BOTM 04 First Spoiler

When I thanked DS for giving us builders a chance to go Wonder Happy, I had no idea how kind he was being. Thank you DS. :goodjob:

I played several test games to see if CS sling is possible and it turned out if I keep 2 gold’s to work it is possible. So it was either settling in place or 1W since 1E would waste a perfectly good cottage plot. Moving west seems the best since it will add 4 more river tiles.

The Start
Settled 1W on turn 0 and went for Myst and Poly hoping for an early religion. In my tests only once I founded a religion but I did have 3 spiritual civs in them. Well the darn English founded Hinduism without colonizing India. During this time the warrior went NE and followed the cost line south. Gil's warrior found us and our warrior went to snoop in his terrain and find one warrior and a sweet city site. Churchill salivate and make new plan to rush. By this time the worker was done and start building warriors, six in all. I am not as brave as some of my fellow civfanatics. The worker mined the pigs and one gold and roaded toward Sumaria. The second warrior was scouting west at the time and I recall him to join the stack. 3 turn warriors at 2 pop were nice. On or before turn 60 we attack and capture Gil's cap. One of the warriors in the stack was badly injured a turn earlier by a lion and I intended him to capture the worker, but I forgot to separate him from the stack and watch Gil's worker run out of site IBT:sad:. Next turn there was a lion on that tile licking his chops. Oh well.

Settlements and End Game plan
During the testing I realized that my wonder habit goes better with a culture game than Science ( but not the fastest culture game). So I figured I will go for a culture game. So the capital's first non warrior built was a settler since I was not going to build the SH. But after 3 turns I switched to SH and chopped one forest to complete it. Next the English completed a settler each in cap and Gil's place. In the mean time England founded Judaism, learned Agg, AH, Mason, Mono, BW and Priesthood. (Completely forgot Medi for monasteries) With four cities we headed toward CS sling learning writing, CoL (Confusionism) and Math. York was founded west of Sumeria with Pigs, corn and many forest and the fourth claimed copper, pigs, marble and corn east of Sumeria.

After the Oracle -> CS sling, England adopted Burac, Cast Sys and OR. Next it was a race to build the Mids and ToA. So the fifth city was in the deep west claiming a pig and the stone. Marble city built ToA with one chop and York built Mids with 3 chops. It would go on to build the HG later. By this time the English founded two more religions with a GP (Christianity) and a GS (Tao). An unwanted GM is hanging around to activate a GA in the middle of the 10th century and build all the Chapels and Mandira’s. (I am so tempted to settle him in the Capital for the free food and gold.)

Current Situation
As 500 AD came around, 2 other cities were established as missionary factories near the capital. Each's build order is a Grainary, CourtH, 2 Monasteries and then Missionaries with temples as needed. Each will work on two different religion first and then two others next. Churchill is about to finish drama and have already completed music. So the free artist is just hanging around not knowing what to do. Science is at about 50% and about to dive down since we are going to found 4 new cities, 2 of them will run about 4-5 artists as soon as possible and one of them can run about 7-9 eventually. Other city will be a cottage and production city near the ivory (odd combo). Once these Cities are at pop 4, I intend to switch to Pacifism. With 5 religions, I intend to build as many Monastaries and special religious buildings in each city while shutting down science and building gold for a while for buying buildings. I plan to make the switch to US in the 10th century during the GA.

Next I am going to head toward Liberalism to get Nationalism. I was planning to go get Democracy from Liberalism but going to try something different.

Help
BTW, I have a problem and need a bit of help. The Capital makes over 40cpt and two others make over 25 cpt and all three are heavily cottaged. Then there is Gil's Place, which gave me 2 GS's and now working on GA's and is about to complete the Parthenon. It too has a few cottages and built a lib, market, CH, a monastery and a temple. I do not know which I want to use as my two other culture city's. The other two are about to complete the needed CH so I can build the FP nearby or in the ToA city and then they are going to build more WW and Monasteries. I need to figure out which of these three I am going to build a theater in since I still need to build many temples. Since I intend to have over 12 cities, I was going to build temples in the three culture cities only if needed. (Temples have the worst hammers per cpt ratio.) How would any of you do it? I am leaning toward going for 4 culture cities at the moment :crazyeye:. Thanks for any comments.
 
contender, conquest loss 3700BC. :crazyeye:

Ok. I will take the bait. How in the world did this happen? The only way this could happen is that you were building a worker and when you DOW Gil with one warrior his scouting warrior was in the fog near London. No that can't be, too early. Can it? Am I off or way off? Did you retire?

