AI and Orthus' Axe

[Jenaelha]

I've noticed with .41m that sometimes the AI will have Orthus' Axe and use it but other times the axe simply sets outside a city unclaimed. Is the code to claim the axe a single pass check which if not satisified is lost on subsequent turns? Is it unique for each Civ such that Cassiel will not claim the axe but The Clan will?
Are the other movement 0 takeable items (golden hammer, healing potion, rod's, wonders, etc...) using the same code for claiming?

 

[Morkonan]

I've seen hammers left on the ground as well. Sometimes, it seems like its treated as something that can't be picked up by the AI after another unit has initially picked it up. So, when that unit dies off and it gets dropped, it's just left on the ground. I recently killed a stack that had 6 different "carried" items including four hammers and they all sat there on the ground without being picked up by any passing unit. (I couldn't get to them at the time to pick them up myself.. but, did grab them as soon as I could. )

 

[Azhral]

Its not very difficult to get back lost equipment, it usually just hangs around.

Might be a bug, but might also be a 'feature' so that players can get equipment much easier.

 

[Avahz Darkwood]

na the AI cant actively seek out items. They will only incidentally pick something up if they so happen to stop in its location.

 

[Izmir Stinger]

Maybe we can trick the AI into picking stuff up. The items are units right? Can we do something to the "units" to make the AI think they are threatening? Then they would attack them and spell casting logic can take over.

 

[Avahz Darkwood]

the only way to do that would be to set each item to be hidden nationality when dropped. IIRC there was an error that would cause the item to disappear if it had hidden nationality.

 

[Azhral]

Not really a problem if its not HN. Still can only take items from people you are at war with (or with an HN unit).

Sounds like an idea, making items a goal for the ai to take, as well as heavily weighting all the item pickup spells, as well as the add manes to city spell.

 

[DaveGold]

Another solution could be to drop an item into the space of the surviving defender rather than in the space of the dead attacker. If the defending AI units immediately had an option to pick the item up, it would certainly give the attacker something to think about!

 

[Inkling]

In my last game i was about to send a unit to attack a stack of workers when i discovered he had 99 percent chance of victory. confused, i looked to see if one of the workers hadn't been mutated or something, only to discover one was carrying the axe.
Getting them to pick the dang thing up is only half the battle. albeit a good start.

 

[ADHansa]

This happens every game, unless a AI unit accidently moves to a square where the equipment is located.

I think the best sollution would be a function that checks if there is any unclaimed equipment around, and if then calls a unit that gets a mission to go and pick it up.
Unfortunatly mission-calling coding is above my current coding abilaty, but i have seen in being done by modders in BtS.

 

[Skyre Noktis]

The latest Wildmana has AI code for picking up equipment. That will probably get merged at some point.

 

[Emptiness]

Another solution could be to drop an item into the space of the surviving defender rather than in the space of the dead attacker. If the defending AI units immediately had an option to pick the item up, it would certainly give the attacker something to think about!

Ah, but then if you attack a city with a unit with equipment, and your unit dies, the equipment drops into the defender's city. That would be a big change, and would completely shift the way equipment is used.

 

[Angel-Julia]

What's even more annoying is that the axe takes ownership of the last person that used it, and it seems like you cant take it after your team mate has dropped it.

in this game i played as Lanun and summoned Mercurian which i adopted. I already had the axe as Lanun(i found it sitting on a till top doing nothing), and used it as Lanun. then when i switched to Mercurian the axe stayed with the old units that was no longer under my controll.

Anyway, i got into a war with Shaem, and the AI sent in their stack including the unit with Orthus axe to be oblitherated by Pyre zombies. No problem there, as my angels were soon going to send those zombies back to where they came from.

the problem is that my "teammate" dropped the axe. and the axe was seen to be a unit under my team mates controll. therefore i couldent pick it up. my angels stood over the axe, but there was no option for picking it up, as seen in the attached picture.
I tried pulling back to give Shaem a chance to pick it up so i could capture it from them, but they were more interested at sending their PZ grenades at my angels than picking up the axe, so i finished off Shaem, and then the Lanun tagged Orthus' Axe just sat there for the rest of the game, unable to be picked up.

 

[Izmir Stinger]

Um... feature?

That's kinda stealing, dude. The axe belongs to them. The problem isn't that you can't pick it up, it is that they aren't trying to retrieve their property. Ownership of powerful magical artifacts doesn't operate on an "I touched it last" basis.

 

[DaveGold]

Just for the reference, the AI doesn't collect chests either.

 

[Emptiness]

I tried pulling back to give Shaem a chance to pick it up so i could capture it from them, but they were more interested at sending their PZ grenades at my angels than picking up the axe

If you had parked a sacrificial unit over the axe (and there were no Lanun in the square), then when the Sheaim killed your unit they would enter the square and capture the axe. You could then have killed that unit and claimed the axe for yourself.

 

[dommain]

I think those type of Items could be added to trade if it is possible. Would make it easier instead of jumping through hoops.

 

[Angel-Julia]

Thanks for the idea Emptiness.
I've already oblitherated Shaem and Sheeba, so there are no ennemies nearby that i could use to lure them onto the square to get the axe. I'm about to attack cassiel, though i dont usually let ennemies so fat into my territory. and how would i get his unit there? i'd need about 20 sacrificial units to lure him each of the blocks. i dont think even the axe is worth that effort.

yeah, trade would be an interesting idea. Lanun is willing to give me all their manna etc, even a few cities, anything i need. but not the axe.

Irigionally i was considering disbanding my unit with the axe the turn before compleating the gate, but i had forgotten, now i realised that wouldent have enabled the transfer anyway.

i think it is just a bug, it's not often that a person switches civilization and is teammate with their origional civ, only in mercurian and hyborem summon. i guess in MP team games there could be some advantage of giving the axe to a teammate that is going to spearhead a fight.

 

[Breunor]

Thanks for the idea Emptiness.
I've already oblitherated Shaem and Sheeba, so there are no ennemies nearby that i could use to lure them onto the square to get the axe. I'm about to attack cassiel, though i dont usually let ennemies so fat into my territory. and how would i get his unit there? i'd need about 20 sacrificial units to lure him each of the blocks. i dont think even the axe is worth that effort.

yeah, trade would be an interesting idea. Lanun is willing to give me all their manna etc, even a few cities, anything i need. but not the axe.

Irigionally i was considering disbanding my unit with the axe the turn before compleating the gate, but i had forgotten, now i realised that wouldent have enabled the transfer anyway.

i think it is just a bug, it's not often that a person switches civilization and is teammate with their origional civ, only in mercurian and hyborem summon. i guess in MP team games there could be some advantage of giving the axe to a teammate that is going to spearhead a fight.

To be honest, I would just move a unit to the square, and go into the worldbuilder, delete the 'real' axe, and give yourself a new one!

Best wishes,

Breunor

 

[Emptiness]

I've already oblitherated Shaem and Sheeba, so there are no ennemies nearby that i could use to lure them onto the square to get the axe. I'm about to attack cassiel, though i dont usually let ennemies so fat into my territory. and how would i get his unit there? i'd need about 20 sacrificial units to lure him each of the blocks. i dont think even the axe is worth that effort.

Yeah, that's definitely impractical. If you could capture (or otherwise get) a HN unit, and it was able to survive long enough to get to where the Axe is located, then you could capture the Axe with it.