[BTS] BOTM 195: Julius Caesar, Always-War - First Spoiler - 1AD

[DynamicSpirit]

BOTM 195: Julius Caesar, Monarch - First Spoiler - 1AD

Use this thread to tell us what happened in your game, up to 1AD. How are your relations with the AI? Are you friends with any of them? I guess not . Maybe I should start with, are you still alive?

So how are you surviving Always War? What did you do with your great people (if not playing challenger)? Have you founded cities or captured them?

Reading Requirements
If you are participating in BOTM 195, then you MUST NOT read this thread unless EITHER

• You have reached at least 1 AD in your game, OR
• You have submitted your entry

Posting Restrictions

• Do not disclose ANY events or information gained post 1 AD.
• Do not reveal your final result if that happened after 1 AD.
• Do not discuss the location of resources that may not show up before 1 AD (Iron is OK, coal and oil are not)
• Do not post any savegame file from the game. Discussions and screenshots are fine but not actual games

 

[Tobiyogi]

Challenger Save.
That's my kind of game. Also I like the land we have here. I was already decided to settle the eastern stone next, but then I found copper to the north and made this my second city. 3rd city on the stone. 4th city between Corn and Horses. Everything on a hill.

Spoiler 4 cities, 1525 BC :

The Longbow was golden in the beginning. 3 archers went across my land. With combat 1, I dared to attack them on flatland eventually. TGW was the first wonder. It's a decent cheat to build that and let the AI deal with the barbs, I know. But what can you do

First GG did the trick. It came rather soon after 4-5 victory fights. I gave 10 exp to a simple warrior and 10 exp to my longbow. What a huge deal! Woody III Axeman (free upgrade) + Guerilla III Longbow. Now the real choke could begin. Longbow choked China, Axeman Monty, one chariot Genghis, another one Bismarck (but he had nothing interesting), and my 1st warrior was already in Lizzy's forests. 5 civs choked at the same time. Barbs helped me, smashing gold and iron in Mongolia

Lizzy was funny. She stayed at one city, beelined Monotheism, founded Judaism, and had no techs to improve anything. So her worker just sat in the city. I was nervous because I didn't get any workers for quite a while, but with my GG-units, I took eventually more than I could use.

Spoiler Judaism 2150 BC :

It's 95 BC now, Cumae (3rd city) has become a killer-commerce-spot and soon there will be the forum. I think forums in every place with nice cottages.

Spoiler Cumae :

Lizzy is captured, monty 1 city and Qin 2 cities left. Several wonders have been built (Mids, HG, TGW, Zeus very soon and maybe Mausallos + Epics with marble from Bejing).

The land is good, doesn't look like this at first glance. Iron is a bit awkard to get, but I settled it with my 5th city next to Genghis. Then I went only with Catapults, no pure Praetorian-Rush, because I don't like the odds. Louis and Toku are the only ones who have sent stacks so far.

Think this will be a save domination win at a rather early date.

 

[Noble Zarkon]

Wow impressive work!

I'm still alive at 1AD - that's better than I expected!

I turtled up as the land around us is so poor. 3 cities on a hill and a 4th (barb) flipped to us by the GA culture bomb and it's been ok, stacks haven't been too frightening and most have them have died trying to attack my walled capital or my 2 GG Longbows.

Scientist built an Academy. Great Wall first obviously, then looking for iron which was found in a horrible spot :-( Maybe should have settled on it but then that gives up the hill.

 

[Tobiyogi]

I did not settle on the iron neither, 1SE. Wanted the hill and the fur to the south, also some possible farms to make that city a bit more useful.

With a GS, I would have definitely built an Academy too. Cannot really get that thing too early.

 

[Frederiksberg]

I also used the GS for an Academy to increase the early tech rate. The GA was used a bit later for a golden age and a double civic switch to HR and Vassalage.

I did a bit of testing and discovered that if Rome was guarded even by a single warrior the archer scouts would stay away. Thus I went warrior first and sent both longbows to the east. They found London guarded by a single archer and for the loss of one LB the English were destroyed. The surviving LB was sent north to choke Monty. That said my choking game has been unfocused and maybe too cautious. I sent an axe/spear combo to also choke Genghis but after that I lost the thread and probably built too many praetorians.

