I'm not worried about him coming after us. We'll take care of him.Revent said:The red city site looks great! However, the ONLY qualm I have is that Alex WILL come for us (almost certainly). It's not particularly easy to get him to Friendly and he declares on Pleased if I remember correctly. So we will want our border cities to be very strongly defended if he gets into WHEOOH mode.
Surely, you're joking...? I kept saying, I would tech fishing after AH because 1) we'll want it soon anyway and 2) it gives a discount on pottery. Going Pottery > Fishing is silly.Tech wise, I think
Pottery->Fishing->Writing->Alpha seems good
Sounds ok. Not sure we should spent worker turns to road towards asoka yet but we'll have to do that, eventually.Smilingrogue said:- Still think Pottery -> Writing should be next. We can open borders and road into Asoka for TRs and we will need it on the way to Alpha for spies.
That city would be one that leaves the corn to asoka. I'd rather not let him have it. With my red-dot-city, we can settle a second with the pigs in the area. BFC-overlap is a good thing.On the other hand, what about a city 1 West of the Horse on the Plains hill? We can settle a city one North of the Pigs to get the corn and help cap's cottages. Though, now that I think about it, that's probably not good as investment in multiple settlers aside, that may not seal Asoka off.
So would you settle yellow dot next?I am afraid Alex will take the Yellow spot very soon. I think the only reason he settled his third city where he did is because it has Iron. (Un-forested grassland tile surrounded by Jungle) The natural thing for him to do will be push North and that Corn site looks juicy.
1SE means the city won't be coastal. That is a big -ve. It'll have 4 properly dead tiles, compared to those coastal tiles. We won't get those calendar resources off Alex anyway, it'd be in his inner ring and he settled there way earlier than we could. I'm not convinced of settling SE.I am not sure the Green dot is in the best place. It takes away a grassland hill, while giving no bonus city tile yields and picks up several empty water tiles. I would suggest moving that city 1 SE. This will allow us to have both Horse and Corn available right from get-go, fresh water and allow us to compete for the Calendar resources with Alex. This will increase friction with him, but I don't think any of us believe we can buddy up with Alex anytime soon, anyway.
Well that was to be expected. You can't have it all. I think, however, that it looks like Asoka is about to settle (this or next IBT) and only go for the crabs so we can still get a city with clams.Hate seeing Asoka pushing onto the Northern Coast at a double sea-food spot. But I guess we are in a tight space and will lose some ground to both the AIs.
Roading towards the capital. With no irrigated grass tiles there's nothing really worth improving, we should whip some there anyway. Make sure we stay >= pop 2 though. Plus, Uruk would really benefit from the +1 from gold (note that I hooked that up already).Why is Eridu's worker building a road there? Is he just laying one turn of road between moves to another tile?
So would you settle yellow dot next?
I am not big on settling on the coast for the sake of settling on the coast. That city doesn't have sea-food. The trade routes don't matter as due the weird way they work, we should get trade just by sharing any water tiles within our Civ's boundaries. That fresh water lake should by itself give us trade with any city that has it in its culture boundaries. Being on coastal allows us to build lighthouse. But this only turns all those tiles food neutral. Harbours are nice, but nothing spectacular. I am not saying settling there is a bad move. My point is that settling on the coast becomes a wash without any great advantage, while losing fresh water for health.1SE means the city won't be coastal. That is a big -ve. It'll have 4 properly dead tiles, compared to those coastal tiles. We won't get those calendar resources off Alex anyway, it'd be in his inner ring and he settled there way earlier than we could. I'm not convinced of settling SE.
Yup, I think he will settle right where he is, too. Doesn't mean I can't whine about it. (This land is mine! Mine!!)Well that was to be expected. You can't have it all. I think, however, that it looks like Asoka is about to settle (this or next IBT) and only go for the crabs so we can still get a city with clams.
Ah...ok. I just wasn't sure what the plan for the worker was.Roading towards the capital. With no irrigated grass tiles there's nothing really worth improving, we should whip some there anyway. Make sure we stay >= pop 2 though. Plus, Uruk would really benefit from the +1 from gold (note that I hooked that up already).
That sounds good to me.I don't 100% remember what I planned with the workers down at Kish, but something like moving one to the 4th city soonish and have the other road the tiles W (horses) and WW of Kish to connect it to Uruk.
