Advice Needed!

[commodified]

Hey There-

I just picked up the game recently and I have a few questions for some of the experts who peruse these boards:

1. Is there a consensus as to what the best civilization is? The worst? The best late game? Early game?

2. In what situations is it better to build colonies than build a city near a resource?

3. How can I successfully colonize islands early game (with just galleys)? Even when I send settlers with spearmen to islands/other continents, they seem to grow so slowly.

4. First civilization to get Knights=the civ who's bound to win? This seems true in Chieftain, whether it's me or them.

5. What's the best way to split up commerce/science/luxuries early game? Middle game? Late game?

Thank you all!

 

[Cort Haus]

I dunno about 'expert', but I've played a fair bit and read lots of strategy forums ...

1. Is there a consensus as to what the best civilization is? The worst? The best late game? Early game?

Depends on map size and preferred play style. Japanese, Iroqouis and Aztecs are popular warmonger civs, while Babs and Egyptians are arguably the best builder civs. These five are all Religious, which many feel is the strongest trait.
The Expansionist trait gains power with map size. Poor on small maps, strongest on huge. Militarist is good for warmongers - more promotions to Elite should give more Great Leaders. Germany has a good UU for late-game wars, Japan & China mid game and Iroq/Aztec for early wars. Industrial's quick workers are powerful. Commerce is usually seen as the weakest trait, but maybe more valuable since they beefed up the courthouses.
The fun of Civ 3 is developing strategies for each civ - playing to it's strengths. I've enjoyed playing Egypt, Iroq, Bab, French, Greek, Persian & Zulu. I haven't played the others yet.
The only consensus is about the worst Civ - the English. The only person I ever heard who liked playing the English was Sid Meier.

2. In what situations is it better to build colonies than build a city near a resource?

Almost never, it seems. One poster recently claimed that the AI's have calmed down on swallowing your colonies with their cities but I'll need some persuading.

3. How can I successfully colonize islands early game (with just galleys)? Even when I send settlers with spearmen to islands/other continents, they seem to grow so slowly.

Grow slowly or build slowly? There'll be no irrigation, so if food is scarce use harbours to grow them to six and get them happy with a cheap cathedral if religious or marketplace if 3/4 lux and get a we-love day. Then build courthouse (improved in patch 1.21). Use workers to cut down forests, dispand unwanted units and maybe pop-rush or cash-rush to finish the early improvements.

4. First civilization to get Knights=the civ who's bound to win? This seems true in Chieftain, whether it's me or them.

Tech goes very slowly in Chieftain, so the window of Knight-Power is its largest. At the higher levels muskets soon put a stop to the Knight.

5. What's the best way to split up commerce/science/luxuries early game? Middle game? Late game?

Still getting used to 1.21, but a popular move at higher levels was always to keep tech low (10%) in the early game and buy of the others once they all got it. (not like civ 1/2) At lower levels it may be worth researching more than buying. Expansionist civs on large maps can pop loads of tech with scouts. Mid game is usually a mix of research and trade. The buying power of luxuries can have an impact on tech trading. In the late game many players run 80-100% science, selling new techs for 150-200 gps each per turn to several civs. This money pays the bills and allows maximum science.

 

[commodified]

Hey thanks a lot for your quick help. I forgot to ask another couple of questions:

1. Should you always build your first city exactly where you start? Does waiting a turn or two to build your capital hurt early game?

2. The gap in difficulty for sucky amateurs such as myself seems huge between Chieftain and Warlord. Any general tips for making the jump?

Thanks again!

 

[God]

Originally posted by commodified

1. Should you always build your first city exactly where you start? Does waiting a turn or two to build your capital hurt early game?

I usually build my capital at the starting point. Unless there are some nice resources a bit outside your city radius, I would build where you started. But it all comes down to the terrain around you.

The best civs would be:
Egypt, Babylon for building. Egypt is really good on larger maps because industrious trait really helps out.
For warmongers Japanese, Chinese, and Aztecs are the best. Germans are good too.
Generally the most popular civs are the Persians, Iroquois (both have really good UUs), Egypt and Japan. On Chieften any civ would work well.

On swicthing from Chieften to Warlord. I would move up when you are beating chieften easily. I didn't feel there was much change in strategy for me. On warlord you may not get all the wonders.

To test whether you're ready for warlord, either play a chieften game on a large or huge map and see how you do, or play warlord on a small map. When moving up a level i always play first on a small map. They aren't riducolously tiny but aren't big which would make a harder game.

