City specialization, tips?

PekkaM

Warlord
Joined
Dec 16, 2001
Messages
113
Location
Helsinki, Finland
I've never bothered too much with this and have done improvements mainly on basis of terrain type (flood plains/no fresh water grassland/plains = cottages, fresh water grassland = farm, hill = mine) and chopped all grassland forests.

What are the base guidlines when you specialize a city? Do you go against "rules" what is best improvement for a square? Is it just city micromanagement and adjusting which building to build first?
 
Täällä on aika hyviä vinkkejä kyllä jo kirjoitettuna. Oletko lukenut Sota Akatemian kirjoituksia? (war Academy)

Aika pitkälti menee tilanteen ja suuremman strategian mukaan miten kukin kaupunki erikoistuu. Lyhyesti: kannattaa laskea valmiiksi riittääkö kaupungin ruoka käyttämään kaikki ruudut, ennen kuin perustaa kaupungin. Jos on paljon kukkuloita, Onko ruokaresursseja vai tarvitseeko grasslandit laittaa farmeiksi. Tiedät varmaan että kaikki ruudut joissa on alle 2 ruokaa, tarvitsevat lisäruokaa muista ruuduista.

Sanoisin että ei ole mitään muuta yleissääntöä... tarkoitan siis että välillä workshop tai vesimylly tai tuulimylly on erittäin hyvä ratkaisu, vaikka farmitja kaivokset ja cottaget ovatkin yleisesti suositeltavimpia parannuksia....

Itse olen viimeaikoina pelannut Peterillä spesialisti strategiaa eli tehnyt pääasiassa farmeja ja kaivoksia, unohtamatta tietenkin resurssien päälle tulevia laitumia tai plantaaseja...Mutta koska spesialisti strategiassa ruoka on pääasia, myös vesimylly ja tuulimylly ovat välillä tarpeellisia, jotta voidaan palkata yksi spesialisti lisää...

Yritän myöhemmin laittaa yhden esimerkin tänne, olen nyt töissä niin en kerkeä.

Toivottavasti tuosta oli apua.
 
Lisään vielä, että kannattaa tehdä ainakin yksi super tiede kaupunki, yleensä pääkaupunki, johon tulee Oxford ja joku muu, esim national epic. mahdollisimman monta cottagea ja sen verran ruokaa että saa vielä muutman tiedmiehen palkattua...

sitten ainakin yksi sotilas kaupunki, johon tulee kaivoksia ruokaa, workshopeja ja vesimyllyjä minne saa, tarkoituksena maksimoida vasarat. sinne heroic epic ja west point, ja jos sulla on warlords, niin kenraalit sinne spesilisteiksi. Sotilas kaupunki kannattaa usein olla meren rannalla, koska silloin myös laivastoa voidaan tehdä Heroic epicin vasara bonuksella. tämä kaupunki ei tarvitse cottageita yhtään, kirjasto kannattaa silti ehkä tehdä koska kaupunki pystyy tuottamaan sen nopeasti ja yliopisto joudutaan todennäköisesti tekemään tänne hieman "turhaan" vain jotta saadaan tarpeeksi nopeasti kaikki tarvittavat yliopistot tehtyä Oxfordia varten... samoin voi olla pankin laita wall streetiä varten.

Jos löydät uskonnon se on sinun raha kaupunki, sinne shrine ja ruokaa niin paljon että saa mahdollisimman monta merchantia palkattua spesialisteiksi. Yliopisto tarvitaan ehkä mutta marketti groceri ja pankki ovat tärkeimmät rakennusket tässä kaupungissa...

