[R&F] Civ of the Week: Cree

Who should be next weeks Civ?

  • Greece (Tonight, we dine in Hell! Also, hill start bias and free envoys)

    Votes: 16 31.4%
  • Norway (think of them like Gilgabro of the Water)

    Votes: 13 25.5%
  • Nubia (think of them like Gilgabro but with Archers)

    Votes: 15 29.4%
  • Sumeria (think of them like ... oh no wait...)

    Votes: 5 9.8%
  • Sythia (hang on, isn't their UU from the Classical era?... bother...)

    Votes: 2 3.9%

  • Total voters
    51
  • Poll closed .
I just finished a successful Cree game and have included a story (for anyone who might be interested). I rather like the Cree civ. The traders in the early game add quite allot of value. A hostile game tone was set by a surprise war Kongo declared on me early on which lasted the rest of the game. Unfortunately, I was unable to utilize the Cree alliance bonuses.


Summary as follows:

Start
Spoiler :
Sid Meier's Civilization VI (DX11) 5_20_2018 10_32_36 AM.png

Due to creating a Cree scout I found three city states relatively quickly and was awarded 3 free envoys!
Built the Temp
le of Artemis Mikisiw-Wachik (the capital), then proceeded to miss a Classical golden age by 1 era score point.
Spoiler :
Sid Meier's Civilization VI (DX11) 5_20_2018 5_16_26 PM.png

On turn 32 Kongo declared war on me. He almost took Ahtahkakoop with an early warrior and heavy chariot surge. I repulsed him with archers. Shortly thereafter, the AI got the bright idea to bring a settler to the front and settle the region (which became my 7th city, Makwa-Sakahikan).
Spoiler :
Sid Meier's Civilization VI (DX11) 5_20_2018 5_48_14 PM.png

Due to Republican Legacy policy card (from the Classical Republic), the Temple of Artemis and the Colosseum, I didn’t have much trouble with war weariness in the long running war with Kongo.
Spoiler :
Sid Meier's Civilization VI (DX11) 5_20_2018 7_38_51 PM.png

Antananarvio began paying noteworthy dividends around turn 82.
Spoiler :
Sid Meier's Civilization VI (DX11) 5_20_2018 8_30_05 PM.png


Hadn’t had much of a chance to explore, so I declared war on Saladin in hopes of that he might be Suzerain of a blue city state (which would immediately declare war on me and expose it to my city state visibility screen). I could then proceed to dump some of the 14 envoys I had accumulated and further leverage my science per turn score. As it turns out, he was suzerain of La Venta :-(. So after finishing Kongo, I headed up toward La Venta with intentions to raze it. This would deny Saladin (and the rest of the AI’s) their faith bonuses, and go a long way toward averting a longshot AI religious victory.

I moved from La Venta toward the former city state of Antioch (which I proceeded to liberate from Saladin). It was here that I took note that the board had all red faced me (hostile relationship). I hypothesized that one of them might be the suzerain of a blue city state, so I declared war on them all. I finally found my blue city state: Geneva!
Spoiler :
Sid Meier's Civilization VI (DX11) 5_20_2018 9_43_54 PM_LI.jpg

Spoiler :
Sid Meier's Civilization VI (DX11) 5_20_2018 9_44_29 PM_LI.jpg

Note: I noticed the Great Library was still available fairly late in the game and had Magnus in a city with builders and forest, so I chopped it up. +2 Science, +1 Great Scientist Point, +1 Great Writer Point, 2 Great Work slots, and 4 or 5 random tech boosts so far. A Bonanza!!! And, at the time, I received +3 era score for my trouble.

The age old perma-war was beginning to take its toll with war weariness.
Spoiler :
Sid Meier's Civilization VI (DX11) 5_21_2018 7_30_12 AM.png

My original cultural victory plans weren't working out, so I build the War Department as my 3rd tier govt. building.

The Arabian navy put up a spirited defense of their last city, but my Modern Armor army finished Saladin and cleared the war weariness board.

After clearing the war weariness by eliminating Saladin, the game was essentially over. I did see that Brazil had an active spaceport, and sent 3 armored columns to pillage it. After having traversed no small distance through slow moving terrain, and right as they were about to move atop the spaceport, the spy I had also sent there successfully “disrupted rocketry.”

Shortly thereafter the spaceport in Wihkasko-Kiseyin triggered the science victory.

Nothing particularly noteworthy here, except long wars made the AI combative and belligerent forcing me to switch from a cultural victory plan to a science victory model. That 1st surprise war Kongo declared on me (and my unwillingness to make peace) set the tone for the rest of the game. The AI’s were never open to friendship or alliances. The Cree free tiles with traders proved useful, as did the free trader at pottery. So far as the extra food from trade routes, I think it may have been something of a problem when combined with the Govt. Plaza building I chose, Audience Chamber. The population in my cities grew larger than I was accustomed to, which created more war weariness. Other than that, again, nothing noteworthy.
 

