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Civ 3 GOTM#3 *Spoiler* talks

Elfi Wolfe

Chieftain
Joined
Nov 7, 2001
Messages
41
Location
Eugene, Oregon
Another semi bad starting positions. So I was thinking there should be another civ close with a good position.

Found them with 3 warriors within 5 turns of their capital. and with China being a militaristic civ declaired war and attacked.
Got it but they had another city and that took time to find.

Now I got my captial making military units and the Ex-captial making setlers.

Guess in games, War does pay.
 
GOTM update 1 :
============

Well the starting location was pretty bad. So I built Beijing and started exploring. Bad luck with the huts except one conscript. The others were mostly aggressive tribes or little gold. Then I built my next two cities and after building my second town, found out the Japanese. Wha, they had 2 more techs then me! I gave them all I had to get Ceremonial Burial. Then continued building warriors and then spearmen. I did not go for any wonders as I don’t like any of the early wonders. I will go for Sun Tzu. I like it. It blends perfectly with my playing style. I did not go for an early rush cause its too risky and well, it is just too unrealistic. I like to build a perfect civ with happy people. I play the game for fun, not for score.

May be not building any wonders saved me. I started churning out spearmen and had enough to had 2 per city. Then the Japs asked me for 33 golds. Hey Toku, why will I give you my hard-earned(!) gold? Well that butthead won’t listen to reason and declared war on me. Well, I saw them coming toward Tsingtao and stacked 5 spearmen and an elite warrior there and allied with Xerxes. Then they came with 6 archers and 4 warriors, 2 of them elite. But Tsingtao was built on a hill and I lost no units while the Japs lost six. They would have lost more but when I asked them for peace, they agreed. Well as soon as I signed my peace treaty with the fools, Persians and Babylonians signed a military alliance against my good friend Toku ;)

Well I killed some barbs and so far no city of mine has been looted or pillaged. I am in around 450 BC. Continuing to build cities. Got 3 iron but no horse yet. French has got hordes. I will get horses from them, Xerxes or Hammurabi. Got enough spearmen and warriors and I’ll build Sun Tzu and…the steamroller muhahahaha :D.
 
This game is too easy. I'm at 300 ad and have all the continent other than where the french are. I also have the Great Lighthouse, Oracle, Great Library, and the territory maps of all the civs in the game. Not sure how long it will take to kill the french off with a combination of horsemen and swordmen, but I already have 6 galleys built up to start the ocean transporting with another galley arriving every 4 turns.

The most annoying thing about this game is that I haven't actually killed off any civ. Persia and Babs have 1 respawned city and the Japenese respawned and are up to 3 cities, but they are just a nuisance as they are all hopeless.

If I'm lucky I might be able to win between 1000ad and 1200 ad, but the game is pretty easy and tech is moving really slow.

btw, on the two goodie huts near the start spot I got barbarians and bronze working.

Eliezar
 
hmm .. i'm not really sure if this 'thing' continues but right now i'm in 630bc with 10 cities spread very far from eachother and NO CORRUPTION at all!!! .. and all because i did something utterly crazy .. i didn't build my start city at all .. i simply started to explore a bit with all my units since i thought that starting location looked like crap ...
and the first couple of huts gave some nice warriors and one got elite on a barbarian horde .. and then i stumbled upon the japanese .. and thought .. what a nice location to build an empire .. so i attacked their capital with my .. and won!! .. i then got double lucky and razed their next city and build one of my own ..
the result of this was: i have NO PALACE!! .. for some reason this makes my empire totally corruption-free .. i made peace with the japanese who strangely enough had 2 more cities close to the french on the other side of the continent (i think they respawned but was still a bit suprised) .. and the japanese were so scared that they gave me all there tech and one of their new cities ..
from then on it has been a breeze .. the japanese start location is very good and my little annex close to the french has now grown to 3 cities (one of them conquered from yet another little skirmish with the silly japanese .. will they ever learn?)
i have iron, horses, 4 luxuries (soon 5) and just got a leader for the great lighthouse

anybody else ever experienced this? having no palace?
even though it feels a bit cheesy and the rest of the game is pretty much a win/win situation .. i must admit i'm having great fun :D

Wizlock
 
just did some quick testing .. for starters you cant sell your palace so to duplicate my scenario with no palace i started a new game and build a city and then a settler ..
when the settler was done i started another settler and build city#2 with my newly created settler .. whe city#1 finished the settler it still had only 2 pop and i abandoned the city hoping to take the palace with me .. but of course (and thinking of it i probably knew this already) the palace was instantly transfered to city#2 ..
so the only way to have a civ without a palace could very possibly be to roam around with your starting units, hoping for some early warriors and for them to get some training in combat and then stumble upon the closest enemy civ and cross your fingers ...
this is a bit silly because it really doesnt require any skill .. just plain luck ..
 