Sitten toinen super tuotanto kaupunki, johon tulee Ironworks, keties national epic tai vaikka red gross tai scotland yard...Mutta Ironworksia ja heroic epicia on turha yhdistää, koska siitä tulee vasroiden liikatuotantoa...tosin sillekkin strategialle löytyy käyttöä, jossa vasaroiden ylituotanto muutetaan rahaksi (en muista keskustelun nimeä, mutta se on aika tuore tässä strategy and tips palstalla) Ironworks kaupunki kannattaa ehkä perustaa lähelle päiväntasaajaa, koska silloin sinne voidaan myöhemmin tehdä spce elevator...Joen varrella oleminen mahdollistaa myös Three gorges damin rakentamisen...


loput kaupungit on periaatteessa enemmän tai vähemmän "sekakaupunkeja" jotka tekee mitä tarvitaan...
Itse perustan monta rannikkokaupunkia,,koska niillä on enemmän ulkomaan kauppareittejä, varsinkin jos saan great lighthousen tehtyä...

Ja vaikka mitä muuta...hieno peli, jossa on todella monta vaihtoehtoa miten edetä...
 
Hyviä neuvoja tuossa ylhäällä. Itse perustan lähes poikkeuksetta yhden kaupungin joka keskittyy täysin ruokaan. Kaupunkiin rakennetaan Globe Teather ja National Epic, kasvatetaan se suureksi ja tämän jälkeen palkataan spesialistit tuottamaan Great Personeita. Tämä tosin on varsin yleinen taktiikka ja varmasti monelle itsestäänselvyys.
 
Super tiedekaupunki voi periaatteessa tuottaa helposti 400, mutta jopa 800-1000 tiedettä vuorossa.
Super rahakaupunki helposti 100 kultaa, mutta toisinaan jopa 400, siis silloin kun rahoista menee 100% tieteeseen, jos menee 100% kullaksi voidaan jopa 1000 kultaa ylittää... En ole koskaan kokeillut tehdä varsinaista super rahakaupunkia...siis yleensä oma uskonto on noin 20-30 kaupungissa...se kertaa 200% on siinä 100 kullan paikkeilla, mutta sekin on jo jees.

Ironworks kaupunki voi tuottaa noin 200 vasaraa vuorossa, mutta onhan niitäkin "fanaatikot" tehneet usemman sadan tuotantolaitoksia...periaatteessa niin että vapaudenpatsas (muistaakseni 1200 vasaraa) tulee alle 10 vuorossa...

Heroic epic kaupunki ei yleensä ole aivan niin hyvä tuotannossa kuin Edellinen, mutta mahdollista saada modern armor yhdessä vuorossa eli siis olla reilun 100 vasaran kaupunki...

Mainitsemani Super superkaupungit ovat mahdollisa ainoastaan siten että niihin on liitettyinä useampi superspesialisti, joten samassa pelissä ei voi olla kuin yhtä laatua ("todellinen superkaupunki siis esim 1000 tiedettä vuorossa vaatii ainakin 6-10 supertiedemiestä liitettynä ja yksi käytettynä akatemiaan) eli oletko keskittynyt hankkimaan vain merchanteja, tiedemiehiä, insinöörejä vai pappeja riippuu onko mahdollisuus super vasara raha vai tiede kaupunkiin...tosin noille spesialisteille löytyy monesti parempaakin käyttöä kuin niiden liittäminen kaupunkiin...harkinta kysymys...
 
I just thought I can write in Finnish for someone from Finland...
 
I've never bothered too much with this and have done improvements mainly on basis of terrain type (flood plains/no fresh water grassland/plains = cottages, fresh water grassland = farm, hill = mine) and chopped all grassland forests.

What are the base guidlines when you specialize a city? Do you go against "rules" what is best improvement for a square? Is it just city micromanagement and adjusting which building to build first?

The rules are different for a production city and for a commerce city.

Production city: intentionally improve production to the detriment of commerce. Never, ever build a cottage if you otherwise can improve food or hammers.
Tip: Don't chop grassland forests in a production city if you can't otherwise improve it with a farm or a waterwheel. (before civil service you can't chain farms, so that extra forest hammer may actually help, and you may even get to lumbermill that tile).

Commerce city: you will want a windmill instead of a mine on that hill... Never, ever improve production at the expense of commerce improvement unless you temporarily need the production to get a commerce building in place. Never EVER build a unit here if you have a good production city. Build the unit in the production city and MOVE the unit to the commerce city. Units can move.

