canals?

[noowanda]

one thing Ive always wanted to see in the civ games are canals. a worker action that allows ships to pass through squares of land. now we couldnt just go around making canals everywhere, so they would have to be lmited, a canal may be built on a land space which is next to water. Think of it, cities that are one space away from the oceans would then have ship producing capabilities. On continents, if there is a thin section of land (2 tiles or less)seperating 2 oceans, you could make a canal from each ocean and connect them, making a pathway without having to travel the world to get your ships to a that other ocean. they shouldnt be easy to build either, maybe as many turns as a fortress, and couldnt come out until probably the industrial revolution. maybe even make a wonder . . . panama canal? food for thought

 

[dexters]

Building a city on a 1 title chokepoint (non mountain) effectively turns that tiles into canals.

It would be an interesting 'terrain improvement' to give the CIV workers probably in the later part of the game. And this improvement may also take GPT upkeep and allow for canals to be carved to a maximum of 3 linking tiles to open up more options so that players aren't limited to the 1 tile rule currently available in Civ3.

 

[Naokaukodem]

Canals could surely be abused and we could build one through a whole contient...

 

[searcheagle]

This is in the top 10 requests to be included in Civ IV made on CFC, if not in the Top 5.

Noakaukodem@ I'm sure Sid will be able come up with effective ways to limit Canal usage. The two best one I can think of are:

1. Long time to create.
2. On going cost to "maintain"
3. Restrictions of placement (ie No mountains)

Others that I'm not in favor of:
1. Limit to continuous squares of canal
2. Limit to the number of canals civ-wide or Worldwide

Rule of thumb: Don't reject an entire concept because one application of an idea has a flaw or exploit or could have a flaw or exploit. Instead try to fix the flaw or exploit.

 

[mastertyguy]

I would like to see canals. It may also giving some faster movement to unit following thne canls, maybe. some no coal/iron rr. But they can find a way to limit it.

 

[searcheagle]

I would like to see canals. It may also giving some faster movement to unit following thne canls, maybe. some no coal/iron rr. But they can find a way to limit it.

While a different subject, I see Railroad as a too powerful influence in the game that destroys balance. I woul end this by placing limits of some sort on railroads of speed and/or capacity.

 

[mastertyguy]

Eagle, I like your idea, but then, you just have to find other ways. I don't know who said it, but someone said that there should road (3 mov) rr (6 mov) and highways (9 mov). This would give more balance.

 

[Komoda]

It took 2000 years to complete, but the chinese have a great wonder called the Grand Canal.
I am with you on that some wonders should be actually seen on the map, given their size and complexity.
Panama Canal is a good example.
Another would be the Canals of Angkor Wat.

 

[mastertyguy]

Or Suez (canal of Suez? Suez canal? I don't know)

 

[HannibalMcAlps]

I say... .yes to canals and I would like to see bridges as well, not just over rivers, but inlets and bays as well : Larger bridges visible on the world map.

 

[HannibalMcAlps]

Canals could surely be abused and we could build one through a whole contient...

The game is already based on real world concepts. So I wouldn't worry about that.

 

[Darwin420]

Having some of the large-scale wonders appear on the map would be an awesome touch. Imaging having the Great Wall stretch across a border of your Empire.

 

[Abaddon]

How about they can only be built where river tiles are? i.e. converting the rivers to canals? In that way we get more movement.. will never split a continent.. and will be controllable...

 

[noowanda]

that doesnt sound bad, though the idea of purely man-made canals is my fav, though I agree must be severely limted. 2 tiles away from ocean I think could get out of hand, so personally I would stick with one. the thought of rivers transporting ships, running though the center of tiles soley to support vessels sounds fun too. that might give too much advantage though, but I like the idea. on visible wonders, sounds lovely, but you would have to be carefull not to get carried away with the idea, one reason (among many) I think civ surpasses its competitors is its adherence to realism (comparitively) vs. typical videogame fluff ie. cute animations that dont really need to be there. but the idea of a big ass wall around my nation sounds cool too. there has to be a medium. and on unfare railroad advantages, I think sid's point was simply the the great advantage of them vs. roads. freeways for transportation are good, but I think (not sure) most manufactured goods including weapons are moved in mass quantities on railroads anyways. I say if you wanna curb the advantage, give railroad squares an upkeep, maybe only outside of city sqaures or all of them. considering how screwed alot of the railraods in the US are today, I think it would be fitting. coming from an amtrack user, I can say this.

 

[Darwin420]

Making forts and barricades useful would be nice, too.. especially if I can build connecting walls between them, and have the forts acts as gates, meaning a chokepoint I create, since no unit can cross the walls... THAT would be really sweeet. (but not if it takes FOREVER to build).

 

[Hyronymus]

Canals should only be constructed with (at least) one end of the canal connecting to a river or a larger water surface (lake, sea or ocean). And, as I said before in the original canal topic, canals should offer a movement and commercial bonus. Canals were the highways of the pre-industrial world.

 

[searcheagle]

One fix to limit exploits would be to require that Canals either connect with 1. a new type of river called a deep river, major river, or ocean going river OR 2. Oceans where the distance is 2 or less.

This would be in addition to a high number of worker turns to complete and ungoing maintaince cost.

(The Canal would also produce trade IF it becomes a major trade route participant.)

 

[ph_173]

I would like to see ships go up rivers with or without canals at least on level terrian. The English took China that way after all...
Anyway, I like the Idea of both canals and bridges, but it would be wierd to impliment them in between spaces were they really need to be.

 

[Killer_Klein]

For moving ships along rivers you could have ships that are restricted to rivers and maybe coast. This would represent their different design and that fact that most river going ships could not survive in rougher waters. Depending on the lay of the land you might end up having two fleets. One for the ocean and one for inland that's not as powerful.

The bridge idea on the main map is a great idea, they could be used to connect your smaller islands together. For example like Prince Edward Island in Canada. There is now a bridge there and I may be wrong but are there not bridge connecting some of the Florida Keys together? They can be restricted to being built only one space from land. This way you can connect your close islands that are two spaces away with a bridge from each side. As for the unit a worker could do it from the space next the coast tile (my choice) or a naval unit with only that function. And have it require upkeep as well.

 

[Hyronymus]

But only after a certain tech has been researched (Engineering i.e.). It sounds very good indeed!