I for one took Obormot's advise (botm3)and did go after the nearest civ, but with 6 warriors. Since I lost 3 I feel good about bringing more along.

I can't wait to try what Ribannah did and see how effective that is.

EDIT: I actually had 7 all togather and since Ribannah had 4, I guess it is plenty. Next time.:D
 
I can't wait to try what Ribannah did and see how effective that is.
I lost two of my four Warriors. Almost only one. Two casualties is about average against Warriors on a hill, but it happens that you lose three, so if you can you should attack with a minimum of four. A city-attack promotion from killing animals will help.
 
Help
BTW, I have a problem and need a bit of help. The Capital makes over 40cpt and two others make over 25 cpt and all three are heavily cottaged. Then there is Gil's Place, which gave me 2 GS's and now working on GA's and is about to complete the Parthenon. It too has a few cottages and built a lib, market, CH, a monastery and a temple. I do not know which I want to use as my two other culture city's. The other two are about to complete the needed CH so I can build the FP nearby or in the ToA city and then they are going to build more WW and Monasteries. I need to figure out which of these three I am going to build a theater in since I still need to build many temples. Since I intend to have over 12 cities, I was going to build temples in the three culture cities only if needed. (Temples have the worst hammers per cpt ratio.) How would any of you do it? I am leaning toward going for 4 culture cities at the moment :crazyeye:. Thanks for any comments.
I don't know, but I built almost no cottages so far. Because of the shortage of food resources they didn't seem effective to me. There is so much to build that even now science is running far ahead.
I'm amazed that you got the Temple of Artemis though. In my game, the AI completed it in 1125bc.
 
The only way this could happen is that you were building a worker and when you DOW Gil with one warrior his scouting warrior was in the fog near London. No that can't be, too early. Can it? Am I off or way off? Did you retire?

I found empty Gil capital and declared war to him. Next turn there was warrior-defender and my warrior lost battle (at 3% for win :D). Next turn my capital was captured.
 
I found empty Gil capital and declared war to him. Next turn there was warrior-defender and my warrior lost battle (at 3% for win :D). Next turn my capital was captured.
That is very interesting ... I actually found that same situation about 10 turns into the game, I came upon Uruk and there was no warrior in it. I thought about DOW and trying to take him out right away, but I decided I wanted to let him live a while longer to 1) let him build workers for me (which he eventually did -- maybe 4-5 of them) & maybe give me something to pillage, and 2) to let Uruk grow to > 1 so that I could capture & keep it instead of raze it (that also happened).

It's also very weird that you lost your capital only two turns after DOW on him? Are you saying that you DOWed on him when he had a unit only 2 moves from your only city and you had no defenders in it to stop him???

No offense, but if you did that you kinda deserved what you got.
 
Help
BTW, I have a problem and need a bit of help. The Capital makes over 40cpt and two others make over 25 cpt and all three are heavily cottaged. Then there is Gil's Place, which gave me 2 GS's and now working on GA's and is about to complete the Parthenon. It too has a few cottages and built a lib, market, CH, a monastery and a temple. I do not know which I want to use as my two other culture city's.... I am leaning toward going for 4 culture cities at the moment :crazyeye:. Thanks for any comments.

Cottage-based cities usually end up with the most culture output once the cottages have had a chance to grow and you're able to switch to 100% culture slider. So you'll probably want to use the three cities with the best potential for cottages as your legendary cities. If there are four good candidates I recommend picking the ones that have the oldest (most mature) cottages and/or built some wonders or cultural buildings early on. Remember that cultural buildings that are around long enough output extra culture. The capital is almost always one of the three.

Another thing to consider is a Great Person farm to produce Great Artists. You could have one city pull double-duty as a Legendary culture city and GA farm, but if you have the luxury to separate these tasks it'll probably give better overall results. (Getting hammers and whipping to build cathedrals can be tough if you're running loads of specialists, and vice versa.) So if one of the four cities you're considering would be an especially good Great Artist generator, maybe you should reserve it for that purpose and have the other 3 be your legendary cities.
 
