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AG - Discussion thread

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Succession Games' started by Aggie, Feb 27, 2004.

  1. Aggie

    Aggie Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2002
    Messages:
    6,278
    Location:
    Amsterdam, Netherlands
    My SG history

    1. PAD1 - Arabian Knights (regent) - My first SG, but I didn't see the end of it. Lacking SG experience and skill I quit the game and everyone was happy. I see now that this was my first SG with Nad :eek:

    2. Warmonger's delight (AW) regent - First SG of the Nad-series. Fantastic game where my SG friendship with Nad and Melifluous started. Somewhere halfway of the SG Grimjack asked to join. He was unknown adn we didn't know how he would do. He rocked :)

    3. CG4 - The Warmongering Greeks (monarch) Another shaky game. Abandoned because we were not doing well.

    4. CG5 - The Warmonger's revenge - Ottomans (emperor) A week later the same team tried the domination game on emperor. And we succeeded.

    5. K8 - 362x362 map (emperor)- My first ultra big map. Slow progress, a lot of crashes. But we got the UN vote (Killer, Stapel, Borealis)

    6. HOT3 - Ottoman (deity) One of my favorites. My first deity SG and we managed to win with a team of deity newbies (Hotrod, Jack Merchant, Borealis, swiftsure). At one point we were an age behind, but managed to launch nevertheless.

    7. Block's Berzerkers (monarch) A nice little domination game where we never saw the day of the berzerks. This game finished in a week! Fond memories of my first finish with Lt. Killer M, Stapel and Jack Merchant.

    8. CG6 - Coalition time (emperor) Another game in the CG series. Again with Jack Merchant and my first game with T-Hawk. I played before him in the roster :smoke: And learned a lot.

    9. CG7 - Deity attempt - My 2nd deity SG and things went a whole lot smoother.

    10. Phase Wars - OCC to domination (emperor) - Nad's 2nd brilliant SG. Obviously with Melifluous and also with Jack Merchant, Grimjack, kryszcztov. Great team and very exciting game.

    11. European Berzerkers (deity) - Same team as the first berzerker SG, including anarres. Sadly not finished, while in a challenging phase.

    12. HOT5 - Who needs iron (emperor) - My 2nd Hotrod game. We were Zulu and iron was not available. We blew the AI from the map. Also with Bam-Bam and Banzai.

    13. HOT6 - Space Race (emperor) - Basically a Space Race and not too difficult to win.

    14. HOT7 - Rise of the Impi (emperor) - HOT5 was too easy and now we were the only civ without iron. Still no real challenge for a great team (Hotrod, Bam-bam, Banzai, Rubberjello).

    15. MELIKILLER1 (emperor) - The intention was a tough domination game, but the team was too strong!

    16. Non Midas Tough (deity) - Another special Nad SG. We lost it, but it was a great game nontheless.

    17. China isolationism - Monarch variant with super team. What do you think happened? (yndy, meldor, hotrod, grimjack, ChrTh)

    18. LK54 - Tiny deity - My first LK game. A lot tougher than expected. Awesome game with awesome team (LKendter, Yndy, ChrTh, Ridgelake)

    19. Chamber of Secrets (emperor) - This game was absolute madness and one of my favorites. Eratic moods of our leader forced us to declare war on the world or make peace according to mathematics. Fond memories of the team (Nad, Jack Merchant, Melifluous, ControlFreak, Stuck as a Mac, mad-bax)

    20. RBC6 - Scrappy Sumerians (demigod) - Space Race with a twist. Easy win. But a lot of fun.

    21. RBC7 - Austrian Fascists (demigod) - One of the funnest turns ever for me was the conquest of the entire Ottoman empire in 8 turns.

    22. LK59 - Simply deity - Straightforward C3C deity game with a great team (LKendter, mad-bax, Grimjack, T-Hawk).

    23. RBC12F - Fall of Rome Ostrogoths (demigod) - My first conquests scenario SG. It was good to play a game with Jack Merchant again.

    24. Non midas rematch (deity) - We were crushed in our first attempt, but the 2nd one was a big success. Almost too easy. Great team and my first SG with Greebley and betazed.

