[NFP] City-States Elimination Thread

[Noble Zarkon]

Antananarivo [14]
Auckland [15]
Bologna [21]
Caguana [9]
Cahokia [18]
Geneva [11]
Kumasi [8] 11-3 I want trade routes to help build Wonders or get new cities off the ground.
Lahore [6]
Nan Madol [10]
Rapa Nui [16]
Yerevan [19] (18+1) By far the best CS in a list of, mostly, really good ones.
Zanzibar [16]

 

[Francel]

Antananarivo [15] (14+1) - Yerevan posse - I like that. Now I can relax and upvote someone else. Antananarivo can provide up to 30% extra culture per turn. Percentage boosts are strong. I'm not exactly sure why but so says the Youtubers I watch (saxy and potato mostly). Clearly, it may take a long time to reach 30%, but I'm pretty sure that it has the highest potential for boosting a yield. It shouldn't be impossible to get 15 great persons over the course of a game.
Auckland [15]
Bologna [21]
Caguana [9]
Cahokia [18]
Geneva [11]
Kumasi [5] (8-5) - We are down to strong contenders, but trade routes are often in short supply, and can be hard to redirect without going to war. Thus, if suzerainity changes, or trade routes get cut off, there can be a lag time in redirecting things to make use of the benefit. Also, there may be reasons to either send a trade route to a specific place to make a road, or get a trading empire in a new civ, build an alliance, or collect other yields (internal and external) - priorities that conflict with the Kumasi bonus. Even though Kumasi is strong, those are some reasons why it may be weaker than the others on the list.
Lahore [6]
Nan Madol [10]
Rapa Nui [16]
Yerevan [19]
Zanzibar [16]

 

[CrabHelmet]

Missed most of this one, which is a shame.

Antananarivo [15] - Antananarivo is great because it has essentially no opportunity cost. You get more culture for just doing all the things you would do in an ordinary game anyway.
Auckland [15] - Not really committed to any particular victory condition, but just all round good. 1 Production early on for Coast tiles makes a real change as to how quickly you can get coastal cities up and running, and access the Lighthouse, plus it scales well later on too. Really nice City-State.
Bologna [18] (21-3) - Bologna is good but not so good as to be this far out ahead of the pack, particularly with how scaling for Great Persons now works. Surprised Antananarivo is so far behind relatively given these two both situate on Great Persons and Antananarivo arguably scales much better over the course of the game. I don't think Bologna is necessarily the worst but want to draw some attention to it and feel the lead is undeserved.
Caguana [9] - I'd have downvoted Caguana if I didn't want to draw attention to Bologna. The Batey is being very heavily overrated here, it's not that good an improvement. In order to get the most culture of out the Batey you have to avoid harvesting Bonus Resources, which you shouldn't be doing at higher difficulty levels as the slingshot from harvesting is vital.
Cahokia [18] - Another really, really strong City-State. The gold from this can really snowball and like Auckland it's multipurpose and contributes to a wide range of win conditions.
Geneva [11] - I struggle to rate this one. It is good, but only because the AI is too dumb to nullify it properly. In MP it's literally worthless, in SP Deity it's actually a really good City-State.
Kumasi [6] (5+1) - I'm inclined to disagree with @bengalryan9 - I think that the yields from trade routes are much too significant for this to be better than Nan Madol. I agree that once you get Kumasi, you would rather run trade routes to City-States than other Civs/internally, but it's still a painful trade-off to make and can slow you down a fair bit early on. Nan Madol doesn't do this, even if Kumasi might be a bit better later on. Both very good though, and not a huge amount between them. However, I'm also upvoting because Kumasi is falling too far behind when there are worse options ahead of it.
Lahore [6] - Another one I'd have considered downvoting. The Nihang is not that good, it is more often a win-more than something which turns a loss to a win or a win into a much faster win or more reliable win. However, I think Caguana is worse.
Nan Madol [10] - See Kumasi.
Rapa Nui [16] - in the right surrounding conditions, Moai are absolutely broken, in the wrong surrounding conditions, they're worthless. Hard to evaluate. I don't think Rapa Nui should be this far ahead of the pack, but I have other priorities.
Yerevan [19] - If this isn't the winner we just delete the forum, shut down the Civ series, and get on with our lives.
Zanzibar [16] - Zanzibar is another one sneaking by on not really being discussed, I actually think this is one of the weaker City-States remaining. I never find Amenities to be the road block in any of my games, Housing is the real limitation. Probably better than Caguana and Lahore but would definitely be looking to get rid of Zanzibar not long after.

