Adding Canada to the civ world

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@Valka D'ur

I would like to see Canada in Civ, but I'm pretty sure some of theose inventions were not Canadian.

The Scottish invented the telephone and the TV.
And didn't Edison invent the lightbulb? (his dad was born in Canada, but he was American)
 
No problem with Canada being included (although inventing basketball hardly justifies the inclusion of a country as a great civilization - football, maybe; basketball, no way)
 
Truronian said:
@Valka D'ur

I would like to see Canada in Civ, but I'm pretty sure some of theose inventions were not Canadian.

The Scottish invented the telephone and the TV.
And didn't Edison invent the lightbulb? (his dad was born in Canada, but he was American)

Alexander Graham Bell invented the telephone, and he was Scottish, however he invented it while living in Canada and the US. He is even buried in Canada, near his home in Cape Breton.
 
Nyvin said:
I'd have to agree that Canada definately got to where it is today by suckering up to Britain and the US. They're the only reason Canada is a trillion dollar economy, and without them they probably wouldn't be here right now.

I dissagree, The reason Canada is a trillion dollar economy is because it has a lot of landmass and therefore, a lot of resources that can be sold to other countries.

And they have a fair way to administrate resources and the profits won by selling them. Yeah, I know, the administration could be better, but look around. Other countries also have resources but the people living in those countries don´t benefit from the profits because of bad (in my opinion) governments.

Having a good economy due to the possesion of large amounts of resources is nothing to be proud of, IMHO. I'd rather admire countries that are at the top without having any resources at all, just hard work and fairly good governments (Japan, South Korea) That's why those are in C3C.
 
Wasn't it an Italian, Antonio Meucci, who invented the telephone (as many now accept to indeed be the case). And I think the US Supreme Court sued Bell over its patent.
 
There are several claims to the telephone, but Bell is most famous, and so he tends to recieve credit
 
Valka D'Ur said:
I've noticed that quite a few American posters here keep sneering at the fact that Canada has officially existed as Canada for a relatively short time in comparison to other countries, and is therefore unworthy. I wished to point out that we have a LONG history that occurred before becoming an "official" country, and it is worthy of being acknowledged.

The youth of Canada is only ONE of the reasons people have against Canada becoming a Civ. I know everyone wants to play as their country in the Game. However, I think it would lead Civ astray to focus on the 5th, 6th, 7th most influential civs in the persent day versus the most influencent in history.

If you only acknowledge your history that happened on or after some piece of paper was signed, then your own history of the Pilgrims and Roanoake should surely be considered of no importance in their influence on your development as a country and culture.


You misunderstand the influence of a single page of paper. When a nation becomes independent, it has its own influence. When Nations foreign policies are governed by another (Britian), Britian has the influence.

No real impact...What are you using to read by at night? A light bulb, right? A Canadian invented that.

Do you know anybody who's a diabetic? A Canadian team of researchers came up with the process whereby diabetics get the proper amounts of insulin they need to survive.

What do you use to talk to people besides the 'Net? A telephone--another Canadian invention.

A Canadian invented the heart pacemaker, which came in handy for people who would otherwise have died.


The first pacemaker implanted was made in Sweden.
http://www.thebakken.org/artifacts/Elmqvist.htm

You use a zipper to fasten your pants shut, correct? Thank a Canadian for that.

This was an American Idea as well. The first patented holder designed it in 1851.

http://www.ideafinder.com/history/inventions/zipper.htm


Watch a basketball game on TV? Both of those are Canadian inventions.

First practical TV, with images, long distance was invented by Bell Telephone in 1927.
http://inventors.about.com/library/inventors/bl_television_timeline.htm

Basketball was invented by a Canadian, you are correct.

And the list goes on...just imagine how history could have been different if some of those inventions hadn't been made--in alternate history SF it's called the "butterfly effect"--by removing a seemingly insignificant part of history, the future is changed. Think about that, before you sneer.
#1 Any civilization can claim a few inventions. But that doesnt mean they have culture or influence. One of the reasons America is in the Game is because it DOES have influence. I was in Europe last summer. While a lot of people did not like things America was doing, who's music were they listening to? (At least 7 of the 10 songs on the Euro Top 10 were AMERICAN). What movies were they watching? Ones produced by American Companies. What Restuarants did they go to? Frequently, American ones. There were American Brand names and Brands that looked "American" such as "American Soda" (which Ive never heard of here), Texas & Hawaiian Styled Pizza .

