Any new stuff with the Navy?

[Naval Power]

HellO i havnt been here in a while to here the news of Conquests but I was wondering a few things:


1 Will there be any new ships unique or not?
2 Is the system of Naval Warfare updated to be more realistic
3 Are there any new Civ traits pertaining to water?


Pls answer these for me and I will be greatful.

 

[Louis XXIV]

I doubt you will get an official answer until they are ready to officially release it.

Can you think of an idea for a new ship?

What would its stats be if they don't change things?

 

[steviejay]

I would personally make two new units........... well one new unit, one change

Firstly I'd change the Pirateer (spelling?) so that it had a bit more bite in terms of attack and defence. Good concept but with such a low A/D/M it just gets chewed up

Secondly, I think a good old fashioned Dreadnaught (again spelling?) I couldn't believe they were missed out from Civ and PTW, I mean the building of those ships more or less started a war (WW1 for those who don't know their history) getting them at the same time as Infantry and Art in Replacable Parts so they could come after the American Civil War Ironclads and the WW2 Battleships and Destroyers

 

[Sarevok]

I would make the WW1 cruisers as a new unit and Despite tha they arent naval units, probably a fokker triplane or some early tanks. i personally think the transition to ww1 era weapons to ww2 era is very abrupt and curt.

Back to the navy, I think naval ships need more movement and smething needs to be put into the AI to make them make large navies. I always build HUGE fleets of Subs and Battleships only to find that I never get to use them except for shore bombarding. Air force also needs to be expanded. and while your at it, what about the fronts? line your border with infantry instead of waiting back in your cities for me to bomb you into the stone age. It would be nice if they added this kind of stuff.

 

[Matthix]

I would like something as a "Admiral" or Flagship or something like that. Boats get promoted to Elite, but that's all. Building a army of boats would be nice...

 

[UFDelt]

I agree about the pirateer, I would also like to see the most modern units have a 5 missile load, like all aegis cruisers can carry five cruise missiles. That would make the navy so much more effective than it is right now- I barely make navies as it is.

 

[Sarevok]

Yeah, give me those battle groups.

 

[Turner]

[anal mode]It's "Privateer", not "Pirateer".[/anal mode]

Yeah, it would be nice to have more naval units. It's sadly lacking in this game. And Firaxis, make it standard that bombardment kills, and Cruise missiles can load on ships! Well, certain ones, like a nuke tho. Please?

Course, now that I think about it, Civ has always been light on the naval side.

You know, if you want more naval units, you might want to check out the DyP mod. They have more naval units. . . .

 

[jim_green_1]

they should make a new UU for germany; instead of the tank they should have a U-boat.

That thing was pretty powerful in its day...

 

[steviejay]

Sarevok, if you like having huge fleets fight each other. just don't kill the Carthagians early on and let them grow to a Modern Power. they have a HUGE navy in my Regent game, and I had to spend a mother load worth of shields building a navy that could try and counter it and even now I'm not even close, the only way I can destroy the Carthage Fleet is by using my nuke sub's with tac nukes on board, one of those should take out quite a few ships if they're stacked.

Matthix, yeah I agree with you on the subject of Navy GL's. I mena, look at Nimitz, or Nelson. I think you could safely call them GL's.

I would really like the game to be extended in the WW1 era. you get Inf, you get Art but by the time you have a huge number of them, you've moved onto the next part and you've got loads of tanks Blitzkreig-ing everything in sight. a WW1 tank would be cool but I think the Navy aspect is the one I would like to see expanded the most cause I'm a major fan of launching D-Day-esque landings

 

[Ivan the Kulak]

For new naval units, how about the Arsenal Ship? Give it 4 tile bombard range, with blitz attack - maybe 4 movement points, so it doesn't have too much power. If they're all ancient scenarios, though, I suppose they won't bother to add this Adding in triremes and longships would be nice, though.

 

[America444]

two changes

1 rename submarine to attack sub
2 rename nucleur submarine to missle sub

 

[dexters]

On thing they can do is "spread out" the power variance of the navy. Comparitvely speaking, the armies on the ground have a more varied power structure.

One way of doing this is adding a new unit beyond the battleship. But I can't think of a ship that can go beyond the battleship in terms of sheer power although Battleships come in different flavours. Perhaps something along the lines of super battleships, or Dreadnaught Battleships as the WW II monsters such as the Yamato/Musashi, Bismark are known.

I'd hate to sound like a broken record repeating the same refrain in many threads, but I think we all would probably be more satisifed with an AI that can perform at a higher level navally rather than see new units that the AI can't manage to use properly.