 

[hhhhhh]

Was meant to downvote Cahokia this turn but it seems like Cahokia was downvoted once already (and correctly). Bologna is also correctly downvoted once when I was writing this. They are both good but not really the best. I believe Kumasi deserve a little better (it was downvoted as I was writing) but decide to upvote Rapa Nui anyway.

Antananarivo [15]
Auckland [15]
Bologna [18]
Caguana [9]
Cahokia [18]
Geneva [11]
Kumasi [6]
Lahore [6]
Nan Madol [10]

Rapa Nui [17] (16 + 1) Correctly estimate the value of culture in non-cultural games and build Moais (and decide if you want to put population on it) so your civic progress matches your need is an art. You don't just spam Moai, you use Moai to do what they do. Sometimes putting Moai on hills is an error, sometimes it's what you have to do.

Yerevan [16] (19 - 3) I guess the main difference is not on whether Yerevan is strong. It's that for some of us (like me, and I think many others do), the victory type is decided before map generation, and if I decided to go science/domination then Yerevan is useless. I noticed that someone said if he saw Yerevan he changes victory goal. While I understand that it's not happening to many of us. Sometimes you decide to go religious victory but Yerevan is not there, and sometimes they are there and you don't go religious victory. If you are open to "meet a city state early and change play style", then Kandy, Lahore, Nan Madol, Rapa Nui all do the job.

Zanzibar [16]

 

[Leucarum]

Antananarivo [16] This is the city state I get happiest to see.
Auckland [15]
Bologna [18]
Caguana [9]
Cahokia [18]
Geneva [11]
Kumasi [6]
Lahore [3] (6-3) Personal preference is not to go for these. Nihang can be strong/borderline OP but dom in civ6 isn't as much fun with the poor AI.
Nan Madol [10]
Rapa Nui [17]
Yerevan [16]
Zanzibar [16]

 

[kryat]

Antananarivo [17] (16+1) Do you know what kinds of victory types generate a lot of great people? Culture. It’s easy to activate and has a big bonus. It’s not worth much of your culture output is low, but I’d argue it’s as game-winning as Yerevan.
Auckland [15]
Bologna [18]
Caguana [9]
Cahokia [18]
Geneva [11]
Kumasi [6]
Lahore [3]
Nan Madol [10]
Rapa Nui [17]
Yerevan [16]
Zanzibar [13] (16-3) Amenities are fairly easy to come by, and there are diminishing returns on having an excess. With great regret, I must downvote.

 

[tedhebert]

Antananarivo [17]
Auckland [15]
Bologna [18]
Caguana [6] (9-3) you might find me stubborn here, downticking for the 3 time in a row, because it's just not even close to deserve still being in this list
Cahokia [18]
Geneva [11]
Kumasi [6]
Lahore [4] (3+1) Well, the Lahore Posse is out, as someone else would say ;-) In strength. Upticking this once again because I feel it's better than many left here. I'm not in the "If it ain't culture, it's trash" kind of mentality we seem to be seeing in here
Nan Madol [10]
Rapa Nui [17]
Yerevan [16]
Zanzibar [13]

EDIT: BTW, Many people have argued that culture is more important than the rest because it's a harder yield to find. I find this funny, because people in theses boards have been saying they have trouble avoiding Culture Victory by default in their games for years.

