SimpleMonkey
King
lurker's comment: Dude. Seafaring.
Aabra01: Training for Mid-level Micromanagers
- Thread starter Aabraxan
- Start date
Cyllus
King of Misfits
Seafaring civ get +1 to ship movement, that was why I suggested getting TGL to give our Dromon 5 movement. Of course that'd be secondary to any expansion so probably not even worth going for unless we have a powerhouse shield generator that we could afford to put shields into. I really don't see the point in researching IW ourselves. The AI go for that asap, every time. We can certainly trade for it with Writing while the AI research every cheap tech first.
Right, the Seafaring trait. Silly me.
Phaedo
Emperor
I really don't have strong feelings about what we research first, but there is value to self-researching IW. First, we already have BW (which many AI won't and we would know how many do have it if we check the space screen). Second, if we go for the Phil sling, what are we going to trade for IW? It would have to be Writing or something higher and that would put our slingshot in jeopardy as we would be trading an AI up to parity on our own track, especially if we are starting with a low currency position in the beginning.
Elephantium
Trampling the AI
Err, no, it doesn't. How exactly does the shield-on-production phase system work?
Actually, a general primer on the game's interturn functioning would be helpful for me.
Edit: Something else occurred to me. A strategy I've been enamored of lately is building my first 3 or so cities in a CxC pattern around my capital (specifically, settle the corner spots that don't get filled by the culture expansion), then abandoning them at the end of the expansion phase. To my thinking, the advantage of this is that I get extra production up and running a couple of turns sooner - which has a ripple effect far into the game.
What does the rest of the team think about this trick?
CoolioVonHoolio
Quit WoW, back to Civ.
Wait.. what does "in cue" mean? does that mean im up? or just waiting...
gmaharriet
Ancient Crone
lurker's comment: The game calculates food BEFORE shields.
1. If you look in the City screen and see that you are producing enough food to grow a new citizen on the next turn, and
2. If your build (curragh, settler, warrior) appears to be 1 or 2 shields short of building that next turn, and
3. If you have your City Governor set on "emphasize production",
Your new citizen will be born on the inter-turn. The Governor will place it on the highest production tile available (usually forest or mined hill), and THEN the shields will be calculated and include that additional high-shield tile.
So, if your build appears to be 2 shields short and there is a forest not being worked YET by a citizen, that is where your new citizen will magically come up with the apparently missing shields.
This is also a big part of how a "settler factory" works, but it usually happens twice during the build period, and I'm sure Bede could explain it much better than I.
It was poor wording on my part. Call it "holding for an open slot."
Harriet's explanation is spot on.
As I understand it, the inter-turn calculations start with food (growth), then commerce (research), and finish with shields (production).
To get the extra shield(s) you have to have the city governor set to "emphasize production" TO do that you open the screen, select the governor button and check the box marked "Emphasize Production" and uncheck all the rest including the box "Manage citizen moods".
Generally you will want to reassign the new citizen to a more appropriate field once you have the game back.
And that is precisely how a "settler factory" works. They require management, though, as you have to reassign the growth citizen from shields to food every two turns to keep it in phase.
As I understand it, the inter-turn calculations start with food (growth), then commerce (research), and finish with shields (production).
To get the extra shield(s) you have to have the city governor set to "emphasize production" TO do that you open the screen, select the governor button and check the box marked "Emphasize Production" and uncheck all the rest including the box "Manage citizen moods".
Generally you will want to reassign the new citizen to a more appropriate field once you have the game back.
And that is precisely how a "settler factory" works. They require management, though, as you have to reassign the growth citizen from shields to food every two turns to keep it in phase.
If it wasn't clear from my opening post, absolutely. This game is not about speed. And yes, Barbs are restless.
Strikes me as a waste of 90 shields as well as worker turns developing lands on the far side of the capitol's cultural boundary. Take two more steps and make a permanent town.
Much can be said about settlement pattern in the core and beyond. Much depends on the nature of the ground available and the food resources found there. I can't comment on an appropriate pattern for this situation until we know more of the surroundings. It will be something in between ICS and OCP is all I can say at the moment. (Acronym test for the lurkers
)I suggested mining the BG first and am beginning to see why that's a mistake here. I've done a few calculations in my head and I'd just like to be sure I've got the math straight on what we get out of the BG. If we mine first, we get the dinghy in 7, but no gold until turn 11. If we road first, we get the dingy in 8, but an additional 6 gold in the bargain. Is that right?