 

[Shink]

1. Is there a consensus as to what the best civilization is? The worst? The best late game? Early game?

There are so many things to consider when choosing the "best" civ that you really can't go wrong.

My personal opinion is that religious is the single best trait because I build Temples and Cathedrals in every single city. Since I'm the type of player that wins almost always by domination, that's a LOT of shields I save with Religious.

Unique Units (UUs) are also important to consider. No one will debate that the best UU in the game is the Persian Immortal. Combine their traits (Scientific & Industrious) and they are arguably the strongest civilization. The Immortal will walk all over everyone in the ancient era except the Greeks, whose Hoplites are a force to be reckoned with.

To answer your question more directly, I feel the best civilization for a military approach is Persia. I really don't like England, but they could be good on a large or huge map.

2. In what situations is it better to build colonies than build a city near a resource?

I build cities everywhere, so... My answer is "never"

3. How can I successfully colonize islands early game (with just galleys)? Even when I send settlers with spearmen to islands/other continents, they seem to grow so slowly.

Don't! The best advice I can give you is don't focus on growing super duper fast. Just build horsemen and take over enemy civs. The idea is that you don't want any neighbors and you want to control your entire continent. You don't every want to be dependant on other civs for resources and luxuries. Grow as much as you can with settlers early on, but when you start bumping borders, it's time to invade. Much easier to conquer early than later.

4. First civilization to get Knights=the civ who's bound to win? This seems true in Chieftain, whether it's me or them.

I don't agree here. Pikemen are great defenders and you have those by the time you get knights. Greeks already have masses of Hoplites by that time and the Romans have a ton of legions. Musketmen aren't too far off either. The only time you are really truly overpowering is if you have Persian Immortals whose 4 attack dominate everything except Hoplites.

5. What's the best way to split up commerce/science/luxuries early game? Middle game? Late game?

I try to get away with leaving Luxuries at 20% for most of the game. Then I set science to the point where I'm turning the smallest profit possible. You must realize that I'm very much a warmonger though, so your mileage may vary.

My build order in cities is TYPICALLY: 1) Temple, 2) Barracks, 3) Marketplace, 4) Library. In cities that aren't corrupted all to hell, I'll put up Cathedrals, Banks, and Universities as well. My games are usually over before I have to ever build many modern age items.

 

[Shink]

1. Should you always build your first city exactly where you start? Does waiting a turn or two to build your capital hurt early game?

No, but I would restart the game until you end up with a square on a river and no mountains right next to you. River squares provide extra commerce early on that are vital.

2. The gap in difficulty for sucky amateurs such as myself seems huge between Chieftain and Warlord. Any general tips for making the jump?

WARMONGER! Seriously. Try this general tip for standard size maps and 8 enemy civs with Raging barbarians. With your capital city, the first thing you should build is Barracks while researching bronze working if you don't already have it. After bronze working, shoot for getting horseback riding. When the barracks is complete, build a spearman and a warrior. Manually control your worker to improve the 5 best tiles around your capital with a road and mining. Fortify with the first spearman and send the warrior out exploring. Build another spearman and a temple in your capital. At this point in most games your capital city will be size 5 or so and have two veteran spearmen fortified, a barracks, a temple, and a worker exploring. If its smaller in size (i.e. you have crappy food production) then build a granary if you have pottery. The idea from this point on is to build spearman, spearman, settler and send them out to found new cities. I usually finish this cycle in 8 turns (2 turns for each spearman, 1 turn of wealth to coincide with population growth, 1 turn of settler). You want to build the settler just as your cities turns population size 6.

In my new cities (non-capital) I'll build barracks, temple, then start popping out horsemen nonstop. You are going to build a huge army that will crush your neighbors. Congratulations, you are on your way to victory.

 

[No.Dice]

Everybody else covered your questions pretty well. I will say that its worth delaying your first city 1-2 turns to build on a river or over a luxury, so long as you aren't losing a significant amount of bonus grassland, or cattle/wheat resources. Keep in mind your culture will expand in 10 turns due to your palace, claiming back a few squares you may have lost. If you start a tile away from a hill or mountain, move your worker on to it to get a view of the surrounding area, and pick the best spot to settle.

*You never delay your first few settlers. Your goal is to always have a settler pop out on the same turn your city reaches size three. Building your capital up before you begin settler production will slow you down immensely. Assuming grassland, it will take 20 turns for your capitral to grow to size 3, you'll build two warriors first, and then begin a settler, which will settle no farther than 5 (preferably 4) tiles from your capital city. 20 turns later, it produces a settler, and so in this way one city becomes two, becomes 4, 8, and so on.