While many people will claim they want less American Cultural domination (Such as the French) when push comes to shove they actually do WANT it.

Think about that, before you sneer.

I look at everything levelly and logically and give credit where it is due. Apparently you can not do the same when only 2 of the 8 inventions you talked about were ACTUALLY Canadian.

#2 I am unsure how many of the "Canadian Inventions" were actually CANADIAN.

No real impact...What are you using to read by at night? A light bulb, right? A Canadian invented that.
Edison was an American.

Do you know anybody who's a diabetic? A Canadian team of researchers came up with the process whereby diabetics get the proper amounts of insulin they need to survive.


While the first appliance of insulin came from a Canadian, many other advances were made by other nations.
http://www.diabetes.ca/Section_About/timeline.asp

What do you use to talk to people besides the 'Net? A telephone--another Canadian invention.
Alexander Graham Bell, telephone inventor was a Scotish Born American.

The internet was developed by the US Military to increase servivablity in post nuclear world.
http://www.isoc.org/internet/history/cerf.shtml
 
Truronian said:
The reason Canada is a trillion dollar economy is because it is large and abundant in natural resources. If they aren't a world power currently, then why are they included in the G8 summits.

And saying they haven't got a unique culture is weak. After all the US culture is just a mix of British, Latin and African American cultures.

They aren't a trillion dollar economy just because of their resources, it's because of the good foreign trade markets they have, if you only have a population of thirty or so million, you have to have something to 'do' with the resources too. Canada is basically looked at as a supplier of raw material for the most part, something that could be done by any group of bozo's that went in there, or some other country that decided to invade, course that won't happen thanks to Britain in the past and US nowadays.

And they don't have any unique culture, it's like an expansion of Brittish (and French) culture with some American influence. If a country expands and it's people generally move into some other area most likely they'll retain their national identity and culture, this is what happened in Canada, note the faces on your coins...

The USA is different in that it actually did go through different national identity developments to make it into a culture of it's own, wars, the wild west, the civil war, and patriotage. America hardly has anything in common with brittish culture other then both speak english, a very large gap has developed between the two. The US also has so many different ethnic groups that it's impossible to say just one is the 'core' of the culture.
 
When I read Nyvin's post, I nearly dropped my crepes into my blood pudding (having only french and english culture, here, we rarely eat anything else!). I was just so shocked at the incredible aptitude with which Nyvin was able to describe the canadian condition, I felt the need to write in and applaud him. Let's take a an unbiased perouse of the current state of Canada, shall we?

...Canada is basically looked at as a supplier of raw material for the most part, something that could be done by any group of bozo's that went in there, or some other country that decided to invade, course that won't happen thanks to Britain in the past and US nowadays.

How absolutely true! Our trillion dollar beaver pelt, lobster and lodgepole pine industries are the only real thing that keeps this country afloat. Our bozo ancestors certainly were lucky to fall onto this landmass while looking for the great US of A. If only we had a large manufacturing and telecomunications industries and financial services industries! Why then we'd have one of the most complex and successful economies in the world..oh well, a canuck can dream! And we can always take comfort in the fact that if the great white north were ever attacked, our american neighbours would be here lickity-split to defend us, seeing as the vast majority of americans know exactly where Canada is on the globe

And they don't have any unique culture, it's like an expansion of Brittish (and French) culture with some American influence. If a country expands and it's people generally move into some other area most likely they'll retain their national identity and culture, this is what happened in Canada, note the faces on your coins...

How true! It's an odd peculiarity that in the 138 years tha Canada has existed as a country (and the 400 years since the first colonization) Canada has received absolutely no immigrants from countries other than France and England. It's good thing too, because welcoming large amounts of people from eastern europe, africa, asia, india and the middle east might add thier own flavour to this country, perhaps even creating a unique culture not based on race or ethnicity. As Nyvin pointed out, the Queen is still on our coins, which still remains a symbol of our close-minded, xenophobic culture based on british colonial power.

The USA is different in that it actually did go through different national identity developments to make it into a culture of it's own, wars, the wild west, the civil war, and patriotage.

