"Beta" Massive WW2 scenario

[Rocoteh]

Meateater,

According to my sources 150 planes (out of the total)
were deployed in North Africa.

I do not have info on the type of planes, but one can assume
most were bombers since enemy fighter-threat was minimal
in North Africa.

Best Regards

Rocoteh

 

[Meateater]

Thanks for the info I will put a few older bombers in N.A.

I ran a quick test last night with me being the U.S. and then I had Germany, France and Poland in there. I was trying to give the axis first strike, by making the allies skip the first turn. It didn't work in that test and I don't know why. I will do a few thing tonight and see what happens. Also need to make a few other adjustments to the units, and give them an AI setting too.

In this first test (Debug all AI units set to random defense, offence)Germany had the first moves and took a few cities but lost them and some of its own cities on the next turn when the allies counter attacked. In this test the allies had the upper hand. If most the allies units had an AI setting to defend then I think it would have been different. Germany used infantry to attack and lost a lot of them. Those are just a few things from the first test that I noticed.

 

[Rocoteh]

Meateater,

I will do a human Germany versus computer France
and Poland test tomorrow.

Will report the result here.

Best Regards

Rocoteh

 

[Rocoteh]

This is Conquests Mini-scenario using only 3 CIVS:
Germany, France and Poland.

VERY IMPORTANT: YOU MUST HAVE INSTALLED
WW2 THE WORLD. OTHERWISE THIS FILE WILL NOT
WORK. COPY THE FILE INTO THE CONQUEST-FOLDER
WHERE THE OTHER CONQUEST-FOLDERS ARE LOCATED.

PLEASE ALSO DOWNLOAD THE SMALL DOWNLOAD
COUNTER ZIP.

When the Mini-scenario starts Germany are at war
with France and Poland (in locked alliance).
If you think the map looks strange its due to the
fact only 3 CIVS are used, and also because of that:
Watch the flanks. An advise if you play Germany:
Use your Airpower and artillery before sending in
the Panzers to Poland. Otherwise you will be in trouble!
I regard Meateaters WW2 Global project as one
of the most impressing ever done.
The work Meateater does holds academic class.

Rocoteh










http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/WW2Mini.zip

 

[Meateater]

Looks cool Rocoteh I uploaded 3.2 with some changes after running some of the tests. It was hard to get a feel of how it is going to play with all of the civs and new militaries but it was interesting and I liked how it played.

Since the turns are going to be in weeks I still need to change some units move points. Like how many weeks did it take for a fleet to cross the Atlantic from say N.Y. to England.

So take a look or a play of 3.2 and if it looks ok, I would say feel free to pick the next country to do.

 

[Rocoteh]

Meateater,

It will be interesting to see how 3.2 looks.

With regard to the mini-scenario the playtesting
was very positive.

I defeated Poland in 2 turns during 3 tests.
It works realistic also with regard to France .
If France attacks 1939, the attack will fail.

Maybe Italy would be next country to do.
Their Infantry Divisions were only at 30% level
1939, so conscript status should be relevant
for them.

Best Regards

Rocoteh

 

[Meateater]

Sounds good Italy is next.
For 3.2 I just watched the AI battle it out. I would be Finland, Sweden, Spain and then United States. Start a game in debug mode and watch to see if Germany would fall from being attacked on two fronts. I adjusted all the infantry units to start on defense but it didn't matter the AI would use them to attack anyway.

Also added in 3.2 were the city police an immobile unit to garrison the cities at the start of the game, these units can not be rebuilt and are really only there so that the starting units can be used to attack or counter attack and not garrison cities.

 

[Rocoteh]

Meateater,

The city police unit sounds like a very good idea.

I also think it was very positive that the playtests
showed that an unhistorical French early offensive
into Germany will not pay off.

I say unhistorical since the French military doctrine
was 1939 strictly defensive.

I know that I have a very good OOB for Italy somewhere,
and will try to find it.

Best Regards

Rocoteh

 

[Meateater]

Yeah it was interesting in the test to see the French invade early and throw everything at Germany and with Poland on the other side Germany would fail. How history could have changed but we know that the French like you said stayed on defence althought they did go into German territory they stayed within the M-lines guns.