    25. RBC12A Fall of Rome Vizigoths (deity) - Another conquests scenario with a great team (Charis, Arathorn, Nad, LKendter)

    26. Fall of Rome - Eastern Rome - Fall of Rome variant as Eastern Rome. Nailbiting stuff with great players (Charis, Arathorn, Justus II, Rubberjello)

    27. RBC11 - Cultural Communists (emperor) - Exploring the communist government in C3C. The team was too strong for emperor (Charis, JMB, Dwip, Ridgelake, Lord all Mighty)

    28. LK60 - Slow moving civ (demigod) - Very interesting game with a great team (LKendter, T-Hawk, Rubberjello, Hotrod)

    29. AG1 - I dream of dromons (deity) - The first of my SG series. Intention was to test the strength of the dromon, but we ended in the modern age and took naval warfare to the extremene. A nailbiter until the finish and one of my favorites.

    30. AG2 - Democracy warfare (deity) - Somehow we ended up with a lost game around the time of Democracy.

    31. AG3 - Ultra Big Map - 362x362 map, 31 civs, conquest victory. That sums it up. Interturn of 3 hours... An insane game but very very much fun (only once though).

    32. AG4 - OCCC Regent - My first OCC SG. Conquest on regent proved to be too easy! We finished it in two days.

    33. AG5 - Honorable Space Race (demigod) - Honorable rules game that turned out to be less challenging than expected.

    34. AG6 - OCC Space (monarch) - Fun OCC with great discussions.

    35. LK62 - Fast moving civ (demigod) - Nice little game with tensed end, being very backward but still managing to win domination.

    36. RBC13E - Middle Ages (danes deity) - Nice conquests scenario game, but not very difficult.

    37. MELI1 - 5CC AW (monarch) - One of the few Always War games I have played. Melifluous initiated the game, but the team was mainly betazed, Greebley, Kuningas. Very very fun game, except for the barbarians!

    38. AG7 - Democarcy warfare on deity - Revenge of the AG2 loss. This time we didn't have to fight a lot in democracy. The game was over just after we switched to democracy.

    39. AG8 - Let's try Sid - My first Sid SG and we won it! Easily one of my favorites with a great team (anarres, Greebley, Nad, Ted Jackson)

    40. AG9 - OCC Conquest (monarch) - Follow up of AG4. It took us more time, but we were never worried about the outcome. Great game nevertheless.

    41. RBC14F Age of dicscovery Maya (deity) - Fun conqeust scenario, but never challenging.

    42. RBC14B - Age of discovery (Dutch deity) - Conquest scenario with a European civ. Also easy.

    43. 5CC Conquest (deity) - Another one of Nad's great SG's. Very difficult start, but we managed to win gloriously (Nad, gozpel, Greebley, hotrod).

    44. Space 2 - Dutch deity - A very nice game, but I had to drop out of it due to a very busy SG schedule.

    45. MIC1 No research (emperor) - Microbe's first SG. We managed to go to space in style.

    46. MIC2 - Chinese riders domination (emperor) - Fun SG, but the end was always clear.

    47. AG10 - OCC Conquest (emperor) - After regent and monarch we had to try emperor. We won it just before 2050 AD. One of my favorites. Who said that OCC's are boring?

    48. AG11 - Solo warfare with AI tactics (deity) - Intended to seriously limit the warfare tactics. This was a rough game. We weren't able to counter a cultural threat of the runaway civ and overestimated the strength of military without artillery. So we lost.

    49. AG12 - Sid Space Race - We experienced the mother of all tech holes. In the end we captured the Great Library and got level, but too late. Fun nevertheless.

    50. 5CC Conquest (deity) - No bombers and no armies. We never recovered from an aweful starting spot and lost big time.

    51. cMM1 - 5CC conquest (deity) - another 5CCC, no only without bombers. The AI never knew what hit them. We were able to have the intitiative troughout the game.

    52. Defiant Sid - Very fun game. Heated debates and tough. We had a couple of nailbiting situations and managed to surive a Sid dogpile. After getting our first leader we were almost certain to win it.

