Bye bye Roosevelt?

[AppleTheMan]

What do you guys think of this game?

3 Continents
7 Players
Huayna Capac
Going for spacerace
Cottage economy

I just finished a small war with Shaka I started where I took three small cities from him, but Roosevelt seems to be a little too big for my liking. With my capital production powerhouse pumping out knights I don't think it should be too hard, I just need siege equipment. I found it very helpful to manage to convert my two neighbors on my continent to my religion... as enemies, I see all their cities, and know where their troops are. At the moment I am going to liberalism.

I have a GP in my capitol, should I use him to start a golden age, or is it better to save him for latter?

Should a farm a little?

Zara seems to be winning on one of the other continents... as usual...

Any advice would be fantastic!

 

[Root Beer]

What kind of GP? If it's a prophet I would put that in your gold city and later build a wall street in that city

EDIT: Had a look at the save, after you research education I recommend engineering for trebs. there is a nice forest that will let you rush them too. Build about ten and combine that with your existing force to get roosevelt in the early stages of the war. He has a large empire, but many of his cities are in sad shape. Raze the crap cities and keep his major cities. As your war progresses you should have built six or so more trebs. BTW do you know if Roosevelt has a large SOD? If so then my plan is nothing. But I am sure he has only city dending units. I recommend settling your great prophet in your 2nd most productive city, and the merchant in your capital. The capital is great for wall street later on.

 

[AppleTheMan]

Yes it's a prophet... I'm itching to GA him.

Small update... Poor Roosevelt has been invaded by me with the most powerful type of strategy in war: the element of surprise. I invaded him just after a wedding between our nobles which boosted my relationship +3 with him. After the wedding feast, I send my 15 catapults to take Cincinnati, New York, Portland, and another city. (Can't remember the name).

I got liberalism first which gave me nationalism, but unfortunately a distant civilization build the Taj Mahal before I did. With Free Speech, Free Religion, Printing Press, and the Colossus of New York, my economy is on a steady rise. Man a Golden age would make those coastal cities look so nice with all the money bags in the water!

This is the first time I really make proper use of a financial civ, and wow! Little things like rivers, windmills near rivers, cottages near rivers, and the colossus are really brilliant!

 

[AppleTheMan]

Okay here is a good question:

At this point, should I continue the war with Roosevelt?

I never seem to know when to end my wars, and can't help but just keep going. Once I've taken a few large cities, they're just so weak and I don't see why I shouldn't just finish them off.

I was going for spacerace victory, but domination is starting to seem appealing.

Should I take Baltimore or San Fransisco, or just sound the peace horn?

 

[Root Beer]

You got alot done in a few hours, and that's when I went to sleep...
Gonna look at your new saves now. I still don't know what kind of military roosevelt has, so I can't offer much help at the moment except that engineering is a must. With those trebs roosevelt's city defenders would have been butter for your troops.

My guess is there is a larger more advanced civ on another continent... there always is. It is important that roosevelt is conqured... and shaka. If you can obtain the whole continent by conquest your space race has a good chance. A cozy continent to yourself is best for this because knowing the AI they will bombard you with spies when you are on the verge of launching your ship.
It is important that you use the great people for more long-term benefits, unless you plan to finish up your game soon then by all means GA him.

And domination is good too

 

[Root Beer]

Had a look...your war weariness is bad. I would have recommended drafting with nationalism, but not now. Capture San Fransisco, Philadelphia. raze some nearby cities (Houston, Los Angelas and Denver)too reduce chance of city flipping and call it a day for Roosevelt. Oh, and flatten Zara's little colony of Hara. After this build some infrastructure(courthouses). Upgrade or build some city garrison units (that lone quecha in your capital...not good)
I am suprised that they DOW'ed on YOU. After peace switch civics to Police State and nationhood after researching fascism. A space race victory does not seem likely with Zara way over on the other continent building wonders(HE might go for cultural victory too) A future war is inevitable for you, and settle those GP in you capital, it will come of great help. I am playing right now...

 

[Root Beer]

How is this?

 

[AppleTheMan]

Not bad.... not bad at all....
Actually it looks like it's bye-bye time for Shaka.

So Nationhood got you through the whole thing eh?
But why raze all those cities? Maybe the ones really close to where you left him at, OK, but why the others?

 

[AppleTheMan]

Oh, and did you get Sitting Bull to declare war on Zara, or did he just do that on his own? Nice going!

 

[AppleTheMan]

Alright I think I beat you.

No Nationhood, no drafting...
It's 1820 and I'm almost at the same place with more score. I had to jack up the culture a little and buy lots of Jails, theaters, markets, temples to keep everyone happy. It is starting to get out of hand. I get assembly line next turn, so I think I'll completely finish him off before 1875. I managed to get Shaka to declare war on Zara for Philosophy and Printing Press.