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Cree to me feels like they're good at making the best of a bad start - dont bother rerolling - mekewaps and the first trader both come early enough to be really valuable. I underrated the grabbing-extra-tiles thing when they were first released - now I often go Pottery first and try to protect my trader against barbs.

I dont like the UU as much - my usual build order starts with a scout and the extra production cost is annoying - but it's nice when they pop out of goody huts. In theory they'd be really strong when upgraded; however in practice I never seem to get one high enough (I prefer the extra strength against barbarians policy early game above the extra xp for scouts one, that might make a difference).

Mekewaps are awesome - but perhaps need a bit more thought into placement than I usually bother with - in mid-to-late game I often replace a mekewap with a wonder/district I forgot to plan for - however I spam them and never seem to run into serious cash or housing problems so I like them. I also dislike chopping bonus resources, so mekewaps work well with justifying that decision.

It's near impossible for me to get a normal Classical Age as Cree, let alone a dark one - in fact I often overshoot dramatically in the first era - that's more of a problem with the way Era points work than with this Civ though.

The alliance-visibility thing helps if I've been lazy with exploring after the initial settling phase - otherwise I barely notice it. Alliances happen in some games and not in others *shrugs*

Overall, solid Civ.

I'm enjoying this thread, will see if I have time later this week to try one of the saved games above.
 
When I play as the Cree, I really feel like I'm building a Native American civ. The music and the art come together so nicely to build up a nice atmosphere, probably due to the mekewaps as well.

They're probably the best peaceful builder civ for atmospheric/roleplaying purposes, and they're certainly high up there for strength as well as a civ in my opinion. The mekewap is one of the most fun UIs and very strong due to the production bonus, not to mention the fun in figuring out where you can build them. It makes you feel like you have a collection of villages. They encourage you to go the commercial hub route and make lots of traders, and between them and the mekewaps you can end up with a ton of gold.

They're the ultimate choose your own path civ, gold is always good for whichever route you decide to go :)
 
Mekewaps are actualy much stronger than their desciption. They give monstrous amounts of gold after you research Cartography. 2 for every adjacent luxury I believe.
 
Well this start looks better though other issues popped up.
NRMKjyQ.jpg



Seed
Game -2030299835
Map -2030299834
Poundmaker
Emperor, Shuffle, Normal Speed and Normal Size


This game I went for a silly Oracle+ Commercial Hub strategy, and then took forever to actually build any traders beyond the 2 Cree get by default which is why I like them. So most of my gold was just coming from the great people with pretty low GPT.. Also guess the map overall was slow since I could declare a Colonial War on the next highest tech civ. :S
Spoiler :

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I got the Metroplex achievement without realizing it.
Spoiler :

Uw12a6R.jpg


Late late late Pyramids
Spoiler :
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Actually I wouldn't have attacked Greece but that's in the way of a canal.
Spoiler :
pWasiOo.jpg
 

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So I see some of you say that since you can make a lot of gold with the Cree you build commercial hubs. But I feel like it is better to do the opposite and build other districts instead and take advantage of the fact that you do not have to have that many commercial hubs.

I usually spend all money on units and with the Cree I found that easy to do and could get out campus and theatre squares and be very evolved, rich,armed and even faith producing at the same time.
 
So I see some of you say that since you can make a lot of gold with the Cree you build commercial hubs. But I feel like it is better to do the opposite and build other districts instead and take advantage of the fact that you do not have to have that many commercial hubs.

I usually spend all money on units and with the Cree I found that easy to do and could get out campus and theatre squares and be very evolved, rich,armed and even faith producing at the same time.
You could do that, except it's the TRs that make you (a lot of) the money. They're better than normal so my inclination is to double down on what I do well.
 
So what do you do with it? Gold is not a victory path
 
@liv I actually agree with you. Normally, I build very few Commercial Hubs and even in my last playthrough I have only 2 trade routes @ turn 100 because I didn't need any and just used them internally. I also agree that gold alone doesn't win, but it sure helps!

It is still fun though.
 
So what do you do with it? Gold is not a victory path
grow your cities with the internal TRs. Yeah I know gold+food aren't victory conditions but no matter what route I go I don't remember a time where I wish I didn't have so much money.
 
Gold is not a victory path

It can be for Conquest victory if you want to flat out purchase units. Though the Cree aren't well suited for that (though they can still trade with city states).

hmm, I'm almost tempted to fire up a Cree conquest game. I'm getting ideas now. If I finish my Pillars of Eternity 2 game soon (I think I'm near the end), then I may try a Cree conquest game. Might be fun.
 