It's also very weird that you lost your capital only two turns after DOW on him? Are you saying that you DOWed on him when he had a unit only 2 moves from your only city and you had no defenders in it to stop him???

i do not remember all the events exactly... there is a chance that mentioned events was separated by more than one turn.

No offense, but if you did that you kinda deserved what you got.

agree! but as I remember, I did not see any danger when I DOW on Gil.
 
i do not remember all the events exactly... there is a chance that mentioned events was separated by more than one turn.

...

agree! but as I remember, I did not see any danger when I DOW on Gil.
Yeah your original description doesn't quite sound right in that context, it must have been more than one turn. If he took your capital only two turns after you DOW with a warrior, then it is impossible that you would not have seen Gil's unit only two squares away from your capital (most of those squares are even inside the fat cross)

It sounds like you decide to put all your money down on a single roll of the dice (could you get to his undefended capital before he got to yours), you are much bolder than me!
 
It may be interesting to know!

While I was looking for a map to play recent gauntlet, I find out bug in BTS.
If player captured AI's capital before his own capital was founded then there is no palace in captured city! I used option No City Razing and captured cities size 1.
 
Noobie Here. Have only played CIV for a couple months and got hooked. Bought Warlords and BTS about a month ago. I finished the last BTS Game of the Month with a win in the mid 1900s but wasn't sure how to submit it so it remains in my personal HOF. I will submit this one though (as soon as I figure out what I am doing.:confused:

As to the game:Contender, with not a clue or wit of strategy towards a victory type. I need to figure out what spies do and Corporations are confusing. After settling I wandered around until finding SUMERIA and my pal Gilly. Like others have mentioned I saw a worker alone and decided Oh, what the heck. With sweaty hands I grabbed thw worker and ran for home- and then to the refrigerator for some more adult courage!:D( You have to remember I have only played a few CIV games and have never tried this although I have read about it in strategy articles.) To my suprise Gilly excepted peace a few turns later Sooo lets do it again. And it worked again, (Thanks in part to my refrigerator courage:D) The second and third time I visited my buddy Gil I think I razed his newly created Cities and went back to peacefully building my own. Enough is enough and I just had to have the rest of the continent so ended poor Gilly"s reign in 340AD. It was fun playing with him:lol:

500 AD -A navy would help and they survive longer when built out of Iron:crazyeye::scan:
 
Because of Gilga's nice starting city location, I think it was optimal to knock him out quickly.
Experience makes for memorable lessons. :agree:

I've took Gilga capitol. I've build the oracle for MC and the GL later. I've got Col too. at ~150-200 AD i've got Astro.
Wow Hellwitch, Astronomy at 200 AD is impressive. I wasn't even able to bulb Optics until 160 AD, and I thought I followed a fairly straight path. How did you do it? :help: I've been reading up on slingshots, lightbulbs, and just better tech performance in general, and I know I've got a lot to learn, but I'd still allowed myself to feel a bit smug about my tech path in this game -- until I saw your post. :blush: My astronomy won't arrive until a fair few years after 500 AD. Can I coax, flatter, cajole, or maybe bribe you into sharing your strategic wisdom on the subject? :worship:
 
Using the basic save game.

I settled in place and scouted east to find Gilga early. I decided to try snatching a worker, then choke him and see where it goes (haven't played for a long time so didn't feel confident at all about doing a Warrior rush, although this would have worked since I found his capital as poorly defended as many others here). Took one worker from him, then left my warrior on the hill outside his capital on choke duty -- nothing happened on this front for a long time, so I decided to Axe rush Gilga later when I saw Copper close to my capital.

I founded a mediocre second city west of the capital to grab the copper, but it was ok since that way I could also use some of the river grasslands which would otherwise have gone to waste (with the added benefit of having some shared cottages that can grow really fast now).

The Axes took quite some time, so not surprisingly Gilga had Archers when my Axemen were ready for duty, so now I needed Cats as well. Researched CoL, then Math->Construction and did a CS slingshot way before AD (never had a doubt this would work since I was rushing Mathematics en route to Construction anyway). I worked both gold mines most of the time, which I totally loved since both research and production flowed along nicely in the capital.