 

[Amrunril]

Antananarivo [17]
Auckland [16] (15 +1) If you have any coastal tiles, this provides a ton of production at no cost beyond the envoys invested. If you happen to have a coastal start, this early production can transform your game beyond what any of these other CS can do. If not, you'll presumably still be founding some coastal cities eventually (since expansion is so critical in Civ VI), and Auckland's production will help a lot in getting these cities off the ground.
Bologna [18]
Caguana [6]
Cahokia [18]
Geneva [8] (11-3) +15% science until one of your opponents decides they don't want you to have +15% science. The AI not denying you this bonus doesn't mean the bonus is good, it just means the AI isn't competent enough to deal with it.
Kumasi [6]
Lahore [4]
Nan Madol [10]
Rapa Nui [17]
Yerevan [16]
Zanzibar [13]

 

[JJOne]

Antananarivo [14]
Auckland [16]
Bologna [18]
Caguana [6]
Cahokia [18]
Geneva [8]
Kumasi [3] (6-3) Really big when found early, but gets less and less important as time passes.. I don't know others, but
Lahore [4]
Nan Madol [10]
Rapa Nui [18] (17+1) Very nice improvement, and I don't think I've upvoted it till now.
Yerevan [16]
Zanzibar [13]

 

[JesseS]

Antananarivo [17]
Auckland [13] (16-3) Though coastal cities have gotten a lot stronger, it's still rare that they are going to be working more than a handful of coastal resource tiles until relatively late in the game. Coastal cities really need to build a harbor and build/buy a lighthouse before you even want to work sea tiles. Auckland doesn't help these cities get off the ground, it just makes them better after hitting pop 4+. Sea tiles get really powerful with Auckland by the Industrial era with Mausoleum/fisheries/shipyards/seaports, but I think the early benefit of Auckland has been overstated in most cases.
Bologna [18]
Caguana [6]
Cahokia [18]
Geneva [8] Geneva's strength varies so much on whether you're thinking about multiplayer or not. The science from Geneva is unparalleled, but it's easy for a human opponent to nullify. I'm inclined to rate them top 5, but I also only play single-player.
Kumasi [3]
Lahore [4]
Nan Madol [11] (10+1) Nan Madol provides an instant +2 culture to coastal cities (+4 after the harbor), helping them grow their borders and claim productive tiles, in addition to contributing to empire-wide culture. With reef science adjacency and theater squares next to coastal wonders, there's already plenty of reasons to place districts on coasts and Nan gives you a nice passive reward for that.
Rapa Nui [18]
Yerevan [16]
Zanzibar [13]

 

[Lamington]

Antananarivo [17]
Auckland [14] (13 + 1) Production is often harder to come by early, especially coastal. Auckland helps make coastal cities, which are already improved, more viable early, and then scale to improve them further late game. Not OP by any means, but a stable bonus for the coastal cities.
Bologna [18]
Caguana [6]
Cahokia [18]
Geneva [5] (8 - 3) While an awesome bonus for peaceful play, as others have mentioned, it’s also one of the few bonuses that can completely be nullified by other factors outside your control. Yes I often play peacefully, which makes Geneva viable, but if you want to wage war on a troublesome neighbour, you can say goodbye to this bonus.
Kumasi [3]
Lahore [4]
Nan Madol [11]
Rapa Nui [18]
Yerevan [16]
Zanzibar [13]

 

[Josephias]

Antananarivo [17]
Auckland [14]
Bologna [18]
Caguana [6]
Cahokia [18]
Geneva [5]
Kumasi [3]
Lahore [4]
Nan Madol [11]
Rapa Nui [15] (18-3) As some commented earlier, too many culture-producers in the list now. I've been going trough all of them, and I'm surprised Rapa Nui is so high in the list now, as of all the potential improvement this seems to me the one with greatest opportunity cost (unless you happen to be in volcanic grounds)
Yerevan [17] (16+1) At some point I had to upvote Yerevan. Tailoring your apostles is killer for RV, and as some other commented, is useful for some strategies too.
Zanzibar [13]

 

[monikernemo]

On the remark on cultural victory: you don't need culture to win a culture victory? You need tourism...
And you can never have enough culture because you can (and would want to) change your policies frequently, of course unless you are playing Pericles.