    53. No settlers (deity) - Another Nad game, so sure to be an exciting one. But with excellent play at the start the outcome was always going to be a win.

    54. RBC15E Napoleon (Spain - demigod) - Another conquests scenario. Another easy win.

    55. AG13 - OCC Demigod - Taking it a step further than the OCC Emperor game AG10. We succeeded. And convincingly! Another OCC Conquest win.

    56. AG14 - Sid Space Race, the revenge - AG12 was a 'terrible' loss. I wanted a rematch. Standard sized map, rest random. We did very well, but the Ottomans did better. They were on their way to a culture win and were unstoppable for us. So we decided to end it and call it a loss.

    57. MM2 - Aggressive Athenians AWM OCC - All bets were against us, but we had a great team, a great start and we pulled it off! (Mark1031, akots, Greebley, Bed_head7).

    58. AG15 - I dream of Dromons again - deity variant - I wanted to try my first SG theme again. But with the aim to win before we enter the IA. I had to end it due to lack of time to play civ... And we lost the Lighthouse race, which made the game almost unwinnable.

    59. MM3: One city smackdown. AWE-OCC - MM2 was crazy? What about AWE - OCC??? Well, we lost the game very fast.

    60. AG16-OCC Deity - Soft OCC on deity, preferred wins are Space or Conquest. We managed to blow our chances by missing out on the Great Library and not much later we were invaded by the Celts and lost. No chance.

    61. MM4: 6CCC Sid - Soft 6 City Challenge on Sid. We wanted to win by conquest and use the Byzantine dromons for this. I had to drop out after the deciding phase of the game. The team managed to pull out a win :)

    My favorite SG's
    1. AG8 - Let's try Sid (nr 39)
    2. HOT3 - Ottoman deity (nr 6)
    3. Chambers of Secrets (nr 19)
    4. AG1 - I dream of Dromons (nr 29)
    5. MELI1 - 5CC AW (nr 37)
    6. LK54 - Tiny Deity (nr 18)
    7. AG3 - Ultra Big Map (nr 31)
    8. 5 vs the world part 1 (nr 43)
    9. AG10 - OCC Conquest emperor (nr 47)
    10. MM2 - Aggressive Athenians - AWM OCC (nr 57)
    11. Warmonger's delight (nr 2)
    12 . MM1 - Defiant Sid (nr 52)
    13. AG13 - OCC Conquest demigod (nr 55)

    People I played with
    Nad 13
    Jack Merchant 13
    Greebley 12
    CarlosMM 12
    microbe 11
    Melifluous 10
    Grimjack 9
    Stuck as a Mac 9
    LKendter 8
    Hotrod 8
    Mark1031 7
    Rubberjello 7
    Betazed 6
    Stapel 6
    Charis 5
    gozpel 5
    Yom 5
    anarres 4
    Barbslinger 4
    6thgentexan 4
    Mad-Bax 4
    Cgannon64 4
    Swiftsure 4
    grs 4
    Bed_head7 4
    Akots 3
    T-Hawk 3
    Borealis 3
    Ridgelake 3
    TedJackson 3
    Cromagnon 3
    Doc Tsiolkovski 2
    Arathorn 2
    T_McC 2
    Kylearan 2
    meldor 2
    Dwip 2
    Foresight 2
    homeyg 2
    Yndy 2
    ChrTh 2
    Rowain deWolf 2
    Coffee 2
    Shillen 2
    kryszczov 2
    Bam-Bam 2
    Gyathaar 2
    ThERat 2
    Skyfish 1
    Speaker 1
    Bede 1
    mitsho 1
    Griselda 1
    ControlFreak 1
    Civ General 1
    Shadow Dragon 1
    Sultan Bhargash 1
    Datsekkar 1
    Banzai 1
    Sir Eric 1
    Wildfire 1
    DrAlimentado 1
    Kabuki 1
    Elvis1985 1
    Lord all Mighty 1
    JMB 1
    Justus II 1
    yoshi74 1
    Caesar Agaustus 1
    Kuningas 1
    Corrado 1
    Ankka 1
    A Space Oddity 1
    Nothern Pike 1
    Conehead 1
    Karasu 1
    grahamian 1
    Tarkeel 1
    Code Stejans 1
    Sir Bugsy 1
    Beam 1
    chenglian 1
    Chieftess 1
    Percy 1
    dl123654 1