It's true! Canada has developed nothing since 1867! This made possible by a few simple facts:

(1)We have participated in no wars since our independence (and certainly none before! I heard a rumour once about Canadians capturing Washington and burning the whitehouse down, but that notion is just plain ridiculous!). We certainly didn't participate in any world wars, develop a national identity from them, and create an army of peacekeepers known the world 'round. No, we canucks prefer to stick our fingers in our ears, and wait until the fighting calms down...

(2) We still haven't spread across the west! Yep, nothing but prairie between Toronto and Vancouver. Boy, if we had, we'd have had to have built one of the largest railways of all time, found cities, and create a whole new Canadian way of life! We're simply not up to that...Oh well, at least we have a place to put all those resources!

(3) We have had no social movements of our own! No suffrage, no repatriation of our constiution, no human rights code, no creation of social programs! Yep, not much at all has changed since we got off the boat...

America hardly has anything in common with brittish culture other then both speak english, a very large gap has developed between the two. The US also has so many different ethnic groups that it's impossible to say just one is the 'core' of the culture.

Like I said before, we keep it pretty caucasian up here...matches the snow and all, eh? And it's pretty obvious by now that the US and Britain have nothing in common. I mean, it's not like you're a part of some coalition together or something! Canadians have much more in common with Britain. I mean, there's that chick on our money, right? Oh, and all those extra u's we put in all those words where they don't belong! Silly Canadians!

Nyvin, seeing as you live so close to our poor, backwards country, I mean colony, I was wondering if you could do us a favour: please prepare us a care package of american culture so we can finally live with a culture vastly superior to our own! Please include cans of Coke, Britney Spears CD's, cartons of Lucky Strikes and tapes of Rush Limbaugh. With those in our hands, hopefully we can start to develop something of a culture of our own.

Since we don't have any postal system, you may have to drive it up to us! Just cross Lake Michigan, and head north. We're not too hard to find. If you do happen to cross into a country with a vibrant diverse and unique culture, with a successful economy, world-class social system, and enviable living standards, just keep going....that isn't Canada. ;)
 
ROFLXZ, this thread went from thinking about adding Canada to Civ IV to that and why Canada and the states are so great.
 
If we go by the poles that were taken by this site, North Americans buy 52.5% of the Civ games. The USA is 9 times the population of Canada, so a rough estimate would be 11% of 52.5% is about 6% Canadian purchases.

I can see that the American Civ is in the game because 46% of all the Civ games sold were to Americans, so they have to be in the game to satisfy the installed base.

Canadians account for 6% of all the Civ games sold and that would account for about one in seventeen of all Civ games sold, there are only 18 or 19 civs in the game.

So just going on sales, if you what to disregard the Civs that should be there (like the Celts and the Vikings and the Maya and the Sumerians, etc...), then the Canadians could be there for the same reason as the Americans.

Yeck, with this logic, there should be more than one American Civ (Maybe 8 or 9 American Civs, if we go buy sales). :D
 
weelll it should be why Canada should be in civ, but everyone calmed down and thought 'nah, not happening' so we were all talking about Canada and Civviness and then it became 'convince the americans that Canada is a country' (does not apply to all americans).
 
I think if we added Canada to Civ4 it could bring two outcomes.

Bad Outcome:
Would anybody really be that interested in a Canadian civilization?

Good Outcome:
For conservatives, they would be a new war toy.

Am I right?
 
I am the Future said:
forgot to mention that i think i will replace the iriquois or zulu with canada.
Yeah and lets replace china with iceland, and england with inbreed hicks. Even though I think Iroquois are an appeasement their are 10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000......million civlization more worthy than Canada. I would question if Canada will even be remember by historians as something besides America's parking lot. Ok Canada has some technological contributions over the last 100 and some odd years but has no culture of its own(with the exception of Quebec) and one of the weakest armies and lowest military spending as % of capita in the world.
 
If we go by the poles that were taken by this site, North Americans buy 52.5% of the Civ games. The USA is 9 times the population of Canada, so a rough estimate would be 11% of 52.5% is about 6% Canadian purchases.

What about mexico.....:)

LOL at big canadian rant, just feel lucky that they will add two candadian civs before they think about New Zealand.
 
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