That's crazy! Good, though, if it works. I am just about to start my GOTM.
 
Íve just exploited your discovery, and i must say it is superb!! No corrupotion... WOW. I killed the japanese in 2670 BC(new record for me :D ) it gave me 3 cities and 1 city with my own settler.. a very good start. It was pretty strange that the japanese had a city on the other side of the map after i killed their main city, but fine for me. I made peace with them, got a city and went to war again ( dont think the other civs are very happy to have me in the game ;) ). I finally captured the last remaining city and killed them. Now i have two cities on both sides of my territory(almost 5 cities)... dont know if it is good or bad.

I have never really played with barbarians( just hate to have my cities razed by those pesky barbarians..
If anyone can tell me how bad it will be and how much i need to protect my cities i would be very happy..
 
Wow excellent start for me on this map, probably my best start ever. On the first goody hut right near Beijing I got a friendly settler. Soon after I attacked the Japanese and took their capital; unfortunately they grew back on the other continent. I turned my agressions on the Persians and took their capital, after I evacuated it it reverted back to them culturally. My trusty army took it back along with their 2nd city. The Persians grew back on the other continent too. I was able to find them again and force them into a peace treaty in which they gave their entire treasury, a city and contact with Joan of Arc.

Centuries passed...

So now I am becoming friends with the Babylonians and intend to start a war soon. I am mass-producing settlers and swordsman and, along with my ally Hammurabi, will invade the other continent soon.

The only bummer is no Leaders so far.

Is there another continent?
 
I guess im the only one that had a REALLY bad experience with this GOTM. I started my first city almost right where we started. Built my second city pretty quick across the mountains. After the second city, I tried to go for something new instead of my usual cultural go. I built up LOTS of archers, sent them out to explore, knocked off the Japs pretty quickly, but they repsawned near the Persians. Well as I went to take the last city from the Japs, the persians somehow made a sneak attack against my capital! They took it over, and it got me pretty ticked. From my second city i built a few more archers and sent them to take back my main city. Well that was really futile cause the Persians and LOADS of horsemen, and got their attacks of before my archers and they were wiped out. I decided to abandon my capital city and my second city. That left me with three Jap city's. I signed a peace treaty with the Persians, and then focused on the Japs again. I guess while i was trying to get my capital city back the Japs built up a nice sized army, and went through mine easily, then proceeded to take over the city's I originally took from them. All of this happened before 1 AD. At least this GOTM taught me two things, 1) Dont try to rush anymore 2) Archers are terrible
;) Ahh well guess i'll just have to get a little more practice in ;)
 
The no corruption bug certainly should be considered an exploit, and shouldn't be something people try to reproduce in GOTM's. Wizlock stumbling into this is acceptable, people shouldn't be punished for things out of their control. Corruption on this map really won't make a difference of getting a high score most likely, as pop rushing (corruption free production) is going to lead to very early conquests (not quite as early as the first GOTM, but close). Reproducing the no corruption bug would almost invariably involve extensive save/reload before poping the huts and attacking, as getting barbarians from any huts would end your game, and attacking with conscript warriors (or having them attacked by enough barbarians to get them promoted) would usually end up with a dead conscript warrior. I would highly suspect any more games that would claim to have this happen by chance, as this is the first I have heard of this bug on any boards, and so may be the first occurance anyone (of the 1000's registered here, at apolyton, and yahoo) has had.

I thought that the starting location was very good, though having so much jungle nearby is a bit of a problem. Later on in the game, jungle = grasslands with a chance for rubber and coal. On regent, with a luxury, that means you really don't even need temples for happiness until after size 5, and 3 other luxuries are pretty easy to get control of quite early.

I built my capitol right where I was placed, and built a warrior, settler, and then just started flooding the japanese and persians with bowmen. Taking the persian cities gave me horses, and from there I started pop rushing horsemen to fight the babylonians and french. I purposely allowed the japanese and persians to keep their last cities, which was a mistake. Kyoto ended up defecting back to the japanese, and ended up costing me 2 elite archers, and 6 elite horsemen taking it back (plus the time it took to have them go back through the jungle). I've never lost even 1/5th of the horsemen I have so far in this game, just having terrible luck when attacking. Usually I'll lose about 1 in 10 to the "too close to retreat" senario. On this game it has been over half of my attacks end in a dead horsemen, but it will only delay the inevitable ;)

Knowing that it was a continents map, I started the pyramids to switch to the great lighthouse as soon as possible (after 2 archers), and was able to build it by around 700BC. I sent my first several galleys the wrong way though, thinking that the visible sea extension to the north was the way to the other continent, and then after finding it was just a small island, sending the galleys even further north looking for a crossing. Still, by 600BC I had contact with the other continent, and after 2 failed landings, took Thebes. I think if someone gets a good run of luck they could take over the world in the late BC's, with the battle results I usually have in games, I would have had a chance myself. With domination enabled, probably the earliest conquest will win, though a game where someone counts the spaces and makes sure they get just 59% of the landmass till 2050 could have a chance. I might end up trying that, as I don't think my conquest will come early enough to win this one. With a smaller map and domination, it shouldn't take nearly the amount of micromanagement that GOTM2 did.

