possibly then making that food-rich city bigger than any other city, and abandoning your capital so your palace would move to the food-rich city *might* prove useful). That no food bonuses in the first few rings exist here seems rare... though I'm not entirely sure.

Leader 4:
 

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Since you are sharing so shall I, lol.

Here's my best position so far with this map:

View attachment Lincoln of the Americans, 850 AD.SAV

I got lucky because the Great Library kept going until Metallurgy. On previous loads it had stopped at Gunpowder. So, a vast chunk of random luck there.

I got unlucky as all of my battles to date have provided no Armies. Though on one load from this point I generated one about 20 turns later, but regretted the declaration of war and quickly got overrun anyway.

I still feel this is a lose position (without neat tricks) as the AI has Riflemen in such huge abundance, even after crushing defeats, the loss of it's Capital and a massive gold per turn peace deal.

For this load I have used the advice about the Great Library and have built 3 or 4 Canons and have tried to get the big gold per turn peace deals at the right moment. Everything else is what I would normally do.

As I say, without neat tricks I still think it's (probably) a lose position, but it's quite nice to look at.
 
Just out of curiosity, I thought Military Leaders couldn't rush Wonders? Isn't Heroic Epic a Wonder?
 
MGLs in Conquests can rush small wonders, but not great wonders.

After this turn, since both Portugal and the Ottomans have gone past Education, I'll research Literature and put in the Great Library (not that I need to do this, really, but rails would come as nice).

Edit: Portgual isn't declaring on me, even though they are Furious with me. The military advisor says I'm average to them, average to the Zulu, and strong to the Ottomans. But, I may as well soil my reputation at this point, and get my cash back.
 

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Buttercup said:
Your game has started exactly the same as all mine (about 30 attempts), even down to the trades if I made them, except you have chosen to build a Granary first whereas I tend to kick of with Barracks.

No, my game didn't start the same way except for a granary build. Your city spacing comes as significantly wider than mine. On top of this you only have 5 cannons, while I had a slew more artillery type units (which I disbanded towards the end for armies). I count 11 unused squares in Washington, I think 13 in New York... which lies in a very different location than my 002 in 850 AD. If you check my saves, I had used a bunch of those tiles earlier, and had more cities within the same number of tiles. This happens, because of the differences in part, because of how we played the start differently.
 
I should have put this up yesterday, but a rough day at some specialist clinic. Let me say I had no games on a tiny map that I can recall. Not played a solo DG in a long time and it was on large map and was AWDG.

Most recent were some AWDG SG's on a massive maps and at least one CCM at DG. I got part way into the game and was sort of agreeing with Buttercup that it was a tough map.

Later I starting rethinking that. What is a tough map? I would have to say starting with Iron and Horses and in a pretty safe place is not the makings of a tough map.

I would also add that you should at least feel you may be in danger of losing. That was not present in this game either. So in the end I would not call this a tough map and the game played with little strain at all.

I did stop without the final victory. They had one town left and it was about to get hit my 4 armies. They had muskets and impi's, no horses, no hope. Well they started the game with no hope really.
 
2130BC:
I met the Sultan earlier and made no trades and he still is not willing to trade. I recently met Henry and I did trade Mason for Pottery. Not a good trade, but at DG you best not sit on a tech or it will be worth nothing or they may demand it.

I have a second town up and a road to it. I did not make a granary as I only recently got the tech. They know Alpha, Wheel and CB and I know IW. Every one knows WC, Mason and BW. Whoops double check and Henry knows IW. Henry and I know Pottery.

This got me to talk to the Sultan and make a two for two (IW and Pottery for Alpha, CB and 10 gold). Now I see that Sultan knows Myst. Still no vision on Shaka. Not found the Sultan's land, but met a couple or three of his spears.
Given the size of the map, I should spot Ottoman's land in a turn or two.

2110BC:
Boith now have HBR and Myst. Ottoman have Math as well and no one has Writing, which I have been researching.

1700BC:
Still no Write. I have a third town and a settler going. I am hooking up the spice. I have not use lux slider so far as my towns are staying small for now.

1600BC:
I have write, do not want to trade, assuming I could.

