anyone ever use serfdom?

[Gorey]

i dont think i've ever used it in all these years. atleast i cant remember if i did.

of all the civics in that column this is the least useful to me. mainly because by the time im done with slavery, i dont really need faster workers. and i always have access to caste system before serfdom due to its tech tree placement.

my workers already build improvements faster than the city grows, why do i need to make them faster?

atleast emancipation.. while annoying, has its use. i just wish the AI's would recognize that it's only helpful if you need to grow alot of cottages. why they STAY in emancipation is a mystery to me.

i think they should have added a secondary bonus to it to make it worthwhile.

the only time i would ever consider it is when railroads comes around.. but even then.. i'd rather just stay in caste system and build a couple more workers to get the rails up.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

By the time serfdom is available, you needed enough workers to build your improvements without it.

Its opportunity cost is slavery or caste system mostly...usually both offer better returns.

Zero AIs count it as a favorite civic.

In other words, serfdom is the single biggest non-default piece of trash civic in the game. If you are SPI and you somehow don't need the whip or GPP, you might be able to swing it for a few turns...but even then it's not great.

Edit: in non-ancient era starts, it might be OK, haven't tried those.

 

[IronCrown]

I actually used it... ONCE. In that game I had jungle everywhere, in every single city except the capital. I built more than two workers per city and still it took forever to improve all my land. But other than that one game, building a few more workers was always a lot better than switching to serfdom.

 

[Gorey]

ok yeah, that might be a time to use it.

but how often do you still have lots of jungle around when serfdom becomes avail?

when im settling jungles, each jungle city gets two workers. one chopping and one improving.

 

[Yared]

I could easily imagine going into serfdom post-war or post-nuke.

 

[Grey Fox]

Only when I am spiritual.

IMO, it could have had something more to make it more attractive.
Something like +1 on farms would have been really cool. But probably too powerful

 

[Yared]

Only when I am spiritual.

Asoka

Fast Worker + Serfdom

"We'll just have our fast workers flank-"
"Sorry sir but the fast workers are the only non-attacking UU."

 

[LegionSteve]

If I'm spiritual and I have nothing ready to whip for the next few turns, I might go into Serfdom to save a bit of civic upkeep and avoid slave revolts, then straight back to slavery after the 5 turns. That's it really.

 

[Bigv32]

seriously has no one ever used serftom and the hagia sophia. (I think that is the wonder that give 50% worker bonus)

This works great with a spiritual leader, but I have found this to be very useful. I go on a massive rampage with my armies. Stop and rebuild the economy by switching to serftom and organized religion, and then I repeat.

I have noticed it helps me reduce time between wars, but only if it is before the hagia goes obsolete and only if I have the hagia in the first place

 

[huh?]

I used to use it all the time. Of course back then, I had a mental block/moral block? against using Slavery. Once I got past that block, I haven't used Serfdom.

 

[Badtz Maru]

I use it if I have a lot of smaller, high production low-pop cities. It is a lot less expensive than Slavery maintenance wise. I'll switch to Slavery if I have a good whipping opportunity coming up, though.

The one that I hardly ever use, and probably should use more, is Caste System. I don't make specialists enough to make it worth the maintenance cost.

 

[aday]

IMO, it could have had something more to make it more attractive.
Something like +1 on farms would have been really cool. But probably too powerful

This is what I do for Serfdom in my games. Instead of the worker speed, you get +1 from farms, -25% GPP, high upkeep.

It is pretty powerful, but I think the downsides are severe enough to make it a non-trivial decision which civic to use. The AI's will use the civic quite a bit, but not exclusively, and they'll still switch the Emancipation when it's available.

I think it may be overpowered during Golden Ages though... At least there's a negative synergy (the -25% GPP) to dampen this.

 

[Unconquered Sun]

It's useful on maps that are unusually worker-demanding. Such maps also happen to be high on civic costs where Serfdom has a small advantage.

 

[Bei1052]

I use it quite a bit.

 

[Yared]

Whatcha think about implementing Serfdom to spam RRs with a spiritual leader or in GA?

 

[Krill]

Always knew I was doing something wrong...

 

[Nestorius]

When your cities have been established and you need to grow, money is tight and you already have too many units, its the same cost as tribal and no slave revolts.

 

[Kesshi]

When your cities have been established and you need to grow, money is tight and you already have too many units, its the same cost as tribal and no slave revolts.

In that case, Caste System will be superior to Serfdom. Even if you have zero specialists. Why? Because you're growing. You will eventually use specialists. New cities? Artist Specialist. Need some quick gold? Merchant Specialists. Etc.

Very rarely will you ever be in a position where Serfdom is available but Caste System is not. And if you are in that position, then you either A) don't know what you're doing, or B) know very well what you're doing and understand the special circumstaces you're in, and don't need to be told which civics to choose.

 

[blitzkrieg1980]

Whatcha think about implementing Serfdom to spam RRs with a spiritual leader or in GA?

By the time Railroading comes around, I have tons of workers without much better to do than build railroads. Generally, I'm either in Emancipation for cottage growth/ avoidance or I'm still in Caste System (for tons of scientists) and workers are already getting a +50% boost from Steam Power. It just seems really unnecessary.

In that case, Caste System will be superior to Serfdom. Even if you have zero specialists. Why? Because you're growing. You will eventually use specialists. New cities? Artist Specialist. Need some quick gold? Merchant Specialists. Etc.

Not to mention the +1 for workshops. Often, in the mid-game, I'll switch out of slavery (once most of my cities' infrastructure is up) simply for that +1 to workshops (usually after guilds also adds +1 to workshops). This makes grassland workshops have the same yield as a grassland hill (1 3) and let's face it, flatland grassland tiles are (usually) much more abundant. Also, after chemistry, grassland workshops are worth 14 or the same yield as a Railroaded grassland hill /w a mine.

 

[Yared]

By the time Railroading comes around, I have tons of workers without much better to do than build railroads. Generally, I'm either in Emancipation for cottage growth/ avoidance or I'm still in Caste System (for tons of scientists) and workers are already getting a +50% boost from Steam Power. It just seems really unnecessary.

Even if you're pretty much surrounded by hills or wood mills?