Antananarivo [17]
Auckland [11] (14 - 3)
2 cogs for reefs is still pretty lack luster. I rather build mines / lumbermills for my coastal cities.
The industrial era bonus kick in way too late for it to be useful.
Bologna [18]
Caguana [6]
Firstly, you dont harvest every type of bonus resource you have; obviously stone, deer are valuable to harvest. If you place farms on food resources i.e. wheat, rice, bananas or stable on cattle/sheep, then Caguana becomes valuable. If you find caguana weak perhaps you can explain why it is weak as opposed to downvoting it based on your feelings.
Cahokia [18]
Geneva [5]
Kumasi [3]
Lahore [4]
Nan Madol [11]
Rapa Nui [15] I dont understand how Rapa Nui has a high opp cost compared to the other culture producers?
Yerevan [17]
Zanzibar [14] (13 + 1)
Like this poll, zanzibar is strong early game because it frees up every luxury you have and turn them into cashcows without any amenities penalty.

 

[Baigan]

Antananarivo [17]
Auckland [11]
Bologna [18]
Caguana [6]
Cahokia [18]
Geneva [5]
Kumasi [4] 3+1 Nan Madol is better but only slightly. They shouldn't be so far apart.
Lahore [1] 4-3 Constructing Encampment buildings is awkward because they dont directly contribute to any VC. Taking advantage of this CS requires a lot of investment for... a good benefit, but not one that's worthy of top 10.
Nan Madol [11]
Rapa Nui [15]
Yerevan [17]
Zanzibar [14]

 

[Hokie Fan]

Antananarivo [17]
Auckland [11]
Bologna [18]
Caguana [6]
Cahokia [18]
Geneva [5]
Kumasi [4]
Lahore [1]
Nan Madol [12] (11+1) - My favorite cultural city state. Antanarivo definitely generates more culture late game, but Nan Madol helps you easily overcome the early cultural bottleneck. Whenever you can get early culture, you're going to have a pleasant game and this is where Nan Madol excels.
Rapa Nui [15]
Yerevan [17]
Zanzibar [11] (14-1) - All of the remaining city states are good, but Zanzibar is my least favorite of the ones left. The AI will sell you their duplicate luxuries at 2 GPT, which makes getting happy and ecstatic cities relatively easy.

 

[The Civs 6]

Antananarivo [17]
Auckland [11]
Bologna [18]
Caguana [6]
Cahokia [18] + 1 = 19. The other ones are win harder options. I'm not super convinced that a city state turning a 200 turn victory into a 150 turn victory really matters. I want a CS that turns a mediocre game that you will win just bc you are a human beating up computers into a game where you have a vibrant, dominant civilization, and the end of the game is a victory lap. +1 housing +3 gold (along with improvements with techs) on any flat tile is the bonus that helps you do that. And if you find it far away and it gets wiped out, as long as you got feudalism and spammed those mounds out, you might shed a tear but your people will get over it because they are living in tundra mounds. Other CS's are more impactful situationally but you can always use mounds in every game. Heck, if you are their suzerain, you basically have one-third of the Maya bonus.
Geneva [5]
Kumasi [4]
Lahore [1]
Nan Madol [12]
Rapa Nui [15]
Yerevan [17]
Zanzibar [11] - 3 = 8. With all the other ones here we are talking about CS's that are game changing. We are throwing the word "op" around. We are talking about shortening your time to victory. Extra amenities are really helpful, but in the grand scheme of things you can and should be able to plan accordingly.