Built only two wonders: TGW very early (founded Cumae on top of the stone) and Oracle immediately after researching Monarchy thus getting Feudalism as the free tech (I believe @Tobiyogi recommended this). Set off a golden age and did the civic changes. Monty never recovered from the choke and his two poor cities were easily taken by my Praetorians. Got a not so useful GSpy who has been scouting the entire map and a GPriest who bulbed Theology. Settled a couple of GG's in Rome that is now building 11XP units.

At 1 AD there are 11 Roman cities. Ghenghis is still alive but has never recovered from the choke and has only two poor jungle cities. The remaining AI are, however, starting to send some stacks of typically 4-5 units. Mostly axe/spear/archer stacks. They will often suicide against my longbow defended cities but in some cases they turn around or fortify which is annoying. I'm going to need more shock promoted Praetorians to root out this problem. Economy is shaky but fortunately I got CoL and have rushed some courthouses. It will take a while to get Currency. Not sure if I should go all out for war or send out some LB chokers first and try to get deeper into the tech tree (To get macemen. Or maybe Literature for HE). Already have Construction. Eliminating Genghis and taking some Chinese cities is anyway on the menu.

 

[nocho]

My game seems somewhat similar to Frederiksberg's. I hadn't done any early testing but went roaming with my LBs anyway, one found London which was destroyed, the other found the Mongol capital, but unfortunately perished against the single archer. If you make bets, you win some you lose some. The surviving LB was moved back quick enough though before any enemies entered the premises. Both great people were settled on T0 by the way.

I also settled stone east first and then built TGW asap. Oracled feudalism and also got the Pyramids. The vassalage/representation combo seems quite nice for a balance between tech and war effort.

Capured an Aztec city, then razed another one and then harrassed the capital for half a millenium before wiping Monty off the map (keeping the capital, and razing the other near resourceless city he had). Made good progress on China, got a Chinese city at some gems and then captured Beijing too, so China is converting itself in an afterthought. Might have kept the Mongols a bit too much off the hook, although they were very lucky against my roaming units (2 LBs), also were able to detect two spies that I sent. Had some hope of stealing a cheap tech there. Two turns away from CS, tech is up to currency, CoL, calendar and feudalism through the Oracle. After this I'll likely beeline engineering. 10 cities, 64 pop, 9 workers at 5BC.

 

[Xcalibrator]

Contender save, game much like others' except for my typically more cautious approach. I settled the Gt Sci and figured I'd use the Gt Artist to culture bomb some nice AI city to bring it out of revolt faster and instantly create a big cultural defense zone, but it never seemed to be worth it, so I'm saving it for a Golden Age. My firstborn GP was a Prophet, and I settled him too. A Gt Spy is out scouting. First settler, like for everyone, went to the SE stone to get the Great Wall. I've also built the Oracle (800, for Currency), Mids (245), Hanging Gardens (80), and I'll have the SoZ in a couple turns--maybe it's better for failgold with all our happiness resources? 11 cities, pop 69. Score at 5 BC is 1202, France is second with 406, and has built the ToA (625) and GLH (155).

I choked England and Mongolia with the longbows--odds to capture London were 60-something percent so I waited, and over time I caught 3 or so workers trying to hook up the iron out on the no-escape peninsula. The first iron I got was the one out west, south of the desert. I like the site down south with silver, iron, furs, and seafood--currently working on Moai there. England succumbed first (once I got cats), Mongolia managed 2 cities before falling (only kept the capital), and the Aztecs will vanish in a couple turns (keeping only the capital of 3). Praets don't do well against roving bands of axemen--I need to get some war elephants soon.

 

[MarleysGh0st]

I decided I really wanted the Great Wall. While playing different opening options in a test game, an AI beat me to the GW two out of three times. So, for the real game I decided on a drastically unusual build order: worker, then settler (while Rome was still at size 1!), then GW. My research order was Hunting, AH, Masonry, BW. I settled the GS in Rome for the early science bonus, then I settled the GA in Antium. Others may have ultimately gotten a larger benefit from the artist, but the +3GPT let me keep running 100% science for a long time, while the +12 culture let my borders pop rapidly. Antium also began with building a worker. After improving the pigs, cattle and gold, both workers started chopping for the GW, which I completed in 2700 BC (turn 52). First goal accomplished!