1500BC:
They still do not know Write. I have zero experience at Tiny maps on any level. Not played a DG, since maybe 18 mos or more and that was an AWDG 250x250 31 civs, so it does not releate either. I am trying to conside all the Sid games and use that as a 75% guide. Who knows how valid that will turn out. I see a second source of Iron. I started on a sword.

1425BC:
Trade Write as I am a lock for Philo now.

1400BC:
Henry demands 20 gold, I tell him come take it and he says that is war. I do not sweat a lousy lone DG civ. Well I do, if it is Byz.

1350BC:
Make two trades with the Sultan and get HBR for Philo and Currency for Map. I got maybe 20 gold as well.

1250BC:
The Sultan says he needs 22 gold. I said try and take and he declares war. Looks like it is going to be an AWDG after.

1125BC:
Met Shaka and sell Myst to him. He is backwards. eSword got a win as did an archer on Ottoman spears. Sword went elite a few turns back on a warrior of Henry's.

1000BC:
Not sure, if it was this turn or the one prior. Kill 3 warriors from Henry.

975BC:
Kill sword and horses goes elite. Archer kills warrior. Leave an Ottoman warrior at the door of DC. Two solo warriors are 3 tiles away. Henry has a retreated 2/3 warrior and 3 3/3 warriors on a hill 2 tiles away.

925BC:
Kill the three warriors from Henry. Kill the Sultans warrior. I have an elite sword and elite horse. Cats both missed, whats new?

900BC:
eHorse kills one of the warriors from the Sultan.

875BC:
archer kills the last warrior in the empire (Ottoman).

775BC:
Big step in the right direction as elite horse kills warrior and gets a leader. I think that was the 4 or maybe 5 elite wins. Form army and will put in swords and head out as soon as I can get 3 units init. I have had a leader on the very first elite win a few times, but this is very nice.
Archer kills warrior.

730BC:
Colossus is build by someone, too lazy to f7 and check. Sultan lands a sword at Philly.
eSword kills, iirc a sword.
Horse kills archer that cats had redlined.
1st killed an archer and covers a worker. All Ottoman units.

710BC:
Sword attacked the sword army (1x) and we hang on with 1HP. The hero goes elite. Another sword now in town and 1st moves into town. Will add the sword next turn. No units in sight.

690BC:
eSword finished a 1hp spear. 1st healing, will move out next turn.

650BC:
Horse kills spear in a town.
Horse* goes down to 1hp and kills spear and we raze the town for 1 slave. 1st covers it.

(I see now I listed the horses wrong. It was the 5/5 first and the vet that nearly died.)

590BC:
1st kills 2 spears and we raze Uskudar. Got 4 slaves and a cat.
eSword kills a spear near DC.

490BC:
eSword kills spear near DC.

470DC:
I agree to peace with the Sultan for CoL and Monarchy, plus 200 gold. The 1st was at the door of Edrine. Looks like they are at war with Henry as a lot of units were going past me heading that way, rather than towards me.

450BC:
Henry wants peace, but will give nothing and I need the war happy. Found Atlanta.

350BC:
Found Chicago.

310BC:
Shaka demands CoL and I laugh, so DoW. I revolt now and get 4 turns. To tell you the truth, I intended to do it after I got Monarchy, but was interrupted. By the time I came back I had forgotten, more old age issues. I start on Fuedalism with a lone scientist for now.

230BC:
1st kills 2 Zulu archers enroute to one of Shaka's towns. Research up to 100% now.

210BC:
1st is next to Mpondo. I have seen MDI, so pikes are probably about as well.
Found Seattle.

190BC:
1st kills 2 Impi and autorazed Mpondo. Don't know, if the MDI from the Sultan were coming for Shaka or on the way to Henry.

130BC:
Egg on my face. Shaka dropped an archer next to NYC and I did not see it. It died attacking the spear, but it could have pillaged the mine.

70BC:
I see MDI on MDI as Henry and Osman go head to head. I see Henry has pikes, but neither the spears or pikes are with the MDI, clever huh!

10BC:
Found SF. 1st kills a spear in Leiria.

10AD:
1st kills two spears and razed Leiria. I disband the 2 slaves, but keep the 5 gold. BTW I disbanded the Horse* as I won't be upgrading it.