Phaedo
Emperor
I think you are right by mu calculations Aabra. But remember the city square will give us 1gpt towards research. So assuming we keep the citizen on the BG from the get go (although Elephantium's suggestion of going for the lake for the three turns it takes to road the BG is much better), If we mine first, we get the currah with a total of 7g going towards our research. If we road first, by turn 7 we don't yet get the dinghy but we will have had 11g go towards research moving up to 14g next turn when we build the dinghy. A total of 6 more gold to our research. Remeber that we are gong for the slingshot so gold is at a premium for us. I think if we were going for an early military rush (maybe if we were the sumerians orMayians for example), or if we wanted a gran as fast as possible, getting the extra shield earlier would be more important to us.
@choxorn, I don't think so but then I have been wrong before but I'm not sure it matters. What I do know for sure is that food comes before shields, which does.
The plan appears to take shape. Settle in place, put the citizen to fishing. If we do that it doesn't matter whether we road or mine the grass first as we will get the second citizen after the worker finishes roading and mining the bonus grass. We will have met one of the first criteria of successful micromanagement - always have the citizens working the highest yield fields. The lake is output 4 (2g2f) the unimproved bonus grass is output 3 (2f1s). We will also meet one of my favorite goals as well, which is to have fields fully improved when there is a citizen to work them.
As I said before the odd gold piece should take precedence over the odd shield, for this situation. Phaedo is correct when he says the an early military rush would alter those priorities.
And the consensus opinion seems to be that Writing comes before anything else. I would not hoard either Writing or Alphabet when the opportunity arises to trade them. It would be really optimal if someone would research Code of Laws for us, and we trade Philosophy for it the instant we learn Philosophy. To make that work someone else in the world will have to know how to write.
And a reminder - be alert and ready to adjust the sliders on or just before the growth turn if we don't have an MP in place. Losing a turn of commerce to either a clown or a riot will put us out of the hunt. It is that close. You get one content citizen at this level so the first new citizen will put us over the edge and the game will make that next citizen a clown on growth regardless of what your governor setting may be.
The plan appears to take shape. Settle in place, put the citizen to fishing. If we do that it doesn't matter whether we road or mine the grass first as we will get the second citizen after the worker finishes roading and mining the bonus grass. We will have met one of the first criteria of successful micromanagement - always have the citizens working the highest yield fields. The lake is output 4 (2g2f) the unimproved bonus grass is output 3 (2f1s). We will also meet one of my favorite goals as well, which is to have fields fully improved when there is a citizen to work them.
As I said before the odd gold piece should take precedence over the odd shield, for this situation. Phaedo is correct when he says the an early military rush would alter those priorities.
And the consensus opinion seems to be that Writing comes before anything else. I would not hoard either Writing or Alphabet when the opportunity arises to trade them. It would be really optimal if someone would research Code of Laws for us, and we trade Philosophy for it the instant we learn Philosophy. To make that work someone else in the world will have to know how to write.
And a reminder - be alert and ready to adjust the sliders on or just before the growth turn if we don't have an MP in place. Losing a turn of commerce to either a clown or a riot will put us out of the hunt. It is that close. You get one content citizen at this level so the first new citizen will put us over the edge and the game will make that next citizen a clown on growth regardless of what your governor setting may be.
Beorn-eL-Feared
Idiot riding pedals
lurker's comment: I'm pretty sure food comes first, then commerce (and techs), then shields last (along with the wonder prebuild cascade trick). My .02 with mister monk.
Yes please. If a trade comes up on the AI's turn take a picture of the offer then refuse it then save the game and post. I would like an opportunity to look at the screen and suggest some variablesw to consider before proceeding.
My comment was only in preparation for what some might think a "wrong" move in the future.
My comment was only in preparation for what some might think a "wrong" move in the future.
lurker's comment: I thought that the riot didn't happen until one turn after growth- but maybe that's not so on C3C... I don't know...
Just ran a little test - when you start with one "content" citizen in the growth phase the governor makes a clown out of the second citizen regardless of the governor settings. If you set the slider to 10% lux one turn prior you still get a clown and if you set it to 20% you get a new content citizen assigned to a high food high production square again regardless of the governor settings and you will lose beakers. If you leave the science alone and manually reassign the citizens to the lake and the now mined/roaded bonus grass you will keep up the pace of beaker collection.
The point of all this is that you get no "grace period" when you have only two citizens and the first one is merely content. And it is better for the science rate if you reset the slider on the turn after and then reassign the citizens accordingly. And by working the lake and now roaded and mined grassland you can keep the slider at 10% rather than 20% and still have two content citizens and a curragh on turn 11.
The point of all this is that you get no "grace period" when you have only two citizens and the first one is merely content. And it is better for the science rate if you reset the slider on the turn after and then reassign the citizens accordingly. And by working the lake and now roaded and mined grassland you can keep the slider at 10% rather than 20% and still have two content citizens and a curragh on turn 11.
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