Here is a little something to get started you gave the BB's listed just below

"Italy: Guilio Cesare (1910)BB, Conte Di Cavour (1910)BB,
Andrea Doria (1912)BB and Caio Duilio (1912)" BB = 4

But here is some more navy info. I would like to find fleet groupings/locations for all ships but if like France I can't find all of them then at least the BB's and cruisers should be named and located.


By 1940 the Italian Navy had four battleships, seven heavy cruisers, 14 light cruisers, 119 submarines and 120 destroyers.

Cruisers - 19 below
--------------------
Alberico Da Barbiano
Alberto Di Giussano
Armando Diaz
Bartolomeo Colleoni
Bolzano
Emanuele Filiberto Duca D'Aosta
Eugenio Di Savoia
Fiume
Giovanni Delle Bande Nere
Gorizia
Guiseppe Garibaldi
Luigi Cadorna
Luigi Di Savoia Duca Degli Abruzzi
Muzio Attendolo
Pola
Raimondo Montecuccoli
Trento
Trieste
Zara
------------------------

Destroyers - 127 below
---------------------
Airone
Alcione
Aldebaran
Alfredo Oriani
Alpino
Altair
Alvise Da Mosto
Andromeda
Angelo Bassini
Antares
Antonio Da Noli
Antonio Mosto
Antonio Pigafetta
Antonio Usodimare
Aquilone
Aretusa
Ariel
Artigliere
Ascari
Audace
Augusto Riboty
Aviere
Baleno
Bersagliere
Bettino Ricasoli
Borea
Calatafimi
Calliope
Camicia Nera
Canopo
Carabiniere
Carlo Mirabello
Cassiopea
Castelfidardo
Castore
Centauro
Cesare Battisti
Cigno
Circe
Climene
Clio
Confienza
Corazziere
Curtatone
Daniele Manin
Dardo
Emanuele Pessagno
Enrico Cosenz
Espero
Euro
Folgore
Francesco Crispi
Francesco Nullo
Francesco Stocco
Fratelli Cairoli
Freccia
Fuciliere
Fulmine
Generale Achille Papa
Generale Antonio Cantore
Generale Antonio Cascino
Generale Antonio Chinotto
Generale Carlo Montanari
Generale Marcello Prestinari
Geniere
Giacinto Carini
Giacomo Medici
Giosue Carducci
Giovanni Acerbi
Giovanni Da Verazzano
Giovanni Nicotera
Giuseppe Cesare Abba
Giuseppe Dezza
Giuseppe La Farina
Giuseppe La Masa
Giuseppe Missori
Giuseppe Sirtori
Granatiere
Grecale
Lampo
Lanciere
Lanzerotto Malocello
Leone
Leone Pancaldo
Libeccio
Libra
Lince
Lira
Luca Tarigo
Lupo
Maestrale
Monzambano
Nazario Sauro
Nembo
Nicola Fabrizi
Nicolo Zeno
Nicoloso Da Recco
Orione
Orsa
Ostro
Palestro
Pallade
Pantera
Partenope
Pegaso
Perseo
Pleiadi
Polluce
Procione
Quintino Sella
Rosolino Pilo
Saetta
Sagittario
San Martino
Scirocco
Simone Schiaffino
Sirio
Solferino
Strale
Tigre
Turbine
Ugolino Vivaldi
Vega
Vincenzo Gioberti
Vincenzo Giordano Orsini
Vittorio Alfieri
Zeffiro
-----------------------

Submarines - 119?
--------------------

 

[Rocoteh]

Meateater,

An impressing naval research.

As I said I will try to find the ground forces OOB
for Italy.

Best Regards

Rocoteh

 

[Meateater]

OK 3.3 is up with the Italian navy and it looks good. I need to make some adjustments to the other navies so that should come in the next update. Will name the French destroyers and see if I can find something on their submarine forces.

 

[Rocoteh]

Meateater,

Version 3.3 looks very good.

Please your PM:s.

Best Regards

Rocoteh

 

[Rocoteh]

Meateater,

The OOB for Italys forces in Eritrea, Ethiopia and Somaliland
have been send to you with PM.