For raging barbarians, you need to take an active role in defense. Having several units out to kill camps really cuts down on barbarian uprisings. I'm not sure, but I think that barbarian uprisings only occur if any given barbarian encampment is allowed to exist for some time. I haven't had any uprisings so far, and have sacked about 30 camps at least. Also, barbarian encampments are a good source of income, as I have had science at 100% for most of the BC's, and still the treasury grows. 1 spearman on a mountain is enough defense for anything but uprisings (then even 3 or 4 spearmen will sometimes lose), but as I said, uprisings can be avoided.
 
For a person in the military I'm just not into wars.
Took the Japanase out start from the start. Then was using the capital to make military and the Japaense Captial to make setlers.
it was great for setting up new cities. Set up a screen line against the Persians and slowly spread down the countant.
bad parts was that I did not cover all the coast lines and had people trying to move setlers trough my area to the unsettled areas to my south. End up having to declare war on the Persians to stop them.
It was a long war because of the imortals.
But a careful inspetion of Persian Lands showed all their iron came from the Antioch Iron Mines. A load of piker and swordmens landed and moved inland to the mines and destroyed the infrastruct and then camped there. Ended the Imortals problem.

Now I got the English landed on the unsettled coast lines in my area and setting up colonies.
Once done with the Persians, (Even sent a 2 galley invastion forces to the horse fields of Sidon.) it was time for taking out the English colonies. I don't want to burn cities directly, so get about 10 catapults and strong defense and get next to the small cities I don't want and just start bombing them until it gets to 1 pop and then take them out.

Found out that you can take out colonies by having cities expand on them or by setting up a city next to the colony.
now that I got the english out I got a bunch of military units on the coast forming lines where I don't have a border yet.

But I just don't like war that much, maybe in the next GOTM I will try for a conquest win. But it is so much more fun to build up a civilization.
 
Btw, i personally consider reading of the *spoiler* threads cheating until after you know the map and civs. For instance, if someone mentions where you can always cross safely if you have the lighthouse and you use that in your game without discovering it that is cheating as soon as anything else.

And on a funny note I didn't realize I had horses for quite awhile. I was actually pushing towards the only horse I saw on the map until I realized I could build horsemen. A city I had taken was hiding a horse. :D

Swordmen are so annoying to fight with compared to horsemen.

Eliezar
 
Well so far things are not going very well for my Chinamen at all. I thought that i was off to a good start when I met the Japanese and took two cities from them, but then i met the Persians and their immortals are kicking my butt. I am not sure if it is the rotten starting position for Beijing, but I am having a heck of a time trying to colonize near the center of the continent. It maybe that im still a beginner here having only finished one game at the second lowest setting but so far I have been handed my behind several times in this game. I know I am not supposed to start over and what not, but with the number of times I have had key cities sacked it would be pointless not too.:mad:

On the same note, what is the deal with the military encounters being so off. having an elite swordsman being killed by a regular pikeman on oposite side of a river is just plain nuts. Or even my favorite was on the game I did win by space race victory in 2046 when my tanks were being taken down by pikeman, very strange how a sharp stick can take down a multi-ton piece of rampaging steel.:tank:
 
After GOTM2 I was happy to see a smaller map on regent level. Imagined this would enable me to get some work done too instead of playing civ, and annoying my business partner in the process.

Good starting location, but a disappointment when I went exploring. Mountains, jungle, desert nothing decent for a second city and more worrying, no other civs around. Only when i turned west I found the Japanese. When I had enough units I started a war and got their first expansion city. Strangely enough they made peace with me immediately and I got a tech and all their gold. Got some new warriors and archers and took their capital and this turned out really well. He gave me 3 techs, all his gold, world map and contact with babs and persians for peace. Continued the war against the Japanese, took a while to get rid of them since they respawned twice. First time for me to see that.

Then things started to slow down. Persians declared war on me when I was just recuperating from finishing the Japanese. It was a real effort to stop them but after some fighting I took Pasargardae and some turns later Antioch, the iron city. No more immortals so that tipped the scale in my favour.

