Beeline to Alphabet? Makes no sense.

[Re/\/\eDy]

I've heard a strategy a person can do is to beeline to the alphabet, reduce your technology rate to 0%, build up tons of cash, then trade that cash with other nations for technologies you passed up. What I don't understand is I did this exact thing but I couldn't trade any cash with other nations for their technology because I needed something else, currency! By the time I had gotten currency, the nations, for whatever reason, weren't really in a wanting position to take my gold despite them being "pleased."

Basically I'm confused, the "beeline to the alphabet" strategy simply doesn't seem to work very well for me. I dont know, maybe I'm doing something wrong. Can anyone be more specific as to how they approach this strategy? Thanks.

 

[tproc]

This concept (for trading Techs) worked really well in Civ 3, but I have found that it simply doesn't work in Civ 4.

 

[Shillen]

In civ3 1 gold equaled 1 beaker. In civ4 1 gold equals a fraction of a beaker. That means if you buy techs with gold you have to drastically overpay for the tech. It's not worth doing this. Beelining for alphabet can be a good strategy sometimes, though, so you can trade techs for techs. But not for turning research off and buying techs.

 

[andytheace]

being the tech broker is often workable, since you get to trade 1 tech for multiple techs. One suggestion I would make, though, is that you don't trade alphabet, or at least not right away, so you don't give up your power as the sole trader.

 

[Alan_Bernardo]

being the tech broker is often workable, since you get to trade 1 tech for multiple techs. One suggestion I would make, though, is that you don't trade alphabet, or at least not right away, so you don't give up your power as the sole trader.

I'm rather new to this series but do fairly well and am understanding the cause-effect aspect of the game.

But I've found that I lag behind technologically, as other AIs trade away but are somehow reluctant to do the same with me.

Thus, I think I'll play with technology-trading turned off, and see how things go.

It's probably more toward the truth to say that I probably don't quite understand what is the best path to take and as a result sometimes choose techs based on short-term goals rather than long-term.

But still, I'm going to give this no-tech-trading a go.


Alanb

 

[MerakSpielman]

The AI in Civ4 is unwilling to trade away their best techs. They're smart enough to realize that being the only people with the best techs gives them a better chance at winning, and they try to play to win.

 

[mjsbx]

one way to beeline to alphabet is to get priesthood and writing, then build the oracle. alphabet will be one of the choices for your free tech, and you have the tech-trading ability without having to completely neglect some of the earlier techs.

 

[suspendinlight]

You should go for alphabet early so you have a monopoly on the tech trade, but don't reduce science and try to buy techs. Just keep researching and trade your techs to neighbors. Since they can't trade techs with each other yet, you will zip ahead of them in the tech race.

 

[Zeviz]

...
But I've found that I lag behind technologically, as other AIs trade away but are somehow reluctant to do the same with me.

Thus, I think I'll play with technology-trading turned off, and see how things go.
...

There are several reasons AIs would refuse to sell you technology:

1) They are currently building a wonder unlocked by this technology.

2) The technology gives them a key military or strategic advantage (e.g. early gunpowder).

3) The technology is on a path to a tech with a prize attached. (e.g. nobody will sell you Education until the race for Liberalism is over)

4) Either they or you are one of the technological leaders.

If I am not mistaken, all of the conditions above apply to AI-AI trades as well.

So turning off tech trading would be disadvantageous to you, because you can always play the trading game better than AIs. (For example, intentionally research an expensive tech that most AIs left out and sell it to all of them, to get many cheaper techs. Or buying a tech that another AI needs and selling it to him.) This can propel you into research lead when you discover alphabet and can let you keep up for a long time if you play it right. Just realize which techs you will not be able to get until much later, and either wait or research them yourself.

 

[Vardis]

If you have writing and are building the oracle, I'd get theology considering how much more expensive it is to research.

 

[jeremiahrounds]

The one thing i noticed that applies all the way up to prince is that the AI isnt as fast to trade techs to other AI as it was in civ3. For example paper in my last game on prince. I had a tech lead so i was reluctant to trade. But then someone made a demand and i thought i would go ahead and get the +1 diplo. Several turns later though other civs still didnt have paper.