From the War Academy:
http://www.civfanatics.com/civ4/strategy/city_specialization.php
 
A rule of thumb I have heard is 2 commerce cities per production city with 1 gpfarm city in total. (when running cottage economy).

In your commerce cities it's all about running cottages and building commerce/science buildings (slow-building them).

In your production cities it's all about working hammers and building military and production buildings, along with units for attack and defense.

In your gpfarm it's all about working food tiles and whipping gp buildings, such as libraries, markets, grocers, theatres, temples, forges, etc.
 
A rule of thumb I have heard is 2 commerce cities per production city with 1 gpfarm city in total. (when running cottage economy).

In your commerce cities it's all about running cottages and building commerce/science buildings (slow-building them).

In your production cities it's all about working hammers and building military and production buildings, along with units for attack and defense.

In your gpfarm it's all about working food tiles and whipping gp buildings, such as libraries, markets, grocers, theatres, temples, forges, etc.

If you're in a cottage economy, you can have 3 or 4 commerce cities for each production site.
This leads to delayed or sporadic warfare or pure space race.

What I try to do :
- capital is mostly hybrid, try to have production but I rarely move the initial settler
- 2nd city is production if possible (try to grab copper or horses)
- 3rd city is commerce (gold, silver gems are best)
- 4th city is commerce
- 5th city either is an AI's holy city or capital or good commerce
- 6th city same as 5th
after that it's more about capturing cities than anything else, but if you can afford a second/third production city, it's great. If you can't, you just live without it.

edit : I forgot the GP farm, because it's often either the capital or a captured AI capital.
 
I'll generally have these 4 cities in my empire.

1. The GP farm. Usually my capital. Should have good food potential, but I'll usually also cottage some tiles since I try to restrict myself to engineer specialists. I'll try to build wonders here to increase the gp points. Build National Epic here. I also like to build Ironworks here.

2. The religion/money city. Often a captured city with a shrine(s). I'll farm everything I can, and after the population builds up I'll hire merchant specialists. Build Wall Street here, along with market/grocer/bank. I also like to build Globe Theatre here, so it can grow without having to worry about other happiness improvements.

3. The research city. Should be a city with good food potential (flood plains are great) and hopefully a river. Put down a bunch of cottages. If there are places for gold/silver/gem mines, or dye/incense plantations, so much the better. Build Oxford here, as well as library/university/observatory/lab.

4. The military production city. This should have places for good hammer development such as hills, but should also have good enough food potential that you'll be able to work all those mines. Build heroic epic and West Point here.

All the other cities are either general commerce/research cities (build libraries, universities, etc., lay down cottages) or general production cities (farms and mines).
 
I sometimes use my capital for GPs, but try to do so only until beaurocracy - I want a pure GP farm ready by then. I want lots of hammers and commerce for the 50% bonus, and those are usually found on tiles, not with specialists. I think ironworks lends itself to working tiles also (but maybe alot of engineers works too?). If I am going to found a religion, I try to make sure that my second city (probably all I will have out at this point) is in a good position to assume this role. Founding in your capital can be good as well. I hate founding a religion with my second city in a production location.


As cabert mentioned, an AI capital often makes an excellent post-beaurocracy GP farm (epecially when they come with an engineer or scientist wonder - priest wonders in a GP farm are a real pain).
 
Bonus resources

Resource tiles should play a big role in which cities become commercial and which ones become production focussed. Chances are that these tiles will be amongst the most worked during the course of the game, so their emphasis in terms of commerce versus production yield should be a major consideration to the specialisation of choice.

Hills and rivers can be used for either city type, although some 'hybridisation' isn't all bad in the first part of the game for some cities in light of limited specialisation options. That is, you don't have the plethora of building choices early on to leverage specialisation too much while your workers won't be able to produce really effective workshops, watermills and windmills until later game technologies allow these improvements to be especially useful. I tend to use the whip a lot more in the early part of the game which changes the dynamics somewhat too. More options in the mid-game will yield greater gains from specialisation.

