Caveman 2 Cosmos

[Git-384]

If the truth is disrespectful to you, then the issue lies with you. Tbird has not contributed any coding for over two years at the very least (and I wasn't around before that).

Saying that a core contributor and long term member of the modding team didn't contribute anything is just disrespectful. If you aren't aware of him contributing maybe you should do your homework. No wonder he had enough.

 

[Leyrann]

Saying that a core contributor and long term member of the modding team didn't contribute anything is just disrespectful. If you aren't aware of him contributing maybe you should do your homework. No wonder he had enough.

I - and Murdermesa too - am well aware that Tbird has contributed a ton in the past. We were both talking about recent times.

I've been around in the C2C community for about two years now, while the mod has been developed for... let's take a simple number and say 16 years. Give or take a year, doesn't matter. If you were to assume development has been at a constant speed the entire time, you'd expect that about 12.5% of the current content would have been added in the last two years. In reality, I don't think it even reaches 2%.

The mod has been on it's ass recently, with Murdermesa and Flabbert, the very two people you're maligning, being the main contributors in the time that I've been around, at least until Calvitix joined a while back and performed some sizable work.

And frankly, I'm kind of done with your attitude. I've spoken to Tbird a lot more than you have, as has everyone else on the discord in fact, and he doesn't need you to speak for him. Could you now go troll another community?

 

[Somebody613]

How do you commit your updates to SVN? Is there some "secret code" that only "special people" know, and thus nobody else is able to contribute "over their head"?
Point being: Okay, one modder (or a few) got distracted. So, who is stopping all of YOU to step in and do something in the mean time?
Ah, "you don't know how", right? Or why else AREN'T you contributing "instead of him"?
See my point YET?

 

[lymond]

Moderator Action: Let's keep things civil folks. Talk about the mod, but keep the Discord dirt over on Discord, or take it to PM. Thank you -lymond

 

[Leyrann]

How do you commit your updates to SVN? Is there some "secret code" that only "special people" know, and thus nobody else is able to contribute "over their head"?
Point being: Okay, one modder (or a few) got distracted. So, who is stopping all of YOU to step in and do something in the mean time?
Ah, "you don't know how", right? Or why else AREN'T you contributing "instead of him"?
See my point YET?

What was stopping people was Tbird saying things along the lines of "that would interfere with the unit review so please do something else instead" (and note that there were more projects of this nature, such as the tech tree rework and building cost rework).

For more detail, you'll have to ask the modders, I'm just a player who contributes some ideas or occasionally a bit of XML coding.

 

[JosEPh_II]

As one of the old modders still around I had more changes I wanted to do to the Civics but since I got rid of Github and you cannot add to the SVN directly like before my work & ideas were greatly diminished.

I am now 73 yrs old. I have more things to do everyday now than to spend hours "tweaking" the xml values. I still can but I must prioritize my time & efforts.

I still get the em's from Github when work is being done. Then I check to see if the SVN has been updated. When It IS Updated then I post the New SVN Changelog in that specific thread here. raxxo used to do that.

So when I ask if the SVN was gong to be updated thru the em's, the disrespect from the em's I got back from one of the modders there was most rude. Out right vitriol and abusive. As for my attempt to gain knowledge of WHEN we here on CivFanatics could expect to get the SVN Updated caused one of your Discord Modder members to spew vitriol everywhere. Call me and the users here "entitled" ******.
But several of you on discord using git did clear some things Up for me/us about that individual. For that I THANK YOU.

I personally Like & respect T-brd. BUT I have also had Modifications that worked for the MOD Yanked out and cast aside by both T-brd & Toffer90 ( who I also respect as a modder). Because in their words it was not "elegant". They worked but was not their idea/path they envisioned.

StrategyOnly is not physically able to Handle His Own Mod anymore. So he gave T-brd the LEAD position because T-brd was the Most active modder and idea generator of the Mod after Koshling left.

Koshling who owned his on Company left because content makers were not listening to his call for structured approach. He also said here that some of the coding added in from other mods, incorporated into C2C, were spaghetti coding. Example the older version of Revolutions we had( still do but not recommended any more). In fact the New ppl developing revolutions a few years back demanded we stop using their new moding. A clear infraction of CivFantics policy of Mod making here. All workings on Mods here are to be freely shared.

So when things are blowing up over there on Discord we here only get 2nd hand news and hopefully an Updated SVN, so we can keep playing our FAVORITE BTS Mod Caveman2Cosmos.

To calvitix, a BIG THANK YOU for Updating the SVN. U are our lifeline to C2C updates.

