Blaze's FfH MaxMod

[MagisterCultuum]

I haven't played the newest version, but I believe that Rith does not have any promotions available to it while in its humanoid form; it must morph into an animal to be able to level up.

 

[Gutus]

I have one concern regarding this hero promotiion thing. Can it be modified to only let this happen if an experienced unit from your side, of at least 4th level kills an enemy gets the hero? I mean I can see a fluff problem if e.g. unexperienced 13 str. heavy crossbowman, kills in a 'hard' fight a 2str hero (even if he has a lot of upgrades) and gets the promotion. I would name this easy win. like searching for a 600 years old, near death Yoda just to claim the title of Yoda punisher.

 

[cvlowe]

I got Rith leveled up to a hill giant, and have him running around the clan lands beating up their city defenders in a constant loop, one city to the next, to the next I got pissed- they are on my southern border and being at peace with the barbs, the barbs kept sneaking up through that border to try and attack me. So as punishment I am keeping Sheelba beat down! About 250 exp now, any promotions left are basically useless. But definitely promotable.

As for the hero thing- it seems to be mostly useless as it is usually my heroes getting promoted to "hero". There needs to be a check to prevent that.

 

[BlazeRedSXT]

Yeah, I am not sure what it is about the Shapeshifter function, but I don't think Rith was ever meant to be anything but wild as his nature(err, must keep shifted to gain experience).

As to the Hero issues. I can see that might very well be an issue, with T4 units just rolling over earlier Heroes, but lets be honest, even at 600 Yoda kicked ass. That aside, even older, weaker, venerable Heroes still carry the prestige of their name/title. Sometimes just being lucky is enough to make your name in the world, so I would hate to make it level based before one could do so.

Question, haven't checked this out, but, if a Hero unit defeats a Hero, does his name get changed? That would be the most serious issue to my mind about it. I'll see if I can't get a check in for that.

Cheers!

 

[cvlowe]

Once Rith shapeshifted once, I can not get him back to human form, so that is a non-issue.

Yes, heroes do gain other titles / names when they defeat another hero, plus trigger the whole "a unit has become heroic" thing. Kind of seems pointless since they supposedly are heroic already

 

[MagisterCultuum]

You can get him back into elven form if he is not at too high a level. It randomly chooses an available form, typically choosing one of the higher ones. If you shift him to a lion and then shift him back before leveling him up, then he will return to his original form. This is not really advisable, since it is his weakest form. He does keep his promotions and xp through his shifts.

The heros gaining new tiles is a little annoying, but I do like getting my heros whi lacked hero to get the promotion.

 

[BlazeRedSXT]

Yeah, I'll fix it so existing Heroes don't have that happen. I have actually built up forces of somewhat lower tier units to dogpile other civs Heroes... Let them expend themselves to wear the Hero down , then send in the unit I want to have the promotion So, I really hadn't tried to take a hero with another hero for some time. I'll get it fixed. Technically, Acheron isn't a Hero, but what do you think about making the unit who defeats him into a Hero? Makes sense doesn't it? Maybe instead of a random Rename, give him an old school Dragon Slayer name/title?

Rith actually doesn't do random shifts. Unfortunately, depending on his level on Combat promotions, he can change between 2 forms. In theory, If you just promoted him to Combat 3,if he is in his Combat 1 form, he will go to his Combat 2 form first, then go back and forth between 2 and 3. Now that I am outlining this, I think I will probably change this so that his forms are more level dependent, in case someone doesn't necessarily want to load him out with Combat promotions.

Cheers!

 

[MagisterCultuum]

Sounds good to me. How about generating a random name followed by "the Dragon Slayer," or perhaps by ", Slayer of [insert dragon's name here]"

How about making it give hero for defeating any world unit. Whoever killed the Baron or Typhoid would surely become known for it.

 

[BlazeRedSXT]

Probably, but they are pretty minor compared to a Red Dragon! I did some quick hunting and found the name of a legendary russian dragon slayer... still not sure if that particular title should over-ride a current heroes name or not... probably not is my initial impression.

Cheers!

 

[cvlowe]

Yeah, I'll fix it so existing Heroes don't have that happen. I have actually built up forces of somewhat lower tier units to dogpile other civs Heroes... Let them expend themselves to wear the Hero down , then send in the unit I want to have the promotion So, I really hadn't tried to take a hero with another hero for some time. I'll get it fixed. Technically, Acheron isn't a Hero, but what do you think about making the unit who defeats him into a Hero? Makes sense doesn't it? Maybe instead of a random Rename, give him an old school Dragon Slayer name/title?

Rith actually doesn't do random shifts. Unfortunately, depending on his level on Combat promotions, he can change between 2 forms. In theory, If you just promoted him to Combat 3,if he is in his Combat 1 form, he will go to his Combat 2 form first, then go back and forth between 2 and 3. Now that I am outlining this, I think I will probably change this so that his forms are more level dependent, in case someone doesn't necessarily want to load him out with Combat promotions.

Cheers!

Yeah, but who doesn't promote heroes combat 1-5, heroic strength 1 and 2? Other units might get mobility or city defense earlier on, but heroes are too valuable.

 

[BlazeRedSXT]

Generally, I completely agree with you, but at the same time, one of the mantras for the FfH team is, leave the players the choice(as much as possible obviously ). Anyway, I thought in that spirit, it would be nice to give folks the option. Obviously, when you reach a level certainly going up the combat tree is something you can do, but why not leave the option open?
The only thing is, I am thinking of spacing out the levels, to every other level gets you a new form.. that may be too slow? but then, since he is a Hero, it doesn't necessarily have any risk behind waiting that long... I'm going to test it at that level and see.

cheers!