A comment: Although the Colonial forces numbered an
impressing 48 Brigades, one should consider they had old
weapons on overall low morale.
Italy manged to occupy British Somaliland (defended by
1 British Brigade!) otherwise the order from Rome was defend!!!
This makes sense since the armored forces numbered 63 tanks
and artillery (37 mm-149 mm) 866 guns.
Furthermore there existed no industry, and thus no ammo
production. When Italy entered the war the colonys in
East Africa were 100% cut off from Italy.

I suggest you group the Colonial Brigades in Divisions
and give the Divisions conscript-status.
Otherwise it will be hard to simulate how 4 Divisions from
the British Empire+ 1 Division from South Africa could
capture Italys colonys in East Africa.

Best Regards

Rocoteh

 

[dreadknought]

Originally posted by Rocoteh
Meateater,

The OOB for Italys forces in Eritrea, Ethiopia and Somaliland
have been send to you with PM.

A comment: Although the Colonial forces numbered an
impressing 48 Brigades, one should consider they had old
weapons on overall low morale.
Italy manged to occupy British Somaliland (defended by
1 British Brigade!) otherwise the order from Rome was defend!!!
This makes sense since the armored forces numbered 63 tanks
and artillery (37 mm-149 mm) 866 guns.
Furthermore there existed no industry, and thus no ammo
production. When Italy entered the war the colonys in
East Africa were 100% cut off from Italy.

I suggest you group the Colonial Brigades in Divisions
and give the Divisions conscript-status.
Otherwise it will be hard to simulate how 4 Divisions from
the British Empire+ 1 Division from South Africa could
capture Italys colonys in East Africa.

Best Regards

Rocoteh

Its a funny story about that because I remember reading that the Italian soldiers used to look for British soldiers so they could surrender quicker and would sometimes even surrender to unarmed civilians mistaking then for British troops.

Then once they were prisoners the British men worried all the time about the Italian Prisoners wooing the women back in England, such was their reputation as lovers.

However the Italian prisoners were actually the best of prisoners,singing songs, ballads, writing stories and the British people actually warmed to them and got along with them quite well.

However the German prisoners were another story.

 

[Rocoteh]

dreadknought,

Its also interesting to compare the industrial
weakness of Italys fascist-regime with the strenght
of Russias Stalin-regime:

Italy was never able to hold a force of more than 3 Armored
Divisions: Littorio, Ariete and Centauro.

The German invasion of Soviet was met with 60 Tank Divisions
and at least 23 000 tanks.

Best Regards

Rocoteh

 

[dreadknought]

Originally posted by Rocoteh
dreadknought,

Its also interesting to compare the industrial
weakness of Italys fascist-regime with the strenght
of Russias Stalin-regime:

Italy was never able to hold a force of more than 3 Armored
Divisions: Littorio, Ariete and Centauro.

The German invasion of Soviet was met with 60 Tank Divisions
and at least 23 000 tanks.

Best Regards

Rocoteh

Yes , thats very impressive. The soviets were really a thorn in Germans side, actually a million thorns. It made a big difference that they wernt overrun.

 

[Meateater]

Thanks for the info from the both of you. I made an update 3.5 and added some to the U.S. navy and moved some of the French navy to the Med sea. Also added in the Italian forces in East Africa. Thanks Rocoteh

 

[Rocoteh]

Meateater,

I think I can deliver the Swedish OOB for Ground forces,
Naval and Air within some days.

The report have been delayed due to great differences
on Army-strengt betwen the sources.

The highest number I have seen is 10 Infantry Divisions +
8 Infantry Divisions and 3 Cavalry Divisions after mobilization.

Best Regards

Rocoteh

Edit: Colonial forces in North Africa: Only 2 Divisions:

1 Libya Infantry Division
2 Libya Infantry Division

With regard to deployment of Regular Ground forces,
I think the 1940 link you have also is relevant for 1939.

 

[Meateater]

Ok thanks. Will get the North Africa forces in the next update, and just let me know if there are units out of place. Maybe get the Italian military finished up and placed here this week sometime.

Looked in to Denmark's military today but didn't find much. I think they were in bad shape though from what I have read.

 

[Rocoteh]

Meateater,

Yes, Denmark`s forces were in bad shape, but I will
have info on them also when I deliver the stats
for Sweden.

Best Regards

Rocoteh