    Favorite players
    I can name at least 20 favorite players. But I'm not going to list them or rank them. I would certainly forget a name or two. The list above can't be directly translated to my favorite player list, because I had great games with players that simply didn't have the opportunity to play a lot of games I was in. But it's safe to say that I did play a lot with certain people for a reason and that a lot of my favorite players played in my favorite games. Then again, I can count the players I didn't like that much on the fingers of one hand. I probably would have ended playing CIV3 a lot sooner if it weren't for the SG and PBEM community. Thank you all for a great CIV3 experience and I might come back when CIV4 arrives, but probably not...
     
  2. Kylearan

    Kylearan compound eye

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    Won't that lead to some kind of always war in the worst case? You declare on non-democracies. During the war, they surely won't switch to democracy, so you cannot make peace with them. But they probably will buy other democracies into the war against you, which in turn may force these AIs to leave democracy (assuming the AI WW bug won't kick in), which will prevent you from making peace with them...which will throw you out of democracy rather sooner than later. ;-)

    -Kylearan
     
  3. Nad

    Nad Known Troublemaker

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    Aggie, I wouldn't want to start another game until we finish AG1 but I would definitely like to play a "simply Sid" SG...in fact, I've been thinking of starting one myself, but if you're doing it I'll join, as long as it's after AG1 has finished (or nearly finished)! :)
     
  4. Aggie

    Aggie Chieftain

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    To answer Kylearan's question: My intention indeed is to get into a near AW type of game as from the late middle ages. I came up with this idea in search of a trigger-event. You are correct that in this variant one runs the risk of being thrown out of democracy. Democracy is a bad AW government and communism/fascism are more obvious choices for such an approach. However, this is later in the game than I would like it. So I am open for suggestions. The intention is to have a lot of long wars as from the late middle ages on deity.

    @Nad: I will gladly wait for the (near) end of AG1, since I like you to join that SG :)
     
  5. Doc Tsiolkovski

    Doc Tsiolkovski Deity

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    Köln, Cologne, Colonia. Finally.
    :D The Civ of choice for 1) is pretty obvious: America!
     
  6. Rubberjello

    Rubberjello Chieftain

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    ...especially if there is a certain "Shrub Jr." as the leaderhead! :p
     
  7. Aggie

    Aggie Chieftain

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    @Doc Tsiolkovski, Rubberjello: are you showing interest for this one?

    America would be a good choice I guess :D
     
  8. Greebley

    Greebley Chieftain Supporter

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    Aggie,
    I don't think your Democracy idea works. Democracy is the one government that can't war too long. I am guessing you will spend more time in Anarchy than Democracy as your WW will keep overthrowing the Govt. My guess is you will have a single turn of Democracy once WW gets high enough.

    You might be able to do this if you altered Demoacracy to have minimal WW. I won't be able to join you due to having already joined more than I should :(
     
  9. Doc Tsiolkovski

    Doc Tsiolkovski Deity

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    Location:
    Köln, Cologne, Colonia. Finally.
    Well, Democracy has become my Governement of choice for wars since all AI Civs immediatedly switch to Fascism; war is the only reason to revolt from Republic due to the easier unit support.

    The big problem is the Variant Rule forcing you to actually declare...as in RL, you have to make sure the public opinion believes you are not the aggressor.

    If the rules were something like "You have to be at war with at least one non-representative Gov for the rest of the game as soon as you are in Republic", but allow even alliances with any other Civ, it should work well.
     
  10. carlosMM

    carlosMM Chieftain

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    I'd be interested in all 4.... :)
     
  11. Aggie

    Aggie Chieftain

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    Hi Carlos, welcome :)

    Doc Tsiolkovski, I don't plan to mod the government. But I see your point. What about:

    "as soon as a non-democracy/republic/anarchy civ declares war on another civ, we jump in and save the day when all the deals with the agressor are gone :) We may make peace again when the aggressor makes peace with all civs it attacked/was at war with. We remain in Democracy however, unless things are really ugly. Then we may revolt to Republic. But we must get back into Democracy asap".