 

[JJP]

Originally posted by Matthix
Building a army of boats would be nice...

Yes, that would be nice.
Naval army could have high bombard capacity and it could destroy ground units if they were on the coast.

 

[The Last Conformist]

Having played mods with Lethal Sea Bombard enabled on normal (=non-missile) artillery units, I can say it's very powerful. Unbalancingly powerful, and the AI doesn't handle it well either. Lethal Land Bombard on normal artillery would no doubt be even more powerful.

(Yes, I've said in other threads I'd like to seem bombers capable of sinking ships. But this is subtly different, since you can bring along air cover in the form of Fighters or Jet Fighters on a Carrier. Still, if anything such was implemented, I'd also want modern warships given some ability to fire back at attacking aircraft.)

 

[marshalljames]

Perhaps something along the lines of super battleships, or Dreadnaught Battleships as the WW II monsters such as the Yamato/Musashi, Bismark are known.

After watching the Battle between the Bismark And Hood on TV,the sinking of the Bismark was the end of the Big battleship Era.A huge invest in $,sunk by a cheap airplane( Fairey Swordfish torpedo destoyed the rudder making the ship un-stearable and a sitting duck which they then bombarded with over 1000 shells and didn't sink it but completely destroyed the deck.1800 sailors,100 survivors,700 left to drown.Most if not all the survivors were from below decks.
Which was completly different from the Hood's fate which sank in 3 seconds.A descending Shell (from Bismark,3rd shell the ship had ever fired)went through the deck hit the rear magazine,blowing the back end of the ship off and sending a fire storm to the forward magazine,blowing the front end off.1800 sailors 3 survivors).
A better upgrade would be super Aircraft Carrier.Air Power controls the seas today not Battleships.

 

[Pembroke]

I think that the biggest problem in the nautical aspect of civ is not any lack of units but the lack of strategic objectives, i.e. there simply are too few worthwhile jobs you can do with your navy. Your land units are essential: you can't win the game, indeed you can't even survive, without having adequate land forces whereas a navy is basically a "nice to have" and necessary really only when ferrying troops and settlers across the seas.

A navy isn't _necessary_: you can win without it, and usually without too much trouble either.

This is, of course, ridiculous. Navies and sea battles have played a major role in OTL history and the control over the seas and sea routes were important. Ships were much more than just ferries carrying people.

What we need are jobs for our ships: controlling trade routes, pirating trade routes, protecting your own routes, projecting influence both cultural and political, capturing enemy vessels, raiding coasts for slaves and gold, guarding your coasts and keeping it free from foreign powers (and I mean _without_ having to build that ridiculous "Great Sea Wall Of China"), and all the other many things that ships were designed for in the first place...

Make navies useful in the game and the players will build and use them. Otherwise they are just "sugar coating".

 

[Esckey]

The naval aspect is why I only play on pangea setting. I only use my ships to either a: scout, or B: transport men to other places on the continent. Ya I'll build a few subs so I can sink any annoying ship that comes by but only after I've bombed the crap outta it aircraft or artillery


I totally second the bit about Naval Great Leaders

 

[Sarevok]

actually, I dont kill anyone off untill I got at least 100 ICBM's unless they REALLY pissed me off.

U-Boats, while powerful for their day, werent nearly as decisive as the Panzers (or the heinikel's).

Adding to other comments, i think ships need much more range and movement, not to mention the cruise missiles in the AEGIS.

nuke subs shopuld stay, they carried nukes and could shoot the SLBM's anywhere. They were yet another way to kill a country with nukes.

 

[cerebus]

Historically navies were built to protect or pillage sea-going trade. Look at all the loot the Spanish brought back from the new world. In CivIII terms you can't loot or kill the ocean going trade of another civ, once a harbor is built all the wealth just flows freely over the water. The Japanese in WWII invaded many islands to gain their nature resoureces, oil, rubber, etc. They then had to ship these items back to the industries that needed them in Japan. This gave US subs the oppertunity to sink them and deny Japan those resources.
I think that when you have a harbor that is trading with other cites or civs, trade ships should be created automatically that will phyiscally move the goods from city to city. These trade ships would be made when the trade route is opened, maybe for a one time gold cost to open the trade route but not shield production, and are in total control of the computer not the player!!!
The player can find out what is on the ship and where it is going and can asign a ship of his to convoy with it to its destination for protection. Other civs and barbs can attack these trade ships, shinking or looting them, to distrupt trade and resources.
Civs would be more apt to build navies to protect all their island wealth