[BTS] 3.19 AI Civs can have vassal states prior to Feudalism

[Pep]

I have notice AI Civs can have vassal states without the knowledge of Feudalism in 3.19. It seems to be a bug.

I have attached a screenshot. As you can see, Frederick is vassal of Charlemagne without having Feudalism...

[Edited] Removed the savegame due to quota issues

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I think if it's a colony they can make them any time, and that it isn't unique to 3.19

 

[JujuLautre]

You should provide a save, so that people could actually track the bug if indeed there is one.

 

[Meatbuster]

Are you sure they don't have Feudalism? You don't even have Monarchy, so you can't check if Charlemagne has Feudalism or not.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Are you sure they don't have Feudalism? You don't even have Monarchy, so you can't check if Charlemagne has Feudalism or not.

What are you talking about? You can plainly see nobody has feudalism, if you know how to look.

Hint: Charlemagne wants priesthood. The others "can research monarchy".

 

[Meatbuster]

Hmm... you're right. I didn't check Fred's techs thoroughly.

Conspiracy theory: There is a second Charlemagne on the map.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Also impossible...if you meet a master or vassal you get auto-contact with the other .

 

[Meatbuster]

All right, I'm out of ideas and conspiracy theories.

So it's either a legit bug, WB, or an edited screenshot.

SAVE PLS KTHX GG BAI.

 

[Pep]

All right, I'm out of ideas and conspiracy theories.

So it's either a legit bug, WB, or an edited screenshot.

SAVE PLS KTHX GG BAI.

No, it's not an edited screenshot. I have attached a savegame now and you can download and test it.

What I can confirm is that Frederick is vassal of Charlemagne because Charlemagne formed a new colony. In 3.17, I think, Feudalism was a prerrequisite to form a colony...

 

[Pep]

I think if it's a colony they can make them any time, and that it isn't unique to 3.19

Yes, it's a colony, but I think it wasn't possible in 3.17 without the knowledge of Feudalism.

I have made the following test: started a new game and using the World Builder created 2 settlers on an island. I found two cities and I can grant independence to them from the begining! I think it is a bug and not a feature, because it is not present in 3.19 changelog.

 

[r_rolo1]

It was always possible in BtS to have a colony before Feudalism......

As usual the wording chosen by Firaxis is misleading. When it says in Feudalism tech "Enables vassal states" it should be read "Enables "Vassal State" and "Capitulation" options in the diplomatic window" .......

 

[Meatbuster]

That explains it... but how does one become a vassal of another without those 2 options?

 

[r_rolo1]

The vassal infact is a colony ( colonies by definition are vassals ) It is the only way without going to the diplo screen

 

[Pep]

It was always possible in BtS to have a colony before Feudalism......

As usual the wording chosen by Firaxis is misleading. When it says in Feudalism tech "Enables vassal states" it should be read "Enables "Vassal State" and "Capitulation" options in the diplomatic window" .......

Anyway, I think having a colony before Feudalism can be used as an exploit. In my latest game, I managed to found a colony (in a continent near my mainland) before Code of Laws and Currency. It was very useful to have a Vassal Civ researching techs in parallel, avoiding me the cost of overexpansion before Courthouses...