Well, I did, didn't I? It's the risk/reward thing again (like with the oracle): Going Yellow first means we might end up with yellow as well as green and probably more cities but we may also be shut off ourselves, ending up with only a - in all honesty - pretty bad city at yellow dot. With green spot first we're guaranteed a great city (if we lose the next spot we go for this discussion is moot anyway so let's not assume that ) with the (low) chance to extend our land grab. Please keep in mind that we're not particularly stable economywise, we can't spawn cities as we please. With only 1 gold, zero coastal cities, zero trade routes, we might end up in a deep hole... Zigs or not.I am not sure. I want to do too much all at once! On one hand, I want to take away the corn in yellow dot away from Alex. On the other, I want to push West and shut him in from what appears to be a peninsula there. That is why I am throwing ideas out there hoping you or Revent will help me solidify my thinking and priorities. (Hint, hint! )
Health benefit from fresh water is neutralized by harbours. But yeah, settling coastal is a lot for the sake of being coastal. We'll want a few harbours with decent production (what the northern cities won't provide) to get some galleons out for example. We'll also want a scouting WB very soon, to ensure we find any islands connected by coast (they have big TR boosts and we might find more AIs).I am not big on settling on the coast for the sake of settling on the coast. That city doesn't have sea-food. The trade routes don't matter as due the weird way they work, we should get trade just by sharing any water tiles within our Civ's boundaries. That fresh water lake should by itself give us trade with any city that has it in its culture boundaries. Being on coastal allows us to build lighthouse. But this only turns all those tiles food neutral. Harbours are nice, but nothing spectacular. I am not saying settling there is a bad move. My point is that settling on the coast becomes a wash without any great advantage, while losing fresh water for health.
Look at the SGOTM threads to get an idea of how to prioritise things It's helped my game quite a bit!I am not sure. I want to do too much all at once! On one hand, I want to take away the corn in yellow dot away from Alex. On the other, I want to push West and shut him in from what appears to be a peninsula there. That is why I am throwing ideas out there hoping you or Revent will help me solidify my thinking and priorities. (Hint, hint! )
One off coast is still not preferable most of the times. Settling on the hill will also provide a defensive bonus if Alex decides to attack us there.I am not big on settling on the coast for the sake of settling on the coast. That city doesn't have sea-food. The trade routes don't matter as due the weird way they work, we should get trade just by sharing any water tiles within our Civ's boundaries. That fresh water lake should by itself give us trade with any city that has it in its culture boundaries. Being on coastal allows us to build lighthouse. But this only turns all those tiles food neutral. Harbours are nice, but nothing spectacular. I am not saying settling there is a bad move. My point is that settling on the coast becomes a wash without any great advantage, while losing fresh water for health.
You guys wanted to tech pottery last, and after that we decided on writing so that's what I went for. I'm fine with going fishing now (benefit of binary research hehe) though I still find it silly An advantage of sticking to writing is that we have another non-upkeep item to build in our cities...Revent said:@Myst: Weren't you gonna go Fishing->Pottery?
Anyway, I think Writing->Fishing seems right for now. Do we direct research Alpha? or do the trade bait stuff and go Aesthetics?
X-post with Revent.
You guys wanted to tech pottery last, and after that we decided on writing so that's what I went for. I'm fine with going fishing now (benefit of binary research hehe) though I still find it silly An advantage of sticking to writing is that we have another non-upkeep item to build in our cities...
I'd say we tech alpha ourselves. Not sure we'll be able to trade for it too soon (though we probably won't need to). I'd say we HAVE to tech IW after the basic techs (up to writing) are done.
@Revent: Plan sounds good, but I don't think you should continue long after the next city is settled. At least for a quick update, you can continue again though. I'm not sold on that whip. If the rax indeed is at 29/50 then it's pretty bad. Early in the game, whips should always be for 2pop (excluding monuments or WBs in new cities) because of low -cap. If you want to do a 1-pop-whip I'd spend more time on pop5 and whip the rax only shortly before it's done.
If you do whip, make sure to regrow uruk instantly (after the overflow went into the settler) on a warrior or something.
RE worker MM: Come to think of it, it'd probably make sense to move the one on the corn towards Uruk, chop another forest for the settler and hook up the cows. We have a TR with Asoka and probably can gift it to him. That way the worker is busy until the settler is done and the 2 can go set up green dot.
Another X-post hehe
Seems we're sold on green then (in favour of yellow), right? Another option is to move green 1E though we'd also have to move pink spot.