Civilization IV: Heroes?

[AlexanderIV]

Fall from Heaven, as we all know, had powerful one-time units known as Heroes. They were able to defend cities nearly single-handedly and to, likewise, take small cities down alone. The drawback was that when they died, they died. But for he short time they were there, they could turn the tide of a war or an entire game for warmongers.

My question is, why isn't there a mod to do this for regular old BtS? Most all civilizations have, somewhere in their dusty history tomes, legends of a brave hero that changed the course of history. The Greeks had King Leonidas (though he's a GG for the Greeks, which I'd like to change). The Roman Empire had the likes of Germanicus. The Scots had William Wallace. The Chinese had Yue Fei. I could go on and on.

I'm useless on the technical side of things; the creative side is my cup of tea. However, I'd love to get a few good men together and make this happen.

 

[Voyhkah]

I'm making a mod that adds hero units, and Legands of Revolution also does that, although not to the same extant as iNoc.

 

[AlexanderIV]

I'm making a mod that adds hero units, and Legands of Revolution also does that, although not to the same extant as iNoc.

I like a lot of the ideas in your mod, specifically Stratigems, Supply and your modifications to existing values and traits, but it's a larger project than what I'd have, and the same with Legends of Revolution, really.

 

[The_J]

I don't think that something like this has been done for Civ4...at least not for 3.19. There's a core mod comp for 3.17, but has never been updated (this).

The problem with heroes for BtS is that the time span and the strength differences are too big (IMHO).
You have quite some differences between a axe man and a tank, but in FfH2 the differences between units at the beginning and at the end are not that drastic, so that it works there better.

 

[topsecret]

I actually have a 25% finished mod like this. I quit it when I couldn't find art for the heroes. I can do XML, though I get side-tracked by life easily; you may have to hound me

 

[AlexanderIV]

I don't think that something like this has been done for Civ4...at least not for 3.19. There's a core mod comp for 3.17, but has never been updated (this).

The problem with heroes for BtS is that the time span and the strength differences are too big (IMHO).
You have quite some differences between a axe man and a tank, but in FfH2 the differences between units at the beginning and at the end are not that drastic, so that it works there better.

I see what you mean. I think it could be fixed, though, by adding, say, multiple heroes by era to each of the Civs and balancing their strengths and abilities to the standards at that time.

A hypothetical:
The Era is Classical, and you're controlling the Greeks. Say you're not the big dog on the map and you've managed to offend the honor of some high-end Warmonger Civ. They come at you with full force, but luckily you put in the beakers to research Heroism (Possibly in the Philosophy tree), and you've got some good production cities, so you chop and whip yourself out some Phalanx units and you send them to the front lines to keep their mounted units outside your borders and away from your improvements. While your Phalanx holds the line, you pull out all the stops and you produce the Hero unit for the bronze-age Greeks, Leonidas. 9-12 strength, 2-3 movement, +25% Defense when fortified (Spartan Phalanx), and some form of rally ability for units in a 2-block radius. With this hero unit, you hold your lines and slap down what your enemy throws at you, and then you drive forward through approaching Chariots and Horse Archers and eventually you take a city on the edge of their empire and you raze another, at the cost of the Hero's life. Though the hero is fallen, the intervention resonates throughout the rest of the game.

I think this could all work out with some balancing, some research, and some good old fashioned forum arguing.

 

[AlexanderIV]

I actually have a 25% finished mod like this. I quit it when I couldn't find art for the heroes. I can do XML, though I get side-tracked by life easily; you may have to hound me

Interesting. Tell me about it?

 

[topsecret]

It's all XML, so the heroes are just super UU's that are one-per-civ.

I lost the file apparently, and my memory's not that good, but here's an example:
Genghis Khaan - Mongol Hero
10
3
Can ranged attack - 7 strength.
Starts with Led by Warlord, Leadership, Combat VI.

 

[Voyhkah]

Some examples of mine:

Oba: Unique Hero for Benin. While alive, all cities with access to Bronze produce +3 culture/turn; all cities bronze spent produces +1 culture. When garrisoned in cities, foreign trade routes with ivory produce +50%, all luxury resources produce +1 gold when spent

Lief Erikson: Unique Hero for the Norse. 4 Strength. 2 Moves. cargo space (Carries ALL units), can move through oceans, cannot move more than (Depends on world size) tiles from allied territory

Hungarian Cannon: Unique Hero for the Ottomans: 6 Strength. 1 moves. +50% vs. Cities; can bombard city defenses (14%); nearby siege units do double bombardment damage; Causes collotoral damage (Max 5 Units)