In the meanwhile I had built the great lighthouse and was lucky when trying to cross the ocean. I had just transported 2 units to take out a barb camp south of Bejing and gave it a shot to cross the seas there. Found the second continent right away. I have made contact with the other civs and allied with the english to take out the egyptians. I only had two galleys so when i finally got some troops over they had taken the best cities and I ended up with only one city. Fearing defection of it too since it's far away from my empire and close to the english who have a fair bit of culture themselves.

On my home continent things have turned pretty mean. Babs declared war on me while I'm still busy taking out the last Persian cities. I was forced to pay the french for an alliance against the Babs cause they started sending in hordes of bowmen. The alliance worked ok, it got the Babs of my back and the french are slowing in development because of the war effort.

My failure to clean out barb camps in the southern part of the continent has caused some barb uprisings. I have same the experience as one of the previous posts, just keep razing the barb camps quickly and you won't have a problem.

It's about 500 AD now and I'm second in the histograph, behind the english. I dont suspect any real problems winning the game since i got the Great Lighthouse so the other civs will have a hard time to cross the ocean and I won't grant them contact with each other for a while. So it's onwards to chivalry and riders, taking the home continent and finally the great invasion westward. I'm guessing conquest by 1500AD since I plan to raze a lot to avoid domination victory (I hate domination victory).

This game will probably end me no where near the top positions judging the GOTM1 results but ít's a fun game and I really enjoy reading other peoples results with the same game.


:)
 
Originally posted by Eliezar
Btw, i personally consider reading of the *spoiler* threads cheating until after you know the map and civs.

I agree completely. I wait until the game is completely in hand to look at the spoiler threads, right now I'm just counting spaces and trying to decide whether I should conquer that one last city or not... Finally a map that seems somewhat well balanced between the early conquest and 2050 bloat options. If I do decide to wait until 2050, I'm going to time the building of the UN so that I can lose diplomatically then ;) Maybe 2049, just to be sure I can get that final vote in.

Those ******** hiding the horses under a city certainly was a dirty trick too... especially since it wouldnt work the other way around, the AI always knows where everything is.
 
This is my first GOTM and i must say what a game it has been so far. I started out capturing the japanese capital before i placed my main city. soon after i captured their second city and they respawned on the other side of the continent. After some turns i managed to make peace with them. Got all their techs a city and all gold. Soon after i declared war again and took their last city(destroyed them in 2660 BC new record :D ). I now had 2 cities on one side of the continent and 4 cities on the other side. My plan was to destroy everyone on my continent as fast as possible. so the french was destroyed pretty fast.
I found the persians, and to my luck they had not got a road to iron yet nor had they got the technology to make immortals. I took the 4 cities they got and it was surprisingly easy. I usually have great differculty with the persians. They respawned on the south-eastern side of the continent and there was mainly ice so i had no more worries with them. My cities had allready produced a lot of swordsmen and with them i marched towards Babylon. The babylonians had only 4 cities. Compared to mine 13 cities they were not a treat. Again i was surpriced. There was very little resisting when i began to take the cities from them. Only one time i was attacked by an archer but it was a real bugga to destroy them for good. They respawned 2 times. In the meantime i managed to destroy the persians too. Now i am in 150 BC and has just gone in anarcy to get republic. I am alone on the continent (well.. what i know of) i have the pyramids, the hanging gardens, and soon i have sistine chapel. And i have incredible 24 cities. I have never managed to too destroy 3 civs before 1 AD nor have i managed to get 24 cities so fast.:king: :king:

The next thing i will do is to build up my cities, get a good defence against those pesky barbarians. When i got boat which are able to cross the sea i think i will try to make contact with the other civs... I havent made the lighthouse yet. Is this a good thing to build or should i use my shields for another wonder?
 
I was playing another game tonight, to check on when domination is triggered exactly. I had saved my GOTM3 game at 250BC (forgot to save at 10AD) and had wiped out everyone except for the last Egyptian city. I was waiting to decide whether to take the conquest, or to build up to another victory condition (or diplomatic loss!). While playing the other game I must have accidently saved over it. All my auto saves were saved over as well. :(
 
I have never played with barbarians before and i just got a message about mayor barb uprissing. So far the barbs have been pretty easy but now i face 3 camps with 20 horsemen in each of them trampling towards my cities.... not good. Have anyone else tried this disturbing experience and will it happen more than once??

Right now i replace my units to face the enemy and hope that will be enough but wow 60 horsemen just popping up... not a nice thing.

Right now im in 610 AD. Its a really good game.. so far. I earn the whole continent, just meet the last civs and is about to build up my many cities (45 or so). Well i maybe have to switch production with all the barbarian units outside my cities.:(
 
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