In civ3 if you gave away a tech before your turn you would find every AI civ had it already ready they traded so fast. So atleast the reluctance of the AI to trade good techs extends to AIs a bit in civ4.

I dont know whether this gets different as you go up in levels.

 

[Alan_Bernardo]

So turning off tech trading would be disadvantageous to you, because you can always play the trading game better than AIs.

This is probably the case, but for right now it isn't, since I don't think I can play the trading game better than the AI until I get more experience with technologies.

Thanks,

Alanb

 

[dh_epic]

I've beelined to alphabet, but not to trade cash for techs. The AI isn't as stupid as it was in Civ 3. They now know that no amount of money is worth having a monopoly technology in some cases. Seriously, you're going to give me 1000 gold so you can have a better military than me, declare war on me, and take your money back? Come on.

Beelining to alphabet is still smart at certain points if there are enough happy opponents to trade with. If you can be the first one to alphabet, you can monopolize the alphabet for a while and trade some other technologies for the ones you've missed. If I took the religion route, I trade monotheism for some worker techs. Or if I took the horse route, I trade horseback riding for some religions. Or if I took the metals route, I trade bronze and iron working for worker techs. This can be the key to surging ahead early.

In the long run, you can't tech broker like you did in Civ 3. The AI is just too smart. But early on in the game, you can still make a few pivottal deals. It's a question of timing.

 

[Viperace]

Beelining to Alphabet IS a good strategy. It work better as the number of civs in ur game higher. Preferably a more than 8 civs game.

If u r the first one to get Alphabet, u r the ONLY one who can trade tech! Trade one tech per civ, if there are 8 other civs in ur game and each of them are willing to trade one tech with u, immediately u got 8 tech at the same turn. And u can keep doing this until most of the AI got Alphabet ,and they trade among each other.

 

[fxer]

But I've found that I lag behind technologically, as other AIs trade away but are somehow reluctant to do the same with me.

Thus, I think I'll play with technology-trading turned off, and see how things go.

Playing with tech trading turned off is probably like playing every game at warlord level Without the AI trading between themselves you will probably find you rush out ahead in research if you stay on the same difficulty. No-tech trading seems to amount to a simple handicap on the AI. Might as well just Worldbuilder yourself some city sites packed with resources if you are looking for a leg up on the AI

The AI trades tech among themselves pretty liberally, and you can get in on the trades every so often yourself, always giving away more beakers than you are getting, naturally.

 

[Wlauzon]

I have tried the "beeline" strategy not just for Alphabet, but for some others as well.

And in general it does not work all that great unless you are talking about a tech that is only 2-3 steps up and relatively cheap.

 

[spiceant]

trading your techs for ai cash can be worthwhile if you can collect enough cash to buy another usefull tech from another civ. trading techs and money becomes much less feasible on higher difficultys as the ai will have a ratio of 1.5 when trading techs, ie. you offer a tech of 1500 beakers and it will offer a 1000 beaker tech back and think its all fair.
and if you want to beeline techs, you could try out specific routes through the tech tree with great people, their discoverys are predictable, for example the great prophet will found christianity if you have researched the first 5 religion techs and writing.

 

[Jafendel]

In a few past games with many opponents I weren't so lucky in grabbing the earlier religions so I decided to rush for Code of Laws (and Confucianism). Alphabet was a good choice after that because Writing is a prequisite for both techs. And after that it was a good opportunity to carefully trade some missing techs from AI's.

 

[anton_z1]

1) they never get alphabet first.

2) AI is ******** for techs. They never research alphabet first. Thus, by getting alphabet you can not only get all the techs, but you can get most of the without sacrificing your agvantage. I simply exchange techs from 1 ai to the other (Like getting priesthood from one, then getting monoteism from the other in exchange of priesthood MUHAHAHAHAHA). Also with alphabet you get get ALL the cash from ALL the AI. Thus getting 500-1000gc is not impossible. (This money should be used in war preparations).

3) There is some techs they never reasearch (like metal casting ...) reserach them, then exchange them for all other techs. I usually get 2-3 techs for each tech i research (paying on immortal :/)

 

[Yzman]

I always go for alphabet first and I am able to trade it for all the other techs I missed. Works great for me.