Lewis & Clark: Not Unique Hero. 5 Strength. 2 Moves. Starts with Woodsman I & II, Guerrilla I & II. Ignores terrain movement costs. Can build forts (With Red Key's Super Forts, this is very powerful)

Roger's Rangers: Not Unique Hero. 12 Strength. 2 Moves. Starts with Woodsman I & II. Loses 10% strength per unit stacked with (Units with Woodsman I do not count), strength increases with distance from palace

 

[AlexanderIV]

Some examples of mine:

Oba: Unique Hero for Benin. While alive, all cities with access to Bronze produce +3 culture/turn; all cities bronze spent produces +1 culture. When garrisoned in cities, foreign trade routes with ivory produce +50%, all luxury resources produce +1 gold when spent

Lief Erikson: Unique Hero for the Norse. 4 Strength. 2 Moves. cargo space (Carries ALL units), can move through oceans, cannot move more than (Depends on world size) tiles from allied territory

Hungarian Cannon: Unique Hero for the Ottomans: 6 Strength. 1 moves. +50% vs. Cities; can bombard city defenses (14%); nearby siege units do double bombardment damage; Causes collotoral damage (Max 5 Units)

Lewis & Clark: Not Unique Hero. 5 Strength. 2 Moves. Starts with Woodsman I & II, Guerrilla I & II. Ignores terrain movement costs. Can build forts (With Red Key's Super Forts, this is very powerful)

Roger's Rangers: Not Unique Hero. 12 Strength. 2 Moves. Starts with Woodsman I & II. Loses 10% strength per unit stacked with (Units with Woodsman I do not count), strength increases with distance from palace

You've got some really nice ideas, for sure. I would still like to see the Heroes idea as a standalone component, the sort of thing you see other modders adding to their projects. Would you be interested in a collaborative-type-thing?

 

[AlexanderIV]

It's all XML, so the heroes are just super UU's that are one-per-civ.

I lost the file apparently, and my memory's not that good, but here's an example:
Genghis Khaan - Mongol Hero
10
3
Can ranged attack - 7 strength.
Starts with Led by Warlord, Leadership, Combat VI.

That's in the exact same vein as what I'm driving at. Though, certain ultra-unique abilities like Voyhkah's units have might be in order as well. If you're interested in necromancing this old idea, I'd be glad to work on the creative side of things.

 

[topsecret]

I can't do python (adding brand new concepts- like Roger's Rangers ability), but if you think some up I'll be able to start in 2 weeks. (Though I'll be gone in 3 weeks for a week, making it a month before I can fully work on this.)

 

[Dumanios]

Here's some ideas from the Special Forces mod.

Aztec Empire: Ahuitzotl(8 Strength Jaguar)
Egypt: Narmer(4 Strength Warrior with Bonus vs. Melee)
Ottoman Empire: Dardanelles Gun(Cannon, but at Gunpowder)
China: Liu Bei(8 Strength Swordsman with Morale), Lu Bu(8 Strength Axeman with Barrage I + II), Zheng He(Strengthened Caravel at Compass)
Japan: Toyotomi Hideyoshi(10 Strength Samurai), I-400(Submarine that can carry 2 Fighters), Yamato(45 Strength Battleship)
Russia: Georgy Zuhkov(32 Strength Tank)
Germany: Erwin Rommel(32 Strength Panzer), The Red Baron(Fighter with Ace available at Assembly Line), DKM Bismark(46 Strength Battleship)
Greece: The 300 Spartans(6 Strength Phalanx with a bonus vs. all mounted units), Theban Sacred Band(7 Strength Phalanx), Makedonian Hypastai(8 Strength Swordsman with Flanking I+II)
Rome: Legio X(10 Strength Legion with Morale), Scipio Africanis(9 Strength Legion with Bonus vs. Mounted)
Spain: Hernan Cortes(Knight with Large Bonus vs. Ancient units)
France: Imperial Guard(18 Strength Rifleman), Rene Fonck(Fighter with Ace available at Assembly Line)
Celtia: Vercingetorix(8 Strength Gallic Swordsman), William Wallace(10 Strength Maceman with Barrage I + II)
Britain: Arthur Wellesley(18 Strength Redcoat), HMS Victory(12 Strength SotL), Rats of Tobruk(25 Strength Infantry with Pinch)

 

[topsecret]

I'll work on this later and show you what I come up with.

 

[SamSniped]

And the USS Constitution, which I actually have the UnitInfo done, but nothing else (It's a frigate with +2 strength, IIRC). I'll upload it if you want.