When my Cat/Axe army was finally going for Gilga he had some Vultures in addition to his Archers -- not a problem at all, as I've found (I had Barracks in both of my cities, so all my Axes had at least City Raider I and the Cats had Barrage of course). Gilga had evacuated a Settler via ship in the meantime which had founded a second city south. I captured his capital (with another settler inside for a free worker) and his second a last city a few turns later.
Gilga no more and loads of promoted Axemen hanging around with nothing more to do for a long time (except for capping any Barbarian cities that are left now, I've seen one so far that I might even keep).

Situation at 55AD:
  • CS slingshotted, Alphabet researched, and bee-lining Machinery->Compass->Optics now for an early circumnavigation and making lots of contacts, maybe even spreading my religion, to keep the Diplomatic option as open as possible.
  • Only one Wonder built (Oracle) and no great people yet.
  • Quite a few villages around my first two cities already, so together with the gold mines and Gilga's juicy cities my research should continue to be top-notch.
  • Got the continent to myself, save for some Barb cities I'm going to take shortly, so there are many options available now (I'm not going to do Cultural however, since I've done that too often already).

(I'm not at 500 AD yet but since I'm not going to submit and obviously won't meet any other Civs for a while I lurked ahead :-).

Since I've done Cultural Victory way too often already I'm probably now going for either Domination or Diplomatic Victory to keep things interesting.

If it wasn't for Ribannah who showed in the first post already what actually IS possible in this game I would probably be quite complacent at this point :-).

BTW can somebody explain why I know Native Americans? This question wasn't answered yet (should we know?)
 
BTW can somebody explain why I know Native Americans? This question wasn't answered yet (should we know?)

It happened unintentionally during my editing of the map. After trying and failing a couple of times to get rid of it, I 'strategically' decided it would make for an interesting Easter egg (it is Easter after all), so left it in.
 
I noticed that Giglamesh had contact with Sitting Bull as well.
 
I tried the warrior rush this month cause I didn't do it last month and regretted that...

I trained 3 warriors and assaulted Sum's capitol with 4 warriors against 1. Disgusted with my luck I abandoned the game after my first 3 attacks failed to make a dent in the warrior. Obivously my last warrior lost too...

:cry:
 
I trained 3 warriors and assaulted Sum's capitol with 4 warriors against 1. Disgusted with my luck I abandoned the game after my first 3 attacks failed to make a dent in the warrior. Obivously my last warrior lost too...
But why abandon? That had to be very early, and not that difficult to recover from. I'll be writing a real spoiler if I can find the RL time.

But here are the basics. I settled 1W on to keep both golds for the early research. I scouted with my warrior NE then down the eastern coast until I found Gilga and his prime location. I built worker first and then a couple warriors and then a settler. Researched Hunting and AH for the Pigs, then BW hoping for early metals this time (see Murky Waters last succession game). I settled York next to the copper on the desert square. I stole 1-2 workers waiting for my metals to arrive and to keep Gilga down early. I captured Uruk, had the continent to my self, and went on a wonder building spree. That is where I lost focus.:crazyeye: I was kind of thinking Space, then somewhere along the line decided to try for an AP Diplo win. Needless to say, I'm having a great time building lots of "stuff" but my lack of focus will ensure a rather late victory date.:sad:
 
It happened unintentionally during my editing of the map. After trying and failing a couple of times to get rid of it, I 'strategically' decided it would make for an interesting Easter egg (it is Easter after all), so left it in.
:-)

I've made "strategic" use of the fact already by researching Paper and trading maps with Sitting Bull to see most of the world without even building a single ship.
 
I did not warrior rush Giglimesh because I saw the nearby copper and did not see the need, instead using him as a cost free worker production plant. What was key for me was though I did not try to take Uruk I pillaged around it and got a warrior south of his city to keep workers off the copper tiules when he made city #2. This kept him from getting units beyound and archer and any real development in general. So when i came at him with axes and catipults, he was not a problem.

To me the key wasn't taking him out early, but knee-capping him so that he could never progress and become easy prey.
 
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