I didn't get as adventurous with my longbows as others have, but I did pick off all the units I could that strayed within range. After settling six cities, I began an offensive against Elizabeth, capturing her three cities by 230 BC. After settling one more city, I have ten at 1 AD (actually at 5 BC).

 

[ZPV]

Contender save.

My opening was:
Settle the scientist; research BW.
Build a warrior and a half while growing to 2; whip the worker.
Improve the gold, and work it once mined - then research Hunting->AH at a very silly rate.
Worker #2 was partially built while working the gold, and then I grew to size 2 once the pigs were improved.

My longbows walked into Karakorum (well, one died, but the other one captured the city), which meant I had Iron.

Wonders: The Great Wall, The Pyramids, Oracle->Civil Service, The Great Library, The Hanging Gardens (just built with 14 cities).
Tech: I have CS, Philosophy, Metal Casting, Construction, Calendar. I will try and tech up to a stronger unit - probably mounted as usual.
Warfare: Genghis is dead, Elizabeth is dead. Monty is nearly dead. Bismark is kneecapped - I captured Berlin, razed the horse city, and have a Praet hovering next to his disconnected Iron. I don't have enough units over there at the moment to push the attack, but eventually I will.

I think the free artist, and the one from Music will be used to get my land % closer to domination at the end of the game, but I'm not making any promises on that yet.

 

[LANCE1313]

Adventurer Save and first Always War Game ever

Started Roaming with the Long Bows and discovered Mongolia and Lizzy.
2825BC Mongolia Died to a Long Bow.
Sent a normal archer to choke Lizzy. She ultimately came out of her city and killed this archer but I've contained her to 2 cities.
I found Qin Shi and Monty early but didn't explore into their territory. I didn't think i could manage to choke out any additional AI's but based on what you guys have accomplished this appears to have been a mistake, particularly on my difficulty.

As of 5AD, I just took out Lizzy. I've got some catapults, Axemen and Chariots. I've got 8 cities. My plan was to turtle slightly and fill out my controlled territory with additional cities and develop the existing ones. Unfortunately I've got a bunch of troops advancing on karakorum. 2 stacks with 6 + 7 troops respectively made up of Axemen, archers, spearmen. These are mostly from Toku (Which I haven't found yet) and some from Louis and Qin. I'm a bit worried about this but I'll deal with it.

Overall I'm happy with how I've played. I've been cranking out a lot more troops than I normally do. I'd normally build more buildings which I believe is a classic beginners mistake.

 

[Mitchum]

Contender Save

I settled in place. I settled the scientist on T0 and ended up settling the artist in the capital on about T50. I should have done it on T0 but I though it might be useful in some other way but the +3gpt was what I wanted to keep my research going.

I built a warrior and then a worker. My LBs went out worker hunting/choking.

By 2000 BC I had 4 cities, 5 workers (4 stolen - 1 from England, 2 from Aztecs, 1 from China), 2 LBs, 4 archers, 6 axes.

I saw an iron in the desert and one in England. I decided to take the one from England so I sent my axes toward her. I took her out in 1225 BC and I had iron. I also continued to choke/worker steal Aztecs, China and Mongols). I researched Construction and set research to 0%.

By 1000 BC I had 6 cites, 19 pops, 11 workers (10 stolen), 2 LBs, 6 archers, 5 cats, 11 axes, 1 spear, 1 medic chariot, 1 civ gone.

In continued to crank out Praets and cats as fast as possible with my economy hitting -40 gpt at 0% research. The Mongols toppled in 750 BC.

By 500 BC I had 8 cites, 28 pops, 13 workers (12 stolen), 1 LB (I lost the other one with a risky worker steal with a half-health LB), 13 Praets, 14 cats, 7 archers, 9 axes, 1 spear, 1 medic chariot, 2 civs gone.

From here, it was pedal to the metal for Conquest before my money dried up.