Sitting Bull did declare war on Zara, and then Isabella declared war on Sitting Bull.

I love a world at war.

Shaka asked me for steel.

I said no.

Maybe I should go kill him now.

This is looking more like a domination game. If I can take my whole continent, I may just need a small war with Zara to win. It's all about the bombers.

 

[Root Beer]

Nationhood help in my war effort, but the drafted troops were used a city garrison so my SOD can keep the fight going.
I made a mistake at around 1930 when i delayed moving my invasion force to Zara, he got tanks by then. Also watch out for Isabella, she grabbing some wonders too. I lost Three Gorges Dam to her(At least I nabbed The Pentagon)
MY path is getting tough and all I can say is build some anti-tank units, some bombers, and many fighters for inteception.
I would reload a few turns back to correct my mistake in production choice but that would make me a wee bit lame. It wil be a hard domination for me.

If you dominate your continent then victory is close, shaka should be eliminated, I am getting spamed out of my mind by his spies... and I suppose you are too. You're right about Invading Zara, he is a danger no matter what(I was suprised when it was him who DOW you. and I have'nt made peace since 1770's) He is also whipping Sitting Bull in 1940(captured five cities)

Which cities I should not have Razed? I kept the ones that had high production, and flattened the rest. Then perhaps I did get carried away?

 

[AppleTheMan]

Generally I don't raze any cities. I want to . .. .. .. . him all the way until he's dead, and as far as I'm concerned his cities are my key to victory.

Yeah, the spies are SO annoying. I always thought is was Roosevelt, but I'm starting to realize that Shaka is behind it all. Zara seems to be running LOTS of espionage as well. Last time I checked Sitting Bull was -7 towards him for "Some of your spies were caught spying in our country!"

 

[AppleTheMan]

This is also my first game with no Tech Brokering and I have to say that it's a lot more fun.
Now I don't have to feel bad about giving someone a good tech if they're not a threat to me for a small return. I make friends with them, and they won't give it to my enemies.

I also love creaming Roosevelt's longbowmen with my Infantry.

 

[Gumbolt]

Your playing incas and you didnt do a Quelcha rush????? What kind of player are you?????

6-8 quelchas would of taken out Shaka/America much earlier.

Still your holding your own on the 1340ad i looked at. I think perhaps you were short on workers early on as you have loads of forest/jungle still around your cities. Loving the 2 iron resources around your capital!!

A win is a win!!!

 

[AppleTheMan]

Alright! I've completely washed him out and it's 1844. A little better than you.

Man, all I need to do now is push END TURN and that -11 war weariness will be over.

Notice the nice forest preserves I am making for my National Park! A nice extra 10 free specialists can never hurt to pop out a GP now and then.

 

[AppleTheMan]

Your playing incas and you didnt do a Quelcha rush????? What kind of player are you?????

6-8 quelchas would of taken out Shaka/America much earlier.

Still your holding your own on the 1340ad i looked at. I think perhaps you were short on workers early on as you have loads of forest/jungle still around your cities. Loving the 2 iron resources around your capital!!

A win is a win!!!

I might retry it again with a Quelcha rush... that is originally what I wanted to do, but then I figured that both Shaka and Roosevelt were just too far from me. I don't have much experience doing it though, so I should try it, maybe I was wrong.

 

[AppleTheMan]

There we go! No more Roosevelt, no more Shaka, and I'm majorly in the lead, looking pretty good for spacerace.

How do you like my great engineer farm in Vilcabamba?

If I win this one it will be my first Monarch victory.

 

[TheDS]

I loaded up your first game because I wanted to see what a Cottage Economy looked like, and I noticed a few things that I would consider "mistakes":

1. Both opponents have money sitting doing nothing, and you have spare resources to give them for it. That's 13 extra gold in your pocket!
2. They both have resources you could get. Unless you're planning on attacking FDR right away, which you shouldn't, since your forces aren't close enough.
3. Shaka is willing to sign Open Borders. Why didn't you do it? More Trade for you.
4. You've got uncollected Silk that could be traded (you're short 1 thing to trade). Oh wait, I see, that's a new city.
5. You need a few more Workers and to throw out a couple Settlers to grab some more resource nexuses. Overall, you placed your cities well to grab them.
6. I was going to say something about Grocers, but I see you're taking care of that. (I also see a Settler being built now. Good.)
7. You don't need Walls. Ever. (Pretty much.) You're not Protective, you haven't got Castles anywhere, you're not Spanish. But since you've got ToA in your capital, you could stand a Castle there (or could've - might be too late now).
8. You have a lot of units sitting around idle in your cities. Except for holding back a couple or so, you can put them all on the front, maybe build some boats and raid the enemy rear. AIs are rarely smart enough to do that, and incursions can usually be dealt with by that small reserve and any new units before they head to the front.
9. FORGES!!!! For the love of all that's lovable!!! You'll boost your production another 25% AND provide an extra Happiness with your Gems.
10. You know you can have more than one thing in your build queues, right? Unless you're using that to remind yourself to monkey with your tiles now and then, save yourself some hassle and queue.
11. Serfdom? Build more Workers, then you can go to Slavery and start whipping! Oh, wait, you haven't Farmed much; stick with Serfdom.
12. No Vassals? Shaka would probably be your attack dog now. FDR would probably fold with a solid hit too, letting you save your meager production.
13. Lots of unupgraded units.
14. You're breaking even at 30% gold WITH a Golden Age going.