90AD:
1st kills a pike and a spear in Gui... and razed it. Disband 2 slaves. Shaka has 8 horses next to the army on their way to our house. Well 9, counting the lone trailing horse.

150AD:
Kill a spear at Chicago (Port). 1st is pillaging around Lisbon as I am sure it will have at least 8 units.

170AD:
MDI kills P-MDI and goes elite by Seattle.
3/4 MDI at Chi kills P-spear taking no damage.

190AD:
I accept peace with Henry for Eng, worker and some gold. Start on Mono to get to knights. Shaka finished SoZ recently. I have FP and HE going. Can't get leaders as not many units have come in range of my towns.

210AD:
Archer retreats Impi at Seatlle.
 

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230AD:
The archer kills the impi and goes elite.

260AD:
The 9 Zulu horses arrived. I kill them. Got a second leader from a sword. Had to kill two, with pikes as they had retreated. My horse went elite. Thank you Osman for Eng, so I could cross rivers. Will fill 2nd with MDI next turn as all units used movement. I mean all the units around Atl and Chi.

I am strong compared to Shaka and Henry and average to Osman. That basically means I am actually much stronger.

280AD:
Kill 1 impi, after both retreated.

310AD:
2nd kills 2 Zulu units. Moving settler to hill. 1st is heading to the same spot, back from Libson.

320AD:
2nd kills 2 more impi to clear the hill and I move pike and settler to it.

330AD:
Found Miami.

350AD:
Not sure, if it was this turn or last one, but FP done. Mono on the IBT.

360AD:
kill 4 Zulu units.

370AD:
Osman asks for 28 gold and we go back to war.

380AD:
eMDI kills O-rMDI by Seattle.

390AD:
Osman sent 9 units to their death. 1 knight, 2 LB and 6 MDI most were regulars. A rKnight is in range of Atlanta, but I am going to hope a pike can handle it with a bombardment assist.

400AD:
Shaka wants peace and tossed in Swazi. I disband it.

3 bombarments and an MDI retreat a 3/3 knight. eHorse kills it.
get another rK, LB and 2 MDI.

410AD:
Kill a spear and a LB and raze Mugla. Now I can found Houston.

440AD:
eMDI and eArcher kill LB next to Seattle.
Funny Osman marched a pike/settler next Houston, so the 2nd kills it.

450AD:
Start on Invention. Not going to switch to KT as even though no one else has it going there are many wonders being worked on. Once one hits, a cascade is certain. Making knights now. I guess the Sultan is a bit gassed as not much coming of late.

470AD:
MDI kills spear by Atl.
eHorse kills 1hp spear and I get a leader. Not enough towns right now to form an army.
Kill 2 rKnights by Seattle.
KT was built, but the Lighthouse and Leo still be worked on by several.

IBT:
LB attacks the expose 2/4 MDI, but LB dies and MDI goes elite. That will teach them.

490AD:
Kill 2 rK.
2nd kills 2 spears in Urfa and razed it for 1 slave.

500AD:
1st kills knight.
eArcher kills LB (still have a leader).
Osman brings Shaka in on the war. Hope that Henry is not joining.

510AD:
LB attacks knight on mountain that was covering an archer and dies. The interesting thing is that the LB had a pike covering it and now the pike is gone. I guess Osman cannot afford it any longer.

520AD:
Osman lands 2 LB by Chi and I kill them, although the archer dropped to 1hp.
Found Buffalo.
Kill 3 knights by Houston. I guess he can afford a few new units now.
Settler will move out under the 1st to get the town I need for an army.

IBT:
knight dies attacking Houston.

530AD:
Whoops the knight retreated and was covered by a crusader. I thought he died.
Knight kills crusader and I use a pike to finish the 1hp knight.

IBT:
LB attacks the pike and we go elite.

540AD:/550AD:
I see I messed up the log some how as it is actually 550. Too sleepy to care right now, last turn tonight.
1st kills LB and we move it and the settler onto the site.
Knight kills spear and goes elite by Atl.
kill 2 knights by Buffalo.
eMDI kills spear by Seattle.
 

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