The starting GS was nice but the two LBs were way over-powered in my opinion. I could move them around the map with near immunity and not have to worry about anything. I rarely used them to attack because they were perfect for worker stealing, especially once they had 5 exp for guerilla II promotions.

 

[WastinTime]

AI archers in my test game would not enter my culture, so I didn't heed the advice to leave 1 LB home . At some point, I moved East and spotted Liz's archer West of me meaning she will get to my capital 2t before I can , in 6 turns I think. Game over.
Wait! I can switch from worker to warrior and it the city will appear empty, but the warrior build will complete before the archer can attack. Surprisingly, the archer sees the warrior and walks past.
Then I realized that only once Henge fully expanded borders, archers don't seem to want to enter my land.

I played on thinking this will be one of my top 10 favorite games. Couldn't wait for the scary stacks.
Alas, nothing. I choked / worker stole from my 4 surrounding AI. All I needed was 2 axes and the 2 LBs.
Killed them all. Germany (archers only) and Izzy were both pushovers. I was all set for a defensive game, but I just keep pushing thru like normal. Fine. It allows me to concentrate on the challenge of winning this game by Diplo/Religious.

 

[WastinTime]

Oh yeah, GS : Academy seemed way better than settling it, just working 1 gold tile put that ahead.
Artist: settled for the research boost from gold.

My test game showed the invasion started about T75, so I planned GWall for then.
There was a spear right next to my copper! ...and I completed the wall, ejecting him from my land.
I can't believe how many barbs have been streaming thru my land to go harass the AI...all game long.
My cities are undefended.

 

[Mitchum]

Where are you at 1AD, WT? How many cities, who is alive, etc.

 

[WastinTime]

Where are you at 1AD, WT?

It's mostly just Japan left.
Since I'm going for Religious VC, I'm playin' around with the AP and holy wars, I did 'gift' a christian city to Isabella, and one to Japan.
I've razed a lot of the West.
I haven't fully explored the NW corner....looking for that elusive, 4-tile island that can support 2 cities as my vassal.

 

[undead]

The first turns were dangerous, even with the advice to be careful. An English archer was rushing to the capital. My longbow man didn't have a single turn to waste, so I moved him back. Then I lost sight of the archer. I continued sending the longbow man to the capital anyway, and that was decisive because the archer suddenly reappeared at the same level! The game could stop there.

About the great people, I waited for 46 turns (or so) to decide. I expected I don't know what. Finally the great scientist built an academy at the capital, and the great artist settled in a city to the east (for the gold and a little for the culture).

I founded 3 cities, one on the iron. I didn't really attack until the praetorians were ready. Some catapults were necessary to conquer London: a longbow man and several praetorians were lost in an unsuccessful attempt without catapults.

I didn't build any cottage for a long time until I realized that many cities were safe, especially after building TGW.

 

[Fine_Distinction]

Oh yeah, GS : Academy seemed way better than settling it, just working 1 gold tile put that ahead.
Artist: settled for the research boost from gold.
.

I was thinking so initially, but this 1 extra hammer is actually huge. Not only the worker is ready couple turns earlier, but with IMP bonus +1 hammer easily turns into +2 hammers with a bit of micro. Again, it was huge early on, especially in my case when I chopped/built settler at size 1 to find a location with more food.

 

[Mitchum]

Yes, the extra hammer is what made me settle the GS instead of building an academy. The longer the game, the better the academy is, I guess.

 

[Fine_Distinction]

Yes, the extra hammer is what made me settle the GS instead of building an academy. The longer the game, the better the academy is, I guess.

yeah, academy is getting better with time, but even in test games, which were much longer than my real game, I was focusing on fighting, not growing my cities very big, focusing on hammers to build units and only enough commerce to research absolutely necessary techs and not to go bankrupt, so at least for me and this Capitol academy was never really impressive. The latter not that easy if you prefer not to raze cities. As @Michum said it is a race to finish while your Last. And basically a conquest economy, not CE, SE, failgold, trade route, espionage, etc. That is why it is unusual but also kinda simpler

BTW, one of the nearby AIs has metal. But in the end it does not matter, Longbow rules Thanks, DS The only problem is I always want to start now with LBs, rofl