Concerns regarding the Eureka mechanism

[stealth_nsk]

Guaranteed is that you get some random ones each time you play.

Yes, but different ones. And you may have to adopt your strategy to them. That's part of the idea.

 

[demidyad]

Yes, if you randomly find one medieval tech is 50% cheaper than the others, that's working as intended. In the current game do you go for the one that's magically 50% cheaper, or the stronger one you'd normally go for? The whole point is to mix up strategies, to combat beelining as has been said, to make each game unique based on the map around you and the gameplay it generates.

I agree if there's one like "Create 2 crossbowmen" that's well into the medieval era and you'd almost certainly have 2 crossbowmen by that point in all games, it should be changed, but I can guarantee a lot of the eurekas are going to be tweaked and changed, they've always said that the final 6 months of developing civ is focused on balancing, balancing, balancing.

 

[Fourmi1]

Yep, but Eurekas are not really something made to be a challenge. When they firstly explained Eurekas, they said something like: "If you found a city on the coast, your people start to ask themselves questions about water and how to use it and tame it"; "When you fight waves of barbarians, your people start looking for better weapons to ensure they survival"; "When you meet another civ for the first time, your government express the strong will to communicate without the need of leaving the empire"...
So imho, Eurekas and Inspirations are made to create a logic between your experience in the game and the tech you'll unlock (because if you never thought on how you could use water or never expressed the need to have better weapons, it'll be harder to get these progresses).
However, on the gameplay side, I have to admit that some Eurekas are not even a little challenging, so a great idea could be (for those who require a number of units, kills, camp destroyed, etc) an increasing bonus (10%, 20%, 40% for instance)...

 

[Ryika]

So imho, Eurekas and Inspirations are made to create a logic between your experience in the game and the tech you'll unlock

But is that really the case with anything other than the early water ones? Most of the requirements are extremely generic, and those that are not require such low investment that literally anybody could get them. That's not "learning by living", that's just doing a bit of everything to get massive tech cost decreases.

Well, at least that's how it looks to me currently.

 

[Fourmi1]

Yep, 'sadly' you're true. Except for a few ones, Eurekas are not very deep, I wish they could change some during the balancing phase...

 

[Socrates99]

But is that really the case with anything other than the early water ones? Most of the requirements are extremely generic, and those that are not require such low investment that literally anybody could get them. That's not "learning by living", that's just doing a bit of everything to get massive tech cost decreases.

Well, at least that's how it looks to me currently.

Some of the resource based ones are like the water ones too. You won't always be able to build a quarry, mine a resource etc. before their respective Eurekas would matter.

The land unit and exploration ones seem like the ones you'd stumble into doing automatically most often. They still require actively doing something though.

I do feel like the Eureka system favors REX strategies the most. They'll be able to snag more of the geographically based Eurekas than those who favor less expansion. No skin off my back because I like expanding but it might cause some grumbling among some players.

 

[Captain Queeg]

Maybe if you change the name from "eureka" to "field testing", and change the focus accordingly.

Then you could change the "bonus" condition to a requirement, for example you couldn't complete crossbows unless you have x kills by archers, or you can't complete sailing until you have a developed tile on a watercourse. Maybe you could add a condition that (in some cases) the requirement has to take place after the tech research starts.

 

[apocalypse105]

I agree you need invest in these decission to get a eureka some things are just way to easy .

 

[smartcanuck1988]

I still feel Eurekas should only give you the first half of the tech regardless of your actual progress in that tech. If you made 30% progress, then gaining the Eureka will only provide 20%. If you're already beyond 50%, well too bad it's too late, maybe work on the next Eureka.

I won't know how easy or hard to time the Eurekas. On paper they look easy (own 3 tanks for e.g.), but with many other competing interests in the late game, this might not be a straightforward thing. Certainly from marbz videos, and he was actively working on timing his Eurekas, it was still difficult to boost everything.

 

[apocalypse105]

I still feel Eurekas should only give you the first half of the tech regardless of your actual progress in that tech. If you made 30% progress, then gaining the Eureka will only provide 20%. If you're already beyond 50%, well too bad it's too late, maybe work on the next Eureka.

I won't know how easy or hard to time the Eurekas. On paper they look easy (own 3 tanks for e.g.), but with many other competing interests in the late game, this might not be a straightforward thing. Certainly from marbz videos, and he was actively working on timing his Eurekas, it was still difficult to boost everything.

Depends how long it takes to built districts and buildings and so on..

 

[smartcanuck1988]

Exactly. So while it may sound easy to achieve these Eurekas the key element is the timing; to get it before you need it. So my reasoning to make eurekas only for the first half of tech narrows that window slightly more so the eurekas become slightly harder to achieve for maximum benefit even if the actual requirement is easy on paper.