One thing to be mindful of is food and irrigation chains (especially to Rice, Wheat, and Corn) - cutting off all fresh water may deny other nearby cities to grow, so I would recommend that some consideration to the need to allow for irrigation chaining when Civil Service becomes available may be important. Because of the commerce bonus of most river-connected tiles, there's a tendancy to build cottages on every tile along the banks and create a commercial 'Mecca', but one or two tiles that will open up chain irrigation options may be the better move for the overall empire - contingent upon the landscape. Also, when using the whip a lot or running specialists, it's always good to have a number of 3+:food: tiles handy.
 
Sorry about the finnish :) I ´m not trying to change the languages of this site...and finnish would´nt be that language anyway :D ... But I thought this is kind of basic question, that has been answered here manytimes in other threads and ´cause my english is not so fluent, finnish was the way to go.

I wrote about the specialization of cities...something general...and about the possibility of making "Super city" by adding super specialist to that city.

Nothing new just in different language... :) but hopefully helpful for the one who asked.
 
What are the base guidlines when you specialize a city?

1. The Farm. -- :food: food and more food. Ideally (2) or more bonus :food: resources within the fat cross and/or lots of floodplains/oasis or at the very minimum lots of grassland tiles. One or two hills for :hammers: but think ahead - if you have forests then use them as free hammers instead of building mines on the hills. Don't develop the hills at all and don't chop the forests until you can build Windmills. In a good Farm every tile will be producing food, with most tiles producing 3 or more. The city should be capable of 50+ food per turn when all tiles are worked.

2. The Bank. -- :commerce: and lots of it. Since the commerce buildings also tend to be hammer heavy you'll need a higher production tile to commerce tile ratio in this city - but no more than 40 food per turn max. Everything else needs to be set aside for :commerce: and two or three hammer tiles. Build lots of cottages here and build them early.

3. The Factory. -- :hammers: baby. Lots of 'em. You need a maximum of 40 food / turn in this city, so only build enough farms so that when the city reaches size 20 it's generating 40 food/turn. Everything else is :hammers:. Do not chop your forests unless they're on hills - those you can freely chop to make room for mines. Save the forests as free production and wait for Lumbermills (and later railroads, which add +1 :hammers: to a Lumbermill just like they do Mines) Plains tiles with a river should get a Watermill instead of a Workshop. Only put Workshops on grassland and plains tiles that don't already have a river or a forest. This city needs to stay away from the ocean. Coastal tiles are worthless for production - they're only use to the Factory is food. If you must build on the coast limit the number of coastal tiles in the fat cross to the bare minimum (which would be 2 btw)

4. Everything else. -- Well, these are the classic hybrid cities that are secondary production and commerce oriented. You can continue to play these cities just like you do now developing in an ad-hoc manner. Remember that for these, just like with the Factory and the Bank, you only need 40 food per turn to grow to max size - so only build enough Farms so that when all tiles are worked you're making 40 food / turn.

* Breaking the 40 :food: / turn barrier -- A city at size 20 works all of the tiles in the fat cross. If when working all those tiles the city is generating 40 :food: every turn then it's "perfect" and shouldn't really build further food resources... but like all things CIV this too should be tossed out the window based upon circumstances. More than 40/turn allows you to have specialists go to work in that city. It allows you to whip like crazy without sacrificing worked tiles etc - so altho I point out above that you don't need to develop any tiles for food once the 40/turn target can be reached there are still lots of good reasons to do it if doing so gives you other benefits.

The main tips are: Plan Ahead.

* If you have forests and aren't really pressed into chopping out a wonder or something like that then save those forests as free, un-pillagable :hammers: and develop them with Lumbermills (and Railroad) later.

* If you have forests on a hill you don't need to build a mine there right away - and might want to drop a Windmill or even a Lumbermill there instead later on down the road.

* Toss all of these "rules" and tips into the bit bucket whenever you think you need to and have fun. :p
 
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