IMHO, the most important thing for newer players to realize, is that until around 10 AD, you'll be concentrating solely on grabbing land.

If you choose to fight an early war:
Using a dense build will give you a significant early boost, as cities can share the improved tiles. Build your next two cities 1-2 squares away from the capital. The rest are regularly spaced. Stop at 4-6 cities, and begin producing swordsman/archers. If you choose horsemen as your weapon of choice, you'll need easily double the amount of cities. This will work fine (and most likely better) on lower difficulties. On the other end of the difficulty scale you'll find the AI defending with pikemen about the time you're ready to commit, and it'll be game over.

I suggest jumping straight to warlord. Chieftan sets you up with some bad habits since the AI is so ridiculously handicapped. You'll lose a few, but you learn much more from the games you lose.

Shink's build is a bit similiar to something i was experimenting with a while back. I'd use a dense build, the capital would produce a worker, join it to the second city, which would then produce its settler significantly faster. Building the city up before settler production will give you more cities in the long run. Unfortunatly, the long run is too far away, and it ends up being too little too late. Ancient age wars have a relatively small window of success, and once your opponents hit the middle ages, that window slams shut. While on lower levels it may enjoy some success, once you climb the difficulty ladder, you'll hit the wall, as the AI starts entering the middle ages at 850 BC.

Check the war academy and specifically this thread for some useful info. All build orders are just guidelines, as there are too many variables to predict just which way a game will go.

 

[commodified]

Hey guys -

Thanks again for all your help. I'm having a really hard time on Warlord (but then, I'm on a huge map with the max number of rival civs), my main problem being TECH. I set it as high as I can (minimize profit), and I have the largest population so far, but it seems like I'm being quickly outdistanced technologically . Any tips?

I'm Aztec, by the way.

Thanks!

 

[Shink]

Originally posted by commodified
my main problem being TECH. I set it as high as I can (minimize profit), and I have the largest population so far, but it seems like I'm being quickly outdistanced technologically . Any tips?

I'm Aztec, by the way.

Thanks!

Okay, I understand the problem. The expansionist civs will send out scouts and gain a ton of techs from barbarian huts. As the Aztecs, however, you can do the same thing! Send out your Jaguar Warriors (2 movement points) and steal goodie huts as well. You won't get as much tech as the Expansionist civs because they get more "positive" outcomes from the encounters and start off with a scout, but you will get plenty enough to stay close enough. Falling behind in tech during the ancient era isn't really that bad of a thing. You can purchase techs from neighbors relatively cheaply or get all of them from the Great Library.

 

[No.Dice]

If you haven't yet, you should download and install the latest patch (1.21f). You should be able to find it about halfway down the civfanatics main page, or in the downloads section.

Its worth mentioning that you have to trade/buy technology with the AI frequently. If you try to research everything yourself you'll fall behind.

Trying to predict which branch of the tech tree the AI is focusing on can be useful too. For instance, in patch 1.21, the AI will often pick up theology (after the scientific civs trade away monotheism) first. By research engineering first, you can trade it around to your rivals for any techs you may have missed. This is still a bit too early (IMO) to be doing your own research, a more viable example may be picking up metallurgy while the AI is working on physics/navigation.

Some players set their science to 0% and simply buy their technology until the late middle-early industrial ages. Before patch 1.21, this was the best way of doing things. Supposedly 1.21 alleviated the rapid tech devaluation a bit, and made early research somewhat worthwhile again. From what i can see, this isn't the case, and the fastest/cheapest way to acquire technology in the early stages of the game is to simply buy it. Once your cities are productive enough to complete libraries/universities and still maintain a large military is a good time to start doing some of your own research. Some player's views may differ though.

If you're more powerful than some of your rivals, you can choose to extort technology and money. Check the histograph (f11, or click the H in the bottom right corner of the screen) and flip the drop down menu to view power. Contact a civ that is a good deal weaker than you. Once you've initiated diplomacy with the desired civ, click active on the very bottom of the window, and select peace treaty. Often you can negotiate money, or technology at a reduced price from your rival, to avoid conflict. You will not take a reputation hit as long you don't initiate war with that civ before the peace agreement has expired (20 turns).

You can't always count on being in this position, but its a useful tool to take advantage of when the situation is right.

Hope this helped.