 

[jwin]

I'm still having trouble with the shapeshifter. He has 40xp and still has not been given the option to either level up or shapeshift. Is there some mechanism I am missing with him? (ie does he have to defeat an animal, or have wolf pens or something else? Or maybe a button I am missing somewhere?)

On another note, the forts doing damage seems a little too much if you have a powerful stack in it. Before declaring war on on Mahala, I built a fort at our border and put my troops in it. After I declared war, I simply waited a few turns for his troops to came and decimate themselves before I even attacked them, then used them to level up assassins and catapults. The fort was doing around 75 hp damage, which I think may be too much.

 

[cvlowe]

I'm still having trouble with the shapeshifter. He has 40xp and still has not been given the option to either level up or shapeshift. Is there some mechanism I am missing with him? (ie does he have to defeat an animal, or have wolf pens or something else? Or maybe a button I am missing somewhere?)

It's the button that looks like bloom.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

It does seem like it should get a new icon, doesn't it?

 

[BlazeRedSXT]

Quite, It could use a new button, but I have the artistic flare of cave lichen.. so if anyone here is up for it .

As far as fort damage is concerned... there are certain concerns with it still. I didn't write the original module myself(I don't have near that much knowledge at this point), and in fact, Maniac wrote a similar one that just did the slow, and not any of the damage, but I liked the damage feature. In theory, the other Civs could stack forts also, sadly, the AI isn't quite up to that yet... but someday it will be. I think you'll find, if you use the latest version, I added City walls into the function, so when you actually get to one of thier cities, you will have trouble with the massive stacks the AI tends to store in their capitals . For the time being anyway, eventually we'll get some AI functions worked in to make forts more useful for them.

Cheers!

 

[[NWO]_Valis]

Definitely a unit witch kills Acheron should get the '...the Dragon Slayer' mark BUT, the unit that kills the dragon slayer shouldn't! The same could go for the Baron and Mary.

As I understand if a unit kills a hero it gets the hero promotion. Then if that unit dies the unit witch killed it gets the hero promotion. It is like being a hero is a disease I propose that the secondary 'offspring' of a hero shouldnt spread the promotion or make it only a chance to give it to the next unit. Especially if high tier units will get a hero promotion then it can get ugly. A spartanoi or flurry with a hero promo would be a kill. A human player would be able to 'gather/hunt' for those promotions and then direct it so his T4 units will get it. Then he will be unstoppable. Tat seems a little exploitable for me.

 

[Gutus]

Although I back the proposal that 'Dragon Slayer' should only go to the unit, which had slayed a dragon, but... Maybe lets not make it a standard hero promotion, maybe just something like benefit for defence (the unit is using dragon skin for defence) and like ability to sell the unit for 1000gp (because of all the artifacts the unit is using). OK maybe the idea with selling isnt that good anyway, but a buff to defence, like 80% would be handy (dragon skin promotion). Then we could use the same mechanics as proposed by Valis to test if the promotion could be passed (it will be as the skin was deteriorating over time, becoming useless after 4 pass), like -25% chance each try.

I would also say the same thing for hero promotion. Let the chance be lowered at each attempt, if thats possible, or just make it lower in general, not 100%, more like 50% +/-1rand(40). It would be like - not each hero slayer is worthy enough.

EDIT: What are the requirements for an icon? I mean max size, width/length, ideas what should be on it? If I understand alll this correctly, you were speaking of a shapeshift icon?

 

[BlazeRedSXT]

Once the name of Dobrynja is given, he becomes jsut another Hero, so the person who kills him just becomes renowned for killing another Hero, and does not get the name of a dragonslayer.

Since I've lost T4 and Hero units to masses of AI troops storming me, I am not sure how terrible it is, from an exploit point... sure it makes t4 units tougher, but...
That said, I think something can get put together to have "new" Heroes that are slain don't necessarily pass along their promotion. In order to make it a decreasing chance, I think a new SDK function would have to be created akin to werewolf counter, that might be beyond me. It might be possible to do it all via python, but that would be a big CPU load, so I'd avoid that, but a general random should be possible. I'll see about putting it in.

I have no idea about the actual button size, but folks around here would, or it is something that can be hunted down in the Tutorial area of the forums. All I know is its a 3-6kb DDs file . As to what sort of image it should have... good question, I don't think I have any preference, let your creativity run with it.

Cheers!

 

[Gutus]

Thanks, found it already, it says 60x60 pix buttons are good. i will work on this, abd BTW. It reminds of one thing. As I get one of my archmages, then one of his higher - tier spells has no button, just the pink box instead. I will check this and confirm, but I think it was some spell which is blowing opponents away from the caster (but for now, I am not 100% sure).

EDIT: I have the version one. What is the most commonly found thing, thats sci-fi related and is shapeshifting? Answer - Odo, so that is my first proposal for the shapshift button - Odo.

, or just his bucket

If you approve this, than please PM me with details, on how to send you this.

 

[cvlowe]

Quite, It could use a new button, but I have the artistic flare of cave lichen.. so if anyone here is up for it .

As far as fort damage is concerned... there are certain concerns with it still. I didn't write the original module myself(I don't have near that much knowledge at this point), and in fact, Maniac wrote a similar one that just did the slow, and not any of the damage, but I liked the damage feature. In theory, the other Civs could stack forts also, sadly, the AI isn't quite up to that yet... but someday it will be. I think you'll find, if you use the latest version, I added City walls into the function, so when you actually get to one of thier cities, you will have trouble with the massive stacks the AI tends to store in their capitals . For the time being anyway, eventually we'll get some AI functions worked in to make forts more useful for them.

Cheers!

I built the Angel hero with immortality. He got killed by a stack of Lanun, went back and took out his killers a few turns later (the Nexus ROCKS!) and became "heroic"