 

[TCBB]

Antananarivo [17]
Auckland [11]
Bologna [18]
Caguana [6]
Cahokia [19]
Geneva [5]
Kumasi [4]
Lahore [1]
Nan Madol [9] (12-3) Seems to be a race to the bottom for around five or six city-states at the moment. I’d throw Nan Madol into the mix, mainly because I.) even if it applies to more districts/wonders than anticipated, I’m still not going to go out of my way to ignore the best district adjacencies in order to activate Nan Madol, and II.) I do believe that Kumasi’s bonus is less situational, more reliable, and has the potential to come on board earlier.
Rapa Nui [15]
Yerevan [17]
Zanzibar [9] (8+1) again, I understand people’s desire for revisionism, but this is too much. Early suzerain Zanzibar *is* game-changing. You’re receiving so many amenities from Zanzibar alone, that you can sell off all your other luxuries for *a lot* of gold; or alternatively, you can sell off the cloves & cinnamon as well for even more. You’re now around earning 40-60 gold per turn more, at a period before commercial hubs or harbours are online. That’s game-changing amounts. And then later in the game, you can keep the cloves & cinnamon to help your cities remain happy / ecstatic.

 

[Noble Zarkon]

Out the rest of the day so posting a bit earlier than usual.

Antananarivo [17]
Auckland [11]
Bologna [18]
Caguana [6]
Cahokia [19]
Geneva [5]
Kumasi [4]
Lahore [-2] 1 - 3 Eliminated; just not enough of a difference maker to last much longer, worthy finish though.
Nan Madol [9]
Rapa Nui [15]
Yerevan [17]
Zanzibar [10] 9+1 One of the top 2 CS shouldn't be in single digits, crazy! Impactful for all victory types.

 

[Drivingrevilo]

Antananarivo [17]
Auckland [11]
Bologna [18]
Caguana [6]
Cahokia [19]
Geneva [5]
Kumasi [4]
Nan Madol [9]
Rapa Nui [12] (15-2) Seems overrated at the moment. The yields become good in one of two situations. The first is next to volcanoes; but this is situational and comes with the threat of eruption. The second is when placed in triangles; but this takes up several tiles and, more importantly, requires a lot of builder charges - not only the three charges to actually make the Moai, but also any further charges for chops/clearing the space. Compare this with the Batey, which only needs one builder charge for almost comparable yields.
Yerevan [18] (17+1) Shoring it up more against the inevitable further downvotes. The more I dwell on it, the more I’m convinced it deserves first place.
Zanzibar [10]

 

[CrabHelmet]

Antananarivo [17]
Auckland [11]
Bologna [18]
Caguana [3] (6-3) - Look, Caguana seriously has to be the next to go. There's no good way you can make a case for it over even Kumasi. In order to get your culture from Caguana, you have to forego harvesting, which is much stronger than trade routes in the opening stages of the game (because you don't have many trades routes early on and you have a fair amount to harvest and the instant resources are so valuable. I can't see a plausible case for any City-State here that isn't Caguana.
Cahokia [19]
Geneva [5]
Kumasi [4]
Nan Madol [9]
Rapa Nui [12] - Agreed with the above poster this is overrated for the same reasons.
Yerevan [19] (18+1) - Yerevan has to be ahead of Bologna and I've already downvoted Bologna.
Zanzibar [10] - Zanzibar is being grossly overestimated. Someone said the main advantage is that you can trade your luxuries away for GPT, but like, I almost never find Amenities seriously restricting in the early game and I am extremely aggressive about expansion. I sell all my luxuries for GPT anyway, Zanzibar makes no difference here. In practice, it's just two extra luxuries to sell, which is slightly more front-loaded than e.g. Cahokia, but ultimately something like Cahokia provides much more gold in the long run (and Housing, which is a bigger block than Amenities). Plus, you can lose Zanzibar. Cahokia's improvements stay even after you lose Cahokia. No way this should be the second-placed.

It also has the same problem as Geneva - the main advantage of Zanzibar comes because the AI is really dumb. In MP, Zanzibar is essentially worthless. Admittedly against the AI it is very good, but Geneva is rightfully on 5 points because people have pointed out it is only good because the AI is dumb, but somehow Zanzibar is being treated differently?