 

[JosEPh_II]

Well this place is in absolute free speech mode.
That is there are ABSOLUTE zero rules.

Apparently members can offend and insult each other (there is no limit in severity), but someone managed to direct all their "love" towards Thunderbrd lmao.

I left due to CRITICAL mismatch in quality - why participate there if quality of discussions are way higher in other places?
There - facts and logic are optional (trainwreck like this but more extreme), and civic conduct is on PREHISTORIC level.

I ignored that before as on forums this issue wasn't critical, but on Discord it spiralled out of control like Chernobyl.

Good luck to mod itself, maybe someone makes incremental game version of it, since its tech tree, civics, and stuff are glorious.
Looked at mod itself a bit, apparently once a while savebreaking changes were added, as no one tests mod (at least on sufficient level), for example no one looks if option selections stayed same after adding or deleting specific game option.

Great to see U Post raxo!
I miss our banter.

 

[JosEPh_II]

So Thunderbrd really left, I thought he only stepped down.
Now that I heard there is internal reorganization, I hope that with better moderation you can now attract more people without collapse into absolute chaos.
Add moderator role that would be separate from dev/modder role, so they would maintain order as population grows.

How hard would it be to cut out the last 4 or 5 eras? To Make a Shorter time frame for C2C play. I would call it C2C Light up to Modern or Information era. Cause quite frankly pepper2000's mod mod was never thoroughly played thru to weed out the bad xml values he used making much of the last 5 eras OP in many many areas of play.

 

[Somebody613]

Did everyone forget we have Modmods?
Post all your changes THERE as a Modmod, then it can eventually be integrated into the Main Mod later on.
And if it affects the area that ISN'T currently being worked on - then integration should be way easier as well.
Especially, if it's just XML stuff alone.
Sure, that'd mean a tester/modder would need to have more than one C2C folder to play from, but that's better than just dropping the whole idea entirely, "until never".
Seriously.

 

[Leyrann]

Did everyone forget we have Modmods?
Post all your changes THERE as a Modmod, then it can eventually be integrated into the Main Mod later on.
And if it affects the area that ISN'T currently being worked on - then integration should be way easier as well.
Especially, if it's just XML stuff alone.
Sure, that'd mean a tester/modder would need to have more than one C2C folder to play from, but that's better than just dropping the whole idea entirely, "until never".
Seriously.

Oh yeah, it's so weird that people don't want to work on something that according to the project lead is going to be lost entirely in a large-scale rework at some point! What's wrong with these pretend-contributors??? They should just create a modmod that'll be forgotten in the bigger overhaul instead!

 

[Somebody613]

Well, everyone makes their own choices.

 

[tmv]

Oh yeah, it's so weird that people don't want to work on something that according to the project lead is going to be lost entirely in a large-scale rework at some point! What's wrong with these pretend-contributors??? They should just create a modmod that'll be forgotten in the bigger overhaul instead!

Or you could pull the spreadsheet files that Thunderbrd has in his sig (where he has the information about his rework) and merge on your side, so when you put that into a modmod it has a much larger chance of staying.

 

[Leyrann]

Or you could pull the spreadsheet files that Thunderbrd has in his sig (where he has the information about his rework) and merge on your side, so when you put that into a modmod it has a much larger chance of staying.

You'll have to ask the actual modders for more information on why that wasn't feasible for them. I can only relay what I picked up on the discord through reading conversations between the involved people.

 

[Somebody613]

I see there are still people around, who "didn't even read the book, but clearly didn't like it". Sad, just sad.

 

[Leyrann]

I see there are still people around, who "didn't even read the book, but clearly didn't like it". Sad, just sad.

Are you complaining about me trying to relay what information I can, as unbiased as I can, instead of contributing to the mod with knowledge that I don't actually have?

Honestly, your attitude is doing a lot to convince me that the people complaining about entitled people on the forum have a point.

I would very much prefer that they don't.

 

[JL1312]

@Leyrann since I’m not on discord yet (will be soon I guess since it seems most of the devs talk there, but procrastinatoc as f*), do you know anything about this new experiment army something that’s part of the latest SVN?
It would’ve been great if you do and could share some brief info on what it is, I’m so curious.

Really like the gist of the changes this new generation of modders have brought so far (although I guess a lot of it will need balancing ofc)

 

[Somebody613]

As the Russian adage goes: "Thief, your hat is burning!"