You're already in a GA, no need to spend your guys on extending it, but since you've got MoM, kick it off when you've got most of the continent under control.

Also, I don't know how much of your lack of productivity is due to playing at Monarch compared to my typically Noble games (started playing Prince a few games ago), so maybe your lower capability compared to what I expected can be blamed on that.

Feel free to smack me around as you explain why I am completely off base.

 

[AppleTheMan]

I loaded up your first game because I wanted to see what a Cottage Economy looked like, and I noticed a few things that I would consider "mistakes":

1. Both opponents have money sitting doing nothing, and you have spare resources to give them for it. That's 13 extra gold in your pocket!
   Perhaps... I can't remember what was going on at the time, but I ended up getting what I needed from Shaka later.
   
2. They both have resources you could get. Unless you're planning on attacking FDR right away, which you shouldn't, since your forces aren't close enough.
   I ended up attacking Roosevelt very soon after that save, and I didn't have any problem. It's hard to know just how much military they have, but the "powergraph" is not a good indicator. Things like having the Great Wall will boost that a lot, but how does that make you stronger? Either way I kicked his ass... take a look at my last save.
   
3. Shaka is willing to sign Open Borders. Why didn't you do it? More Trade for you.
   I guess
   
4. You've got uncollected Silk that could be traded (you're short 1 thing to trade). Oh wait, I see, that's a new city.
   
   I have enough other resources for trade, so I decided to keep the forests for preserves later on. This may have been a mistake though, since I have enough free specialists in that city for my National Park to get me engineers, and I can't get more than 5. (1 with forge, 2 from factory, 2 from national park + free one from NP)
   
5. You need a few more Workers and to throw out a couple Settlers to grab some more resource nexuses. Overall, you placed your cities well to grab them.
   Damn right. I think that was my biggest error in this game, I was really short of them.
6. I was going to say something about Grocers, but I see you're taking care of that. (I also see a Settler being built now. Good.)
   
7. You don't need Walls. Ever. (Pretty much.) You're not Protective, you haven't got Castles anywhere, you're not Spanish. But since you've got ToA in your capital, you could stand a Castle there (or could've - might be too late now).
   I'm starting to realize that. I usually never build them, but then I realized that they boost your power, so maybe it would prevent me from getting attacked a little. It was probably just a waste of time.
8. You have a lot of units sitting around idle in your cities. Except for holding back a couple or so, you can put them all on the front, maybe build some boats and raid the enemy rear. AIs are rarely smart enough to do that, and incursions can usually be dealt with by that small reserve and any new units before they head to the front.
   I think I was using them for HR, keeping the people happy at the time.
9. FORGES!!!! For the love of all that's lovable!!! You'll boost your production another 25% AND provide an extra Happiness with your Gems.
   I used to never build them, being afraid of the -1 health, but I can see that was a mistake!
10. You know you can have more than one thing in your build queues, right? Unless you're using that to remind yourself to monkey with your tiles now and then, save yourself some hassle and queue.
11. Serfdom? Build more Workers, then you can go to Slavery and start whipping! Oh, wait, you haven't Farmed much; stick with Serfdom.
12. No Vassals? Shaka would probably be your attack dog now. FDR would probably fold with a solid hit too, letting you save your meager production.
    I haven't been able to play successfully with vassals yet... maybe now that I'm more familiar with all the BTS stuff I'll give it another shot. It may save a lot of time.
13. Lots of unupgraded units.
14. You're breaking even at 30% gold WITH a Golden Age going.
    Is that bad?

You're already in a GA, no need to spend your guys on extending it, but since you've got MoM, kick it off when you've got most of the continent under control.

Also, I don't know how much of your lack of productivity is due to playing at Monarch compared to my typically Noble games (started playing Prince a few games ago), so maybe your lower capability compared to what I expected can be blamed on that.

Feel free to smack me around as you explain why I am completely off base.

..................................

 

[AppleTheMan]

And it's OVER!!!

This was my first Monarch victory and strangely enough I found it to be too easy. This wasn't even close. The best part was when I launched my ship and Isabella DOW'ed me AGAIN with her cannons and riflemen. Boy they were no match for my tanks. The best part was sinking all those carriers full of planes with my missile cruisers. I popped enough GPS to give myself 24 nice turns of GA which lasted me to the very end.