Buildings Thread

:espionage: does not have as many multipliers but it gets a lot of buildings with a flat bonus so it synergizes well with a large empire, so I'm not sure it's at such a disadvantage. For a National Wonder, maybe the the Intelligence Agency or the Secret Service could take that role. I' don't know what the base building would become, an Embassy?

For more Cathedral-like buildings, that would also be a possible limitation for the Hydro Plant: requires X Levees.
 
Scotland Yard (or whatever it is named in DoC) already serves as espionage doubler, and you can get it relatively easily by spamming simple espionage missions.

Espionage is a tricky beast. It can help you with catching up, but you are ultimately playing a reactive role, so natural tech leaders will probably find little use for it anyway (and there is little use for :espionage: beyond tech stealing and removing city defences). In theory going full Espionage with Constabularies can be a powerful combo, but going full Espionage is something akin to self-imposed challenge.

Culture is still the least desirable of all types of commerce even with all DoC tweaks (Museums, rather claustraphobic map compared to typical Civ4 game etc), so i personally don't mind it scaling better. If you run :culture: slider it's almost always for happiness and/or UHV, not culture itself.
 
Castles give +2XP to siege units and build twice as fast with Hegemony civic, but these go away with the Urban Planning tech which obsoletes them. This tech enables what effectively becomes their replacement, the Star Fort. One could argue it can represent more modern military fortifications or military bases in the late game, since it continues to protect your cities with -50% bombardment damage against all kinds of units. But it doesn't give anything else.
I'd propose having it also give +2XP to your siege units and being built twice as fast with Hegemony (and possibly stone resource as well?). It may warrant some adjustments to the 1700AD scenario because a lot of cities in it start with both Castle and Star Fort despite their civs not having the Urban Planning tech, so they would both work at adding +4XP to siege units and making cities impervious to trebuchets.
 
Why build walls and castles that can't move when I can build archers and cavalry that can? 1 Archer 1 Light Cavalry per city is my fav setup for small empires, 2 Calvary for large empires. No point in waiting around and letting them raze the countryside, no point in having a heavily defended city far behind the front lines. The best static defense is a mobile offense.
 
Honestly the only times i've put it to a good use were builing it in a Siberian city as Russia and in Amazonia as Brazil. Maybe you can make a good NP city as Canada on the Eastern coast. Other civs either have no forests/jungles or can't tech in time to reap the benefits (Congo might have amazing synergy between NP, geographic location and their UP, but that's more theorycrafting than anything).
I wonder what could be done to make it less situational. Add free specialists for Peaks? I don't know if that's possible.
 
Why build walls and castles that can't move when I can build archers and cavalry that can? 1 Archer 1 Light Cavalry per city is my fav setup for small empires, 2 Calvary for large empires. No point in waiting around and letting them raze the countryside, no point in having a heavily defended city far behind the front lines. The best static defense is a mobile offense.
It's all offensive until the six Seljuk doomstacks converge on Antioch and your relief army is still two turns away. Those walls and castle will buy you the time for your mobile reinforcements to get there. The AI will always bombard defenses down first if it can, even on an empty city.
 
I've definitely found that the main time I'll want to use walls and castles is when I expect to be attacked, which, as the player, almost always means "when there are conquerors" and at no other time.
Yeah, pretty much. Exceptions:
-Babylon when you're going for the UHV instead of building bowmen and Assyria has conquered Aleppo already
-Spain when you're crushing a Protestant France and Portugal attacks at Pleased in a random bid to take your northwestern core city
-China and steppe horse archers teleport to Beijing and other frontier cities with no warning
 
Eh, I still prefer spamming horse archers in those scenarios, china and spain's cities are close enough together, babylon I spam bowmen after having all my uhv buildings built, and for civs tjat get targeted by conqueors I have 3 cavarly per city for, 4 if I'm Egypt
 
I would propose that some of the truly late-game buildings be buffed. First of all, when considering whether to build the 4th or 5th building that grants a 25% :science: or :hammers: or :gold: bonus, it is doing proportionally much less than when you build your first forge or market. This is just because of math. Secondly, what is the point of constructing a building that increases research by 25% when there are only 5 or 6 techs left to research? Thirdly, once you're in the final 3-4 columns of techs, you're not playing for the UHV and you're likely to already be snowballing to victory. At this point, continuing to play is because there are awesome, cool things you will be able to do if you just invent the next tech, build the next building, play the next turn. Based on this, I'd argue there is a good case to be made for really buffing many late game buildings. Late game buildings and wonders should be powerful to compensate for the short time when they will be useful before the game is over. I would propose doubling the bonii of the final tier of buildings to 50%: automated factory, logistics center, supercomputer.

In line with this, I would propose seriously buffing some of the latest game wonders. Take the Oriental Pearl Tower as an example. When you finally unlock it, any player is almost guaranteed to be producing multiple thousands of :science: per turn. At best, this wonder is going to get you maybe 50 or 60 :science: per turn. Stacked optimally with multipliers, you are, at best, looking at a few additional percentage points in your science output in exchange for spending many turns of production in a city. I'm not going to be bothered to do the math but it wouldn't shock me if it was a better return to just build research for the number of turns it takes to build the wonder. It is not worth it! These wonders that give middling flat bonuses to a single city are not very good at this point in the game. The same rationale applies to Burj Dubai, Atomium, Global Seed Vault, Space Elevator, etc.

I recognize that to some degree this is a bit of a game design decision, but I would advocate for giving the player some really fun goodies at the end of the tech tree because, at that point, it's not about UHV, it's about finishing some other victory while slogging through long turn times. Make the Pearl Tower 10 :science: per pop, Burj Dubai 3 :commerce: per world corporation. Make the Large Hadron Collider +500%:science:. The Space Elevator Should be absolutely game changing, maybe +20% :science: :hammers: :gold: per space project completed around the world. These are all there to boost your progress towards a space victory. But I think there is a missing niche for a very late game militaristic wonder that would be clearly aligned with making the final push for domination victory. Will have to give that some more thought.
 
This more belongs in a hypothetical "units" thread but I think the last decade of war IRL has proven just how important conventional ballistic missiles are. Yemen bombing Saudi Arabia with old Tochkas, Iran's missile barrages against Israel and assorted U.S. bases (with a friendly warning beforehand), Ukraine using ATACMS against Russia and Russia using Iskanders and Oreshnik against Ukraine... I think it would be cool to have a conventional ballistic missile unit that's much harder to intercept than a cruise missile but has shorter range (well Oreshnik and Iran's missiles are certainly not short-ranged but there are limits to granularity).

Uh, modern military buildings (or projects)...
Early warning radars that improve your chance of interception of missiles/airplanes?
An anti-ballistic missile system like Arrow III or GMD to replace the phantom laser satellites which never had a chance of actually being made and just existed to get the Soviets to burn money?
 
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