 

[Osk21]

Apparently I've become the biggest impediment to the mod's growth so at this point I'm done and stepping down. I'm realizing that my position here is doing nothing for me except to expand an ego problem I already have naturally to begin with, as if nobody knows that. To work on letting go of all things that matter to me in life, I'm going to walk away and try to find peace now. The guys on the discord seem to have plenty of things they wish to do with the mod that will go in very different directions than I had hoped. I think if I'm going to keep maintaining the vision I have developed here, I'll probably have to do it on a new game I teach myself how to program so I'll just do that someday, much like every other someday plan I have ever had. I don't think of myself as old. I found this site when I was 40 and perhaps I wasn't then. But time has accelerated, demands have accelerated, and not ending up homeless has become a dramatically optimistic and unrealistic hope. When I began I was somehow able to live on a part time sales job and poured effort into this like crazy in hopes that someday we'd get it to become this amazing multi-mapped fully galactic game of exploration in the most granular manner possible. I felt it was a duty to manifest the vision I insisted on since I had needed to insist so much on it that I pissed everyone off as I stepped into this role to begin with. But honestly, I get it now. I'm just an ******* who's in the way of progress and always has been. This was never my project to run - it was only the illusion I maintained so as to give my life a sense of meaning. Not that I don't need that somehow but I'll stop burdening everyone with that here. The demon you've been strapped with is no longer going to cast its shadow. Enjoy. Just have fun.

Sorry to hear this Thunderbrd... You have given this mod a lot of guidance! And you were a Friend...

 

[Osk21]

DAFUUUUUU..???!!!
Like, seriously, DAFUC???
Anyways, GOOD that I don't use Discord (name checks out) in the first place.
Not fully incidentally, BECAUSE pretty much every time I tried using it (on various topics), I got BANNED from the server in question in a very short time.
It's quite obviously DISCORD, indeed.
Why don't you/we just IGNORE it, period?
I don't even see much of a benefit using it to begin with.

I still love Civfanatics and have been on it since I bought a Civ 2 CD at Best Buy when I heard how fun and addictive Sid Meier's Game was. A lot of the chatting goes on Discord now, and it took me a while to adjust to how it works. Somebody613, your input and comments are very valuable to the C2C mod forum and the UEM mod mod game, which I really enjoy too. I didn't ever play Sid's Civ 1, and I haven't felt the need to buy Civ 7 yet. C2C and Fall From Heaven are the 2 games that occupy 95 percent of my gaming time on my Desktop Computer!!!

 

[Osk21]

As one of the old modders still around I had more changes I wanted to do to the Civics but since I got rid of Github and you cannot add to the SVN directly like before my work & ideas were greatly diminished.

I am now 73 yrs old. I have more things to do everyday now than to spend hours "tweaking" the xml values. I still can but I must prioritize my time & efforts.

I still get the em's from Github when work is being done. Then I check to see if the SVN has been updated. When It IS Updated then I post the New SVN Changelog in that specific thread here. raxxo used to do that.

So when I ask if the SVN was gong to be updated thru the em's, the disrespect from the em's I got back from one of the modders there was most rude. Out right vitriol and abusive. As for my attempt to gain knowledge of WHEN we here on CivFanatics could expect to get the SVN Updated caused one of your Discord Modder members to spew vitriol everywhere. Call me and the users here "entitled" ******.
But several of you on discord using git did clear some things Up for me/us about that individual. For that I THANK YOU.

I personally Like & respect T-brd. BUT I have also had Modifications that worked for the MOD Yanked out and cast aside by both T-brd & Toffer90 ( who I also respect as a modder). Because in their words it was not "elegant". They worked but was not their idea/path they envisioned.

StrategyOnly is not physically able to Handle His Own Mod anymore. So he gave T-brd the LEAD position because T-brd was the Most active modder and idea generator of the Mod after Koshling left.

Koshling who owned his on Company left because content makers were not listening to his call for structured approach. He also said here that some of the coding added in from other mods, incorporated into C2C, were spaghetti coding. Example the older version of Revolutions we had( still do but not recommended any more). In fact the New ppl developing revolutions a few years back demanded we stop using their new moding. A clear infraction of CivFantics policy of Mod making here. All workings on Mods here are to be freely shared.

So when things are blowing up over there on Discord we here only get 2nd hand news and hopefully an Updated SVN, so we can keep playing our FAVORITE BTS Mod Caveman2Cosmos.

To calvitix, a BIG THANK YOU for Updating the SVN. U are our lifeline to C2C updates.

I am 60 JosEPH_II and will play C2C for the rest of my life in most likelihood. Quite Simply, I prefer Civ4 BtS to the Civilization Games after that and StrategyOnly was a genius who worked hard to combine other mods to create it. A Big Thanks to him, you, and all of the modders who have put in long hours on C2C!