Not sure why purchasing units is a good way to go. You have denied yourself culture and science progress so the units you buy will be less effective than the ones you could have had if you did not horde gold. Is that not right?
I purchase airplanes sometimes though. I like that 5 era score.
 
Yeah I rarely feel the need to purchase units, though occasionally I do to form 3 corps for the inspiration. Realistically production wins conquest victories more than gold. But both can be beneficial, but I find gold mostly only necessary for unit upkeep.
 
Gold is always useful to speed things up, especially when you are playing on Epic speed. I'm hoping to wrap up my Egypt game from last week soon. I'm currently making around 700 gold per turn there, in spite of playing on a small map and not going very wide.

As with last week's civ, this thread makes me want to try a Cree game.
 
So I see some of you say that since you can make a lot of gold with the Cree you build commercial hubs. But I feel like it is better to do the opposite and build other districts instead and take advantage of the fact that you do not have to have that many commercial hubs.

I usually spend all money on units and with the Cree I found that easy to do and could get out campus and theatre squares and be very evolved, rich,armed and even faith producing at the same time.

Cree's trade routes are very very good, especially the internal routes. More food and gold and the traders expand your cultural borders which saves a ton of money as well. Gold is the most flexible resource in the game. You can either build a campus and wait forever for the library to finish or build a bunch of commercial hubs and buy the library. Later you can even buy campuses with Reyna. Cree's abilities boost every trader so I don't see why I wouldn't go for the 2nd option.

This game I went for a silly Oracle+ Commercial Hub strategy, and then took forever to actually build any traders beyond the 2 Cree get by default which is why I like them. So most of my gold was just coming from the great people with pretty low GPT.. Also guess the map overall was slow since I could declare a Colonial War on the next highest tech civ. :S

Why do you think it's silly? It works very well on some maps but the timings are quite important. Didn't you get both early great merchants who add the free trade routes?

Edit: I've tried your map and it's just awful. Bad starting location, too much grassland, two very close neighbours, Brazil got all the rivers for commercial hubs, tiny landmass where Cree scouts feel completely useless and can't get enough era score for the golden age.
Sure, I could archer rush Brazil and play a standard boring game but I'd rather skip this one. I was already bored to death after 50 turns. xD
 
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The kind of games I play, the game is pretty much over before Reyna can buy a district. I don't think that gold is not great but I think commercial hubs are less important than campus and theatre squares and I like to use that with the Cree and still have some flexibility with the gold they bring in in other ways. I do not like big cities so growth I avoid. But I guess it is about different play styles and objectives here.
I just find it a bit strange when people show that they ended the game having half a million gold in the bank and several thousands faith. These are things I use the minute I have them.
But I get that we are different. So fun to learn about what makes others tick...
 
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Yeah, I've been mostly using the $$$ to buy builders it seems. That and buildings. Big cities need good land to work
 
I just find it a bit strange when people show that they ended the game having half a million gold in the bank and several thousands faith. These are things I use the minute I have them.
But I get that we are different.

Yea, I kind of feel that unused currency = wasted currency; if I'm not saving for something (eg National Park, specific Great Person), I'll buy stuff as soon as I can afford it - especially since "stuff now" in Civ always seams to beat "stuff later." But to each his own, I guess.

I finished an amazing snowbally Cree Culture game last night which went Turn 2 relic hut - Earth Goddess pantheon - third religion with the ability to buy campus/theatre buildings with faith and Wats - classical golden age using monumentality to buy settlers/builders/traders and production to build districts and a couple wonders - growing cities fast with internal trade routes - science from CHs and Harbours golden age next - faithbuying amphitheatres, libraries etc - then two successive golden ages with the cant-plunder trade routes dedication - using extra gold to buy military units to defend against the occasional invasion - lots of open borders, alliances and of course mekewaps - then cultural VC before I even reached the age that offers the extra tourism dedication.

But a lot of the snowball was due to being able to actually get the EG pantheon - that combined with mekewaps everywhere meant I chopped very very little - and actually went Liang - Pingala - Magnus this time. Cree trade routes are strong.
 
Why do you think it's silly? It works very well on some maps but the timings are quite important. Didn't you get both early great merchants who add the free trade routes?

Yea they came a bit later. I got 7 out of the first 8 GMs until the rest started catching up.


Edit: I've tried your map and it's just awful. Bad starting location, too much grassland, two very close neighbours, Brazil got all the rivers for commercial hubs, tiny landmass where Cree scouts feel completely useless and can't get enough era score for the golden age.

Well, sadly I'd consider it above average given what the game's been giving me lately.... And yea I did kill off Brazil and just head on from there. You can still use harbors to get trade routes if you want to, but I think maps without rivers do highlight the Cree strengths since the extra trade route is more emphasized and not as a no-brainer.
 
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