    So instead attacking all civs with a bad government we only attack the aggresive ones.
     
  12. Greebley

    Greebley Chieftain Supporter

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    Or just stay in Democracy until your government is overthrown and you go into Anarchy. At that point you can choose republic until peace rather than goving back to Democracy.

    (Or have they taken that little feature out of conquests? I am correct that enough WW in a Democracy causes anarchy, right?)
     
  13. Aggie

    Aggie Chieftain

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    @Greebly, that is what I mean to say. But after peace is declared we should go back to Democracy (that's what I mean with asap).
     
  14. jack merchant

    jack merchant Internationalist

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    1# sounds nice to me (we'll just have to wipe out the opposition quickly :D ), maybe with the proviso that republic becomes an option if WW forces us to up luxes to over 50%.

    I'm not interested in #2 (AFAIK the honourable rules don''t allow war declarations, which is an instant turnoff for me) or #4 (my computer isn't up to running any kind of huge map). #3 may be an option, but I'm not sure I'm even all that interested in beating Sid. It may be genuinely above my play level (or level of concentration required for the turns ) but even if it isn't, it seems to me that at that level Civ becomes more like a science than an art or a game, and that's not something I really enjoy.

    Start any of them when you're ready - in the meantime, I have a solo AWE game to play (which, to be sure, I'm not treating like a science - I'm curious to see which way I'm going to lose though !)!
     
  15. Aggie

    Aggie Chieftain

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    Good that makes the following:

    1. Democracy rules the world
    -Aggie
    -CarlosMM
    -Jack Merchant
    -Stapel
    -Melifluous
    -Doc Tsiolkovski???

    Rubberjello and Kylearan: are you interested?

    2. Honourable
    -Aggie
    -CarlosMM

    3. Sid (for a little later)
    -Aggie
    -CarlosMM
    -Nad
    -Jack Merchant as a maybe
    -Skyfish

    4. Ultra map
    -Aggie
    -CarlosMM

    I think I will start the Democracy game soon. Near the end of AG1 I will also start the Sid level game. For the other two at least two others should show interest.

    @Jack: I don't want to play a Sid game as a 'science'. I want to see how far a good team can get with the skills they have. And I want us to have fun :)

    Making Republic an option with ww > 50% is ok to me. But who wants to switch governments more than twice in a game ;) (no I don't want to play as religious...)
     
  16. jack merchant

    jack merchant Internationalist

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    Your point about the science is well-taken, however, it does seem like that approach to playing Sid would be required for a win. And we do want to have a fighting chance, don't we ? ;)

    Re the WW, it's obviously going to be worse in deity due to the number of units likely to be thrown at us, hence the fallbback option - in fact, I think that due to the AI's tendency to fight far more protracted wars these days this variant would be challenging even if we only used the Republic type of government. On the other hand, many people have reported that AIs seem to be capable of staying in a representative form of gov't far longer, so maybe we wouldn't get to fight at all :crazyeye:.
     
  17. Aggie

    Aggie Chieftain

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    Well I like SG's to be a challenge and I'm not afraid to lose a game. This goes for both Sid and "Democracy". I'm not yet convinced to allow Republic as a government form yet, but I DID think about another addition:

    - Whenenever a civ decides to choose a non-representative governemnt while we are a Democracy, we are required to get trade embargoes with representative AI's vs the evil empires. What about that one?
     
  18. Skyfish

    Skyfish Chieftain

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    I'd be interested in the Sid game (not now but after the AG1 and the Demo AG) but only if we play it "like a science" :D
     
  19. Aggie

    Aggie Chieftain

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    :lol: I'm sure we can work this out. But why would you want to wait for the demo AG-game to end???
     
  20. jack merchant

    jack merchant Internationalist

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    I'm not afraid of losing; I'm merely afraid of the effort it would take to win ;). But then again, I'm not assured of having a job from next week onwards so I might have plenty of time anyway (and walk around slightly less dazed in the evenings from not having